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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

New Variant and Impact on children

169 replies

Ohbabybab · 01/01/2021 22:15

As MNHQ are looking in to the other poster on this topic I am starting a new thread for this discussion. They will be able to see I’m a long term poster so no reason to delete.

OP posts:
TillysMum02 · 01/01/2021 22:56

The deleted thread had a paediatric nurse day no kids in her hospital, but someone called her out and doubted she was a nurse at all

Who knows

Lumene · 01/01/2021 22:56

No conspiracy, this is a parenting site, of course you're allowed to discuss it, all we ask is that you do so with due regards to the truth. Mumsnet is justifiably well known for our members ability to interrogate research and to have a good poke at newspaper articles.

It is indeed. Hoorah for mumsnet.

IloveJKRowling · 01/01/2021 22:56

@inquietant thanks that was a useful read.

What I don't understand is this: it seems to me there is a lot we don't know about the new variant, not surprising as it's new and not enough time for loads of careful scientific study. If people are concerned about a potentially greater impact on children (which it doesn't have to be more severe to create if it simply infects more children, which so far the data supports - see the Imperial study linked above) they're told it's 'scaremongering'.

But given how fast this pandemic is moving, and given how fast the variant is spreading, why are those insisting that this new variant poses no more risk than before not doing the opposite of scaremongering? Minimising? The problem is, minimising and assuming the best could have far more potentially catastrophic consequences than accepting we don't know enough and being precautionary.

We don't know either way. Stating definitively that there is absolutely no way on earth this could affect children more is being equally as reckless as saying the opposite.

MN should be allowing this debate. We've been lied to by the government many times on this. They told us schools were 'safe' or 'covid secure', but before Xmas school aged children were the most infected group of society. It flies in the face of the science the world over to say that congregating inside in large groups with no social distancing and no masks is 'safe'.

With the new variant it seems clear to me that we simply don't know yet. But we need to find out, we need to do the studies, crunch the numbers and talk about it. With transparency. At the start of the pandemic the WHO said one of the most important things in dealing well with sars-cov-2 was transparency. Something the UK has failed at again and again.

I hope MN will allow a little more transparency on this topic as they do on others... just let people talk. Let people look at any available information and make up their own minds so they can make the best informed decisions for their own children.

umpteennamechanges · 01/01/2021 22:56

@IloveJKRowling

Hearsay is allowed in pretty much all other threads. So why not here?

On the schools threads, it was all anecdata from teachers etc. They were proved right (again and again and again).

When you're in the middle of a rapidly evolving pandemic, listening to all sources seems reasonable (whilst obviously giving greater weight to peer reviewed science, say, but that takes months and months to appear).

It seems to me that if the new variant infects children in greater numbers then more children will be badly affected - it's a numbers game - even if the disease is no more inherently harmful. The more people infected the more will get very ill in absolute terms (even if the proportion stays the same) - that's why we have so many in hospital now.

But I am confused because there have been reports that the new variant may give rise to higher viral load and it's been well established that higher viral load leads to more severe disease. www.thelancet.com/journals/lanres/article/PIIS2213-2600(20)30354-4/fulltext

My best guess at the moment is that basically we don't know enough about the new variant to know the answers to the many questions yet (whether it's more or less harmful to any age group, whether social distancing and masks still work as well as before etc etc).

Personally, given we seem to be operating without much knowledge I'm inclined to be precautionary when it comes to my children.

This pretty much sums up where I am on this.

I'd like to be clearer on the impact of the new variant before I send my DC back to school.

KeysDontBelongInTheFridge · 01/01/2021 22:57

@MushMonster I think so many people did. That’s why reading articles like the one wrote in The Telegraph are always so worrying; I now no longer know what to believe. It was downplayed before and what if it’s being downplayed now? Really wish this government was more transparent, as it would help with so many peoples anxieties around the pandemic.

urkidding · 01/01/2021 22:58

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55406939
This is being investigated, but as the children have been mixing more, it would be difficult to sort out whether it is the new virus or that younger children are not wearing masks in public places, and teenagers seem to see it as a dare to go into shops and buses without masks.

