Oxford vaccine

[Thehairyqueenofscots]

Been told at work we will be getting this at next round of vaccinations. It always seems to be high regarded on here so I'm quite pleased about this. Would you have a preference or not bothered?

If my neighbour who lives alone and works from home was part of the trial and got the real vaccine while my friend across the road with the dozen or so strong blended family where all the adults are key workers was in the placebo group this would skew the results somewhat

I am in Phase 2 of the Oxford trial, and recruitment was specifically from hospital staff for this reason. 'Unfortunately', this was at the start of the summer though and coincided with PPE being readily available so cases fell. It's why volunteers were recruited in Brazil; they needed somewhere with a higher rate of cases / transmission.

😂😂😂 ladies I’m peeing my pants at the assumptions on here. I neither work for Pfizer nor am I anti vax. I’m merely a (pretty) well educated mum and member of s”Society who was taught to think critically and enjoys science. I think the way to engage with the public re vaccination is transparency and one thing the Oxford Trial has not been is transparent. I also use these real life examples we’re all living through to educate my daughters in critical thinking. No more, no less.

Ps I’m secretly waiting for the Durham Vaccine.

How can it be transparent when the data isn’t published yet? The MHRA are the only ones able to access all of the data before a license is granted. In normal times a company generally wouldn’t release anything before the license applications.
Critical thinking is fine but you seem to have overlooked quite a lot of things relating to these vaccines.

@raviolidreaming

If my neighbour who lives alone and works from home was part of the trial and got the real vaccine while my friend across the road with the dozen or so strong blended family where all the adults are key workers was in the placebo group this would skew the results somewhat

I am in Phase 2 of the Oxford trial, and recruitment was specifically from hospital staff for this reason. 'Unfortunately', this was at the start of the summer though and coincided with PPE being readily available so cases fell. It's why volunteers were recruited in Brazil; they needed somewhere with a higher rate of cases / transmission.

It wasn’t restricted to hospital staff. Anyone could volunteer but they wanted people who had higher exposure risk. All frontline nhs were encouraged to apply

@BungleandGeorge transparency means not manipulating press releases to join the 90% club when you know full well your data doesn’t support the 90% Club. Not a lot to ask really particularly in a time of vaccine hesitancy.

@Oaktree55

😂😂😂 ladies I’m peeing my pants at the assumptions on here. I neither work for Pfizer nor am I anti vax. I’m merely a (pretty) well educated mum and member of s”Society who was taught to think critically and enjoys science. I think the way to engage with the public re vaccination is transparency and one thing the Oxford Trial has not been is transparent. I also use these real life examples we’re all living through to educate my daughters in critical thinking. No more, no less.

Ps I’m secretly waiting for the Durham Vaccine.

What’s your view on the adverse effects on two people with the Pfizer vaccine? Was this a fault in the Pfizer trials? Not thorough enough protocol? Why wasn’t this possibility uncovered by the trial?

@sashagabadon I don’t know (and I’m not medically qualified). From what I’ve read, Pfizer contraindicated their vaccine for those with significant allergies. I don’t understand why two people with epi pens were vaccinated. From what I’ve read re the allergen, the educated guess is it’s Polyethylene glycol. If you research most drugs/vaccines a v small proportion of people do have allergic reactions, PEG is apparently in Nurofen Express for example so it doesn’t bother me personally. The adverse events with Oxford do have a potential biological basis re the vaccine type, although the adverse events are as yet obviously ruled unconnected. Tricky. No one knows but that’s the point we just don’t know (yet). I’d rather the more efficacious vaccine with the less adverse events.

Oh and to finish my two pence worth. We’re all (expert and lay) watching science real time, warts and all. I sense there are a few GP’s on here. If they’re good GP’s they’ll admit this isn’t their area of expertise either. Rather than rail road public into “compliance” educated debate is preferable. We are all educated enough to know (hopefully) that unless this is our specialism it’s an evolving situation, however bad science (Oxford) is bad science full stop.

I have pinned all my hopes on the vaccine ,been very isolated all year as dd (15) and I both have auto immune disease and it hasn’t been clear how Covid might affect that. Hoped that a vaccine would mean we could stop worrying but as I carry Epipens it seems not. I wonder if the other vaccines will be the same.

@SirVixofVixHall don’t lose heart there are highly regarded vaccines such as Novavax coming forward. Do your own reading. A quick search in Twitter leads to reputable/verifiable experts. There will be vaccines suitable and effective for everyone. My personal but bear is being railroaded into one type because it’s “cheap”.

