Government denial over schools issues will cause deaths this Christmas

[noblegiraffe]

I just can't get my head around how utterly crazy the government Christmas policy is.

Secondary school kids are the most infected subset of the population with it now estimated that more than 1 in 50 of them are positive. As they are children, most of them will never be tested as they either are asymptomatic, or will display different symptoms to the main three that are required to trigger a test (councils are overruling this in some parts of England and asking parents to use a more sensible list of symptoms).

Schools mostly break up on 18th December, 5 days before the Christmas relaxation period begins and people start taking advantage of this to mix with other households indoors, in poorly ventilated small rooms, which as scientists warn, is a terrible idea. twitter.com/devisridhar/status/1331931594400149506?s=21

Closing schools a week earlier (or moving online) would give 2 weeks out of school before Christmas day, which would reduce the infection rate in school children significantly (we saw a dip in the infection rate just in one week over half term) and make it safer for them to mix with other households, particularly if people took advantage of those two weeks to significantly reduce their contacts and other risks.

Some schools took it upon themselves to protect their own communities by changing the term dates to close a week earlier. The DfE has overruled this and forced them to stay open.
schoolsweek.co.uk/overruled-dfes-sweeping-coronavirus-powers-force-trust-into-early-christmas-holiday-u-turn/

Because of the tier system, if families don't get together at Christmas during the relaxation period, when their children pose a much higher risk, they will not be able to see their families properly for Christmas at all. Essentially Christmas is being funnelled into a time period which is insanely risky due to it coming shortly after children mixing freely in unsafe schools with significant numbers of undiscovered infections.

I know the DfE have been reading this board. I understand why you want schools open, but lying to people about the risks as you have is dangerous and immoral. Transparency is needed so that people can make their own informed risk assessments, not propaganda about 'safe schools' and 'saving Christmas'.

There is a third choice that they can keep the schools open until right before Christmas but not go back for at least two weeks after the 27th.

True. But that wouldn't protect the elderly at Christmas and the hospital admissions.

"My ds won't be mixing but he obviously has no control over the rest of his bubble of 240."
Exactly, which is why all those people posting what they want for their own specific set of circumstances is pretty irrelevant. None of us is an island, and everyone's actions have a wider impact.

The trouble is that, if schools close, a great many teens will just meet up at the shops or skatepark.

Family getogethers over Christmas are the height of stupidity, surpassed only by getting students back to Uni in Jan if they don't need to have face to face practical work.

We plan to stay home and shop locally.

There is a third choice that they can keep the schools open until right before Christmas but not go back for at least two weeks after the 27th.

That's assuming nobody gathers for New Year's Eve which is as risky as Xmas imo as there's often booze and hugging after midnight involved...

"Choice A - Close schools one week early to avoid community spread of covid."

Do you think people will be self isolating for that week or will they be starting Christmas early?

True. But that wouldn't protect the elderly at Christmas and the hospital admissions.

The elderly and their families can also choose to protect themselves.

This is why we won't see anyone until the 30th December. If we isolate for two weeks and my family isolate for over two weeks we might be ok.

I contacted my MP saying I would support schools closing early or the option of pupils being able to home school for a week or two.

You'd have to be crazy to visit family only a week after schools close. Safer to wait until new year.

There is a petition running currently, I've signed it

Link here

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/549015

@IceCreamAndCandyfloss

Well said Noble.

I think they should go remote on the 9th until the end of term and for two weeks after the break to ensure all the mixing and spreading is isolate before being taken into schools to spread more. January will undoubtedly be awful case wise and worse as so many plan to mix and with older relatives too.

I def think this is the best option and would make such a difference to January. My DS school who have offered remote learning for the last week, to allow a 2-week gap before Christmas. Only 4 parents out of 45 have said they would like to do this. I was really surprised there wasn't a greater take up.

Meglet and Korean have you thought about keeping your dc off for the week early?

They could be SI. And it would remove the risk.

This is why we won't see anyone until the 30th December. If we isolate for two weeks and my family isolate for over two weeks we might be ok.

That depends on what tier you are in?

I agree but the answer is not to change anything around schools but to lock down over Christmas instead. SO many idiots who seem to think that having granny over for a party is more important than the GC's education.

@megletthesecond

This is why we won't see anyone until the 30th December. If we isolate for two weeks and my family isolate for over two weeks we might be ok.

I contacted my MP saying I would support schools closing early or the option of pupils being able to home school for a week or two.

You'd have to be crazy to visit family only a week after schools close. Safer to wait until new year.

We're going to be tier 3, if we're still tier 3 or even tier 2 after Christmas we won't be able to see anyone (indoors at least)

& doing that could add to the schools being a nightmare mid January onwards. Such a difficult one isn't it.

They should stop fines now and for January at keast.
Let those that need to remove dc do it. Due to self isolate period most work is now on line.

Keep them working but at home. This will naturally filter out school population.

Re on line provison, I'd like evidence of schools being proactive and asking their pupils what tech they have.. Secondly then asking other parents if anyone has anything spare.

As well as the gov providing tech and WiFi and dongles. I've not been asked by our secondary school what tech we have, and our school excuse for not going on line was because the gov gave them one lap top?.. How do they know that lap top was needed however if they never did an audit.

Woeful.

Dd emailed teachers and waited weeks for a reply to on line work. Yet other schools moments away got online with free Google home with one day.

They used Google meet and Google hangout and pupils many of them listening on their phones to lessons and doing class work when the family lap top was free. Or on their phone.

marsha tbh yes, but we're always on our own at Xmas anyway so I'm not bothered about Xmas day itself. I know my mum hopes we can figure out something by new year. We'll see.

I agree but the answer is not to change anything around schools

Are you sure about that?

Regardless of Christmas, we desperately need to change what is happening in schools.

our school excuse for not going on line was because the gov gave them one lap top?.. How do they know that lap top was needed however if they never did an audit.

Ruby schools did do audits of tech and made requests of the government. The government then decided that schools didn't need that much tech at all (based on the assumption that schools were already swimming in tech - a laughable assumption) and gave them only a fraction of what was requested.

noble we're currently 2 and so are my family. All down south. Who knows if that will change though.

Wow! Look at that dip linked to half term. If that isn’t evidence that something needs to be done in schools I don’t know what is! That’s actually shocking.

Meglet fair enough.

As an aside I don’t think anyone should feel bad if they are planning to do Christmas with someone at very high risk to keep dc home if they want to.

It will take SI though for the week as part of that decision which can be hard work.

People will look back at our attitude to schools when they are studying the pandemic in the future and wonder what the fuck we were thinking

I’d support school switching to remote to stop a Xmas spike provided we can sure to get some online teaching.
During lockdown 1 it was dire.
I could t even get answers to emails from school or class teachers about my foster children.

The big issue in terms of closing schools is that if you set a precedent, I doubt they would reopen before April

It’s very difficult to take anything else someone posts seriously when they write things like this.

NI managed an extra week at half term, didn’t they? Are they closed now till Easter?

Wales did remote learning for a week after half-term for y9+ too

Government have talked about risk at Christmas. Whitty certainly has.

Whitty isn't government, but it is certainly easy to make that mistake.

Whitty and SAGE must be behind-the-scenes furious about this shitshow. They wanted schools to be included in the current lockdown, so they know they're a transmission risk. They'll know the impact that the Christmas relaxation will have when those school kids are mixing with extended family.