Satsumatrifle · 01/01/2021 22:58

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

KeysDontBelongInTheFridge · 01/01/2021 22:58

@IloveJKRowling Totally agree

Achristmaspudsskidu · 01/01/2021 23:00

Hearsay is allowed in pretty much all other threads

Definitely.

Didn’t ‘loss of smell/taste’ start off as hearsay and anecdotal accounts. These things should be discussed and shared.

Witchend · 01/01/2021 23:02

[quote covetingthepreciousthings]I cant find the telegraph article

Presume I'm allowed to post a link to this since it's main stream news..

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/01/01/covid-wards-full-children-first-time-pandemic-warn-nurses/[/quote]
If that link's correct, it's now showing a broken link for me now.

If it's been removed, that makes me far more worried than otherwise.

Fortherosesjoni70 · 01/01/2021 23:02

OMG!!!

covetingthepreciousthings · 01/01/2021 23:03

If it's been removed, that makes me far more worried than otherwise

Just checked and it's been removed Confused

Fortherosesjoni70 · 01/01/2021 23:03

At first i couldnt find it no matter how much i googled despite finding it without a link straight away.
That is now even more worrying.

Elephant4 · 01/01/2021 23:03

I think Mumsnet HQ deleting posts causes more drama and draws more attention than if they just left stuff to be discussed.

I'd usually have a glance at this stuff and let it pass me by - but the worry of MN blocking discussion has alerted me more now.

DfE are messaging us through MNHQ - who in the government is more involved in these message boards than they should be? Is MN being bribed/paid to feed us certain information and block others?

It's troubling.

ofwarren · 01/01/2021 23:04

The telegraph have taken the story down from the London Nurse....

Ohbabybab · 01/01/2021 23:04

The 5live tweet seems to be still there. An understanding for the retraction from The Telegraph would be good to know

OP posts:
Satsumatrifle · 01/01/2021 23:04

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

TillysMum02 · 01/01/2021 23:05

This can’t just be a case of shutting primaries and nurseries

Kids will be in all the ‘essential’ shops again for something to do. Touching everything, no masks

I’m hoping our company will put something in place to protect us ( retail)

Jenasaurus · 01/01/2021 23:05

,

covetingthepreciousthings · 01/01/2021 23:05

twitter.com/bbc5live/status/1345006866829463552?s=21

Tweet with audio clip is still there though..
The matron is named and the previous article named her hospital.. so I'd have thought it would have been verified by someone.. but maybe it wasn't. This is all very odd !

Thepastcatchesupwithyou · 01/01/2021 23:05

I have tried to read the telegraph article but it appears to have been taken down. Does anyone have link that works or what was written in it ?

Ohbabybab · 01/01/2021 23:07

mobile.twitter.com/bbc5live/status/1345006866829463552

OP posts:
Tootletum · 01/01/2021 23:07

OK well given we would know by now if the new variant was causing any difference to disease severity (rather than prevalence), we simply have the observation that it is more infectious. Which we've known about for a few weeks now. So what new? The imperial quotes specifically outline all the many caveats to the data. All it tells us is there appear to be more transmissions in under 19s. The reason for this may be because everything other than schools was shut. What it just doesn't suggest is any increase in severity in those age groups, and posting hosptial admission stats for kids proves nothing unless we're seeing huge absolute increases in admissions over the five year average. Which we're not. What the hell is the point of all the fear and panic?? Read this guy on twitter, actual scientist who is looking at facts, not jumping on the latest hot take. twitter.com/BallouxFrancois?s=09

Ohbabybab · 01/01/2021 23:07

This is the original tweet

OP posts:
TillysMum02 · 01/01/2021 23:08

I just have a screenshot of the headline

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