[quote Oaktree55]@BungleandGeorge transparency means not manipulating press releases to join the 90% club when you know full well your data doesn’t support the 90% Club. Not a lot to ask really particularly in a time of vaccine hesitancy.[/quote]
I do agree with you there they shouldn’t have released anything. I wonder if that was a choice or whether they were put under pressure to do so

I think in the end that elderly and vulnerable will get Pfizer and the rest will get oxford... Seems the most sensible way to go about it.

@BungleandGeorge just my opinion no facts to back this up think it’s pure arrogance. I follow a few of the Oxford crowd and mates of the Oxford lot (involved in vaccine). Total arrogance even when confronted with their obvious errors. Oxford isn’t know for its humility 🤣

Thank you so much Oaktree55 your post made me teary eyed, think it has all suddenly got to me as it is almost a year since we first started worrying about the virus (I have relatives in the far East so they were my concern initially) .
I feel a bit worn out by the stress and not being able to go anywhere or see friends for so long, as I am sure we all do.

I’m not a GP, I’m not particularly swayed towards any of the vaccines at the moment either. I think it’s absolutely possible that one of the contenders we’ve heard less about might turn out to be the best option

Honestly please read up. That’s all my (aggressive) posts are trying to prompt people to do. Not on Mumsnet but on forums where posters link their credentials and places of work and back up their expertise. There will be many vaccines and I’m just frustrated the U.K. is trying to “save the world” and in fact possibly selling us a dudd. However the best vaccines will prevail and it will be ok. Read up there’s real excitement over the good ones especially Novavax which I believe U.K. has secured doses of. It’ll be ok just stay informed (and not on here 😂). I’d give my right/left arm for Pfizer personally 🎉

@Oaktree55 I have read up thank you which is why I am perfectly aware of the fact that it will be a mixture of vaccines, that Pfizer on it own isnt going to solve the issue (would take too long and has too many issues with cost and delivery and that efficacy is not the be all and end. Other than that I agree with you

As I have said to other posters bias (which you so clearly have against the Oxford Vaccine) works against any posts you make - that and a clear bias towards efficacy - which is certainly the higher the better but no the be all and end all. Take the bias out and people will listen far more

I’d say a fair proportion of posters here have got more than a passing knowledge! I really think you need to wait for published evidence to draw a conclusion though

I think the U.K. has bought nova ax and actually hopes to manufacture it in Teeside( which incidentally I think they hope will become an expert centre in vaccines for the future which will be great for the north) but I also read in the Times that novavax is same “tech” as the GSK vaccine which has just been paused due to lack of efficacy in older people.
It’s good the U.K. is buying a variety of vaccines including Pfizer and Oxford too as so many can fail completely ( see uni of Auckland in Australia, just halted their trials)
We are lucky to have a few that do have efficacy even if not completely perfect.

I would prefer not to have it as there have been no long term trials. Not worth the risk.

@Userzzz which vaccine has had long term trials that showed something, out of interest? Since you appear to be claiming higher expertise than Sarah Gilbert. Be v interested to hear your take on what a long enough trial is

Rather than try and pick apart our faceless /anonymous/meaningless posts, this guy is a great start for anyone interested in expert opinion on Covid vaccines etc give him a follow he takes time to explain to lay and is a leader in his field.

mobile.twitter.com/florian_krammer

I would prefer not to have it as there have been no long term trials. Not worth the risk.

COVID has only been around for a year. You do realise that's why there are no long term trials.
On the same note, we don't know the long term effects of COVID. The initial and medium term are pretty horrific though. 2,700 deaths every day in the USA just now!
We can guess what the long term effects of lockdown will be. What the long term effects to people's mental health, general health, finances, education, the economy.

But why don't we all wait another five years or so for long term trial results. Yes. That's a great idea. I for one am up for that. 🤦‍♀️

Or alternatively do a sensible risk assessment, do some proper research and get the vaccine when you are offered it as it is your social responsibility and the only way out of this mess

@bloodpressureboiling

do a sensible risk assessment

Yes

do some proper research

Yes

get the vaccine when you are offered it as it is your social responsibility

At the moment it is not proven that any of the vaccines stop transmission. So everyone should have a Covid vaccine or not based on their own risk solely. There is no social responsibility to speak of at present.

@trulydelicious
At the moment it is not proven that any of the vaccines stop transmission. So everyone should have a Covid vaccine or not based on their own risk solely. There is no social responsibility to speak of at present.

I agree with you that getting the vaccine just is almost a guarantee that you will be ok, but surely as a result of that, if enough of the population comply then it ultimately leads to herd immunity. Surely that's the ultimate aim? Is that not a social responsibility?