Government denial over schools issues will cause deaths this Christmas

[noblegiraffe]

I just can't get my head around how utterly crazy the government Christmas policy is.

Secondary school kids are the most infected subset of the population with it now estimated that more than 1 in 50 of them are positive. As they are children, most of them will never be tested as they either are asymptomatic, or will display different symptoms to the main three that are required to trigger a test (councils are overruling this in some parts of England and asking parents to use a more sensible list of symptoms).

Schools mostly break up on 18th December, 5 days before the Christmas relaxation period begins and people start taking advantage of this to mix with other households indoors, in poorly ventilated small rooms, which as scientists warn, is a terrible idea. twitter.com/devisridhar/status/1331931594400149506?s=21

Closing schools a week earlier (or moving online) would give 2 weeks out of school before Christmas day, which would reduce the infection rate in school children significantly (we saw a dip in the infection rate just in one week over half term) and make it safer for them to mix with other households, particularly if people took advantage of those two weeks to significantly reduce their contacts and other risks.

Some schools took it upon themselves to protect their own communities by changing the term dates to close a week earlier. The DfE has overruled this and forced them to stay open.
schoolsweek.co.uk/overruled-dfes-sweeping-coronavirus-powers-force-trust-into-early-christmas-holiday-u-turn/

Because of the tier system, if families don't get together at Christmas during the relaxation period, when their children pose a much higher risk, they will not be able to see their families properly for Christmas at all. Essentially Christmas is being funnelled into a time period which is insanely risky due to it coming shortly after children mixing freely in unsafe schools with significant numbers of undiscovered infections.

I know the DfE have been reading this board. I understand why you want schools open, but lying to people about the risks as you have is dangerous and immoral. Transparency is needed so that people can make their own informed risk assessments, not propaganda about 'safe schools' and 'saving Christmas'.

I am not asking about Sage.

I am simply stating the fact that the NEU called.for primary schools to close.

#closetheschools isn't really just secondary schools is it.

Let's deal with fact here and not ignore what the unions have called for.

And 30% reduction with schools open

Still not relieved?

I am. So many posting it couldn’t happen.

@Welcometonowhere

I’m lost as to what you’re getting annoyed about judas, tbh.

I didn’t comment on that because what’s to say? Well done him? Good job? Every school should have that?

I’m not annoyed. I’m interested in what your agenda is though. You don’t want schools to close. Neither do I. Neither does OP. We would like them made safer though. So, as seen as you ask, no, I don’t expect you to give him a virtual pat on the back. I would, however, like to know if you think that that HT, spending GBP20k of school budget he can’t really spare, to make his school safer for students, teachers and therefore, the wider community, should have that funded by the government? And if yes, do you think all secondary schools should get the same? The total would be a drop in the ocean for the Treasury at the moment. Or do you think that he was wrong in spending that money, and no, he shouldn’t get that funded by the government?

NEU will be remembered for close the schools

Their moment on SM getting attention

Let's deal with fact here and not ignore what the unions have called for.

Schools to be included in lockdown to make it more effective, in agreement with SAGE.

Schools weren't included in the lockdown and infection rates in secondary schools continue to rise along with closures, part closures and absences. 0.9 million kids unable to leave the house.

What do you propose to do about the dreadful situation in secondary schools?

Schools to be included in lockdown to make it more effective, in agreement with SAGE.

It has been effective

Marsha the NEU played right into the governments hands with this.

Major own goal!

Actually I’d like to replace the word agenda as that sounds accusatory and I didn’t intend it to be...so I’m interested in your perspective....

noble i'm not talking about secondary schools.

I don't have children at secondary schools.

I would like them to be safer and I think therenis justification for local closures on online learning at times.

But I want to know why the NEU wanted to close primary schools.

And how the NEU expect a rota system to work on primary schools after lockdown.

It has been effective

In Tier 1 are you?

I'm not in the NEU and don't support their plans for blended learning because as often said, I want schools to be safer. However, as things get worse and worse, I'm not sure the situation is easily retrievable. Mass testing should be implemented ASAP.

What do people who seem to want to bang an anti-union drum propose as their solution to the terrible situation in secondary schools?

What reduction would you start talking about positively?

It’s 30%

I don’t consider I have an agenda, just an opinion. My opinion is that closing schools again is too damaging. I was fully in support of the first lockdown, but I can’t deny the impact it had.

Should that HT have the money funded by the government? I’m not sure, tbh. And before anyone jumps down my throat, ‘not sure’ genuinely means not sure, as in I’m not saying yes absolutely but I’m also not saying absolutely not. I think just as in general I am probably on the side of having individual autonomy and families able to make the judgement themselves as to whether to withdraw their child or not, this also applies to individual schools and the choices they make. We all know there are schools and schools, from crammed 70s buildings to open spacious new academies and they won’t all need or should have the same things. IME flinging money at problems rarely solves them.

So I certainly don’t think he was wrong. I think he made a decision that suited his school. But I’m not totally sure as to whether that should be government funded.

Cross post Judas

@MarshaBradyo

Schools to be included in lockdown to make it more effective, in agreement with SAGE.

It has been effective

Not very effective in my school @MarshaBradyo. We have closed to all years for the second time since half term due to staffing levels.

Since the 3rd week in Sept there hasn’t been a time when all years have been in.

The atmosphere in school is terrible. Everyone - teachers and pupils - are constantly on edge.

@MarshaBradyo

What reduction would you start talking about positively?

It’s 30%

And secondary schools are still fucked and I still can't see my parents.

So excuse me for not throwing a ticker-tape parade as my situation continues to get worse.

The government have been very clear that social distancing is not necessary or appropriate in schools.

So a headteacher trying to implement their own social distancing protocols will rightly not have them funded by the government.

Motherrunner I know some have been hit hard and I can see that is very stressful

But 3 week lockdown with schools open at 30% reduction, up to 50% in NE and NW is working.

No we are not going to emerge after three weeks at tier 1 (silly suggestion) not even Melbourne achieved that with lower cases and longer harsher lockdown.

So no not all schools should have been closed as NEU wanted.

I would prefer local approach.

A local approach makes sense if part of the lock down is to force people to stay in their own geographical areas.

Less so if people are going to travel across the country as they've now been given permission to do so for five days over Xmas.

The government have been very clear that social distancing is not necessary or appropriate in schools.

Ah. That will no doubt be why we have 5 Year Groups out of our secondary school currently. Because social distancing wasn't necessary in schools.

So no not all schools should have been closed as NEU wanted.

As SAGE wanted. Do you keep bashing them for that?

It is both necessary and appropriate. They just cba to fund it.

@noblegiraffe

So no not all schools should have been closed as NEU wanted.

As SAGE wanted. Do you keep bashing them for that?

Well it doesn’t fill me with confidence re their suggestions no.

But I do trust Whitty generally and am not up on detail of their recommendation

noble I am far from anti Union. If I had the chance I would pay my dues. Dh is in a large union, although its tempting to stop being a member since the leader just spouts a load of shite and can't seem to be got rid of (apologies for my language)

As mentioned I would prefer changes in secondary schools.

Mask wearing at all times is a small one.

I'm not sure mass testing is feasible, but it may be possible to test a sample of pupils in schools regularly to identify asymptomatic pupils. A higher than normal number could possibly trigger further testing and circuit breaker if bad enough.

I don't like to suggest blended learning and rotas as I don't know the impact on older children but in some areas it could maybe be considered at least short term.

Additional resources to ensure that all pupils have devices and suitable Internet connection.

Let vulberable families take their children out of school without loss of school place.

Possibly at a local authority level, these pupils could have a full online timetable (don't know how feasible that it).

As I said, I don't know much about secondary schools and its over 20 years since I left mine.

So some of my suggestions might be pretty shit.