To be weary of the vaccines?

[PunkyPirate]

Will you be getting it?

Will you be allowing your children to get it?

I'm curious to peoples responses as my social media seems to be full of posts from people mocking those who will get the vaccine.

I'm by no means an anti Vaxer. Myself and my children have had all vaccinations and have the flu jab yearly. My only worry is that not enough is known about the long term side effects.

The ill-educated won’t get it.
It’s a Darwinian thing.
If you’re not a twat (or obviously have a specific medical condition which makes vaccines problematic) the you’ll get the vaccine.

I love how the pro-covid vaccine posters are so damned rude to those of us who may decide not to get it. People have different opinions believe it or not, there really is no need to be so rude or insulting is there?
For what it's worth I'm very well educated, thanks.

[quote Sunshinegirl82]@kifomadertonasomc

Are you aware of how a double blind trial for a vaccine works? I'll use hypothetical figures.

10,000 people have the new vaccine, 10,000 people have the placebo. Neither the scientists nor the participants know who has had what. You wait until among the 20,000 participants a predetermined number of people catch the disease the vaccine is trying to protect against (100, 150 etc confirmed infections). Then you unblind the trial and you hope that the majority of the people who caught the disease are in the placebo group.

How long does the trial take? How long is a piece of string? How long does it take for 150 out of 20,000 people to catch meningitis? Or mumps? Or HPV? Sometimes quite a long time. In an epidemic where the virus is rife? Not that long. There is no fixed time scale.[/quote]
Yes, I knew all of that. I still don't know the answer to my question though, and I'm guessing you don't either.

But as you said, it's presumably much longer on average than the trials have been for this vaccine. By very nature of the circumstances. So most vaccines at the time of being rolled out have more data on long-term effects than this one. That was kind of my point.

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/ng-interactive/2020/nov/21/stephen-collins-on-covid-19-vaccine-trials-cartoon

I will have it as soon as I am offered. I don't expect it to be offered to my DC.

I respect people's right to refuse but it gets really tricky if lots of vulnerable / elderly people refuse though. The rest of can't reasonably be expected to keep living like this to protect the vulnerable when a vaccine is available.

I volunteered for the Oxford vaccine trials, along with a group of friends who have connections with that team. I was ruled out on ground of age (sigh) but look forward to the jab , as soon as it becomes available.

Yes, I'll be queueing up. I work in pharma & understand the process. I will partly do it to help people like a family member who won't be able to have it & is extremely vulnerable. The thought that we could have a proper free summer next year is the only thing keeping me going.

It's a shame that people are so scared of having this vaccine. No amount of explaining the process and tests will convince them otherwise. Social media and scare mongering has a lot to answer for.

@kifomadertonasomc

But the length of time has no material impact on anything? It's purely down to how long it takes for people to get the illness. All the trials for all of the vaccines will have taken different lengths of time.

What's your point? Presumably you are concerned about long term side effects? Why? It's generally accepted that long term side effects from vaccines just aren't a "thing". I genuinely don't understand the concern.

It's not really a 'respect anyone's opinion' kind of issue, though. I will respect the opinions of people who know what they're talking about, and those tend to be the scientists who have spent years studying it.

People who understand how trials work, how there isn't a fixed amount of time that needs to pass - it's to do with how many people get the disease, which is going to be very different in every instance. How long term effects aren't really the main issue - the safety issues are to do with the number of people that have been given the vaccine, not the amount of time that has passed. That point won't come sooner if millions of people wait just to see what happens to the first volunteers.

What kind of long term effects are people predicting might happen, and how - what mechanism for causing those effects? What kind of data or information would reassure you?

If people are wanting the lockdowns to end, they will have to decide that it is one of the main benefits to have the vaccine, as part of their benefit/risk analysis. There won't be going back to normal life unless enough people have it to seriously slow the spread, so you might well be stuck in this limbo for ages.

I can't get past the horror and contempt with which people who waver over childhood vaccines are met on here compared with the many posters who appear to be too scared for themselves to have a Covid vaccine.

There are always calls to prevent children from being able to mix with others if unvaccinated.....and I have always suspected that if it came to adults being jabbed to maintain herd immunity it would be an entirely different scenario!

Yes, I will be having the jab when it becomes available to my age group (50s).

People have different opinions believe it or not, there really is no need to be so rude or insulting is there?
For what it's worth I'm very well educated, thanks

Doesnt seem to be allowed when it comes to covid. Its like there's some pre approved list of reasons and anything outside of that forget it.

Last time I checked we were able to make our own decisions about what we put in our bodies and when. Until that is taken away from us we should be free to make the decision.

For months people have been absolutely awful about everyone, and throwing around accusations.

And all this having to base a decision on everyone else..... as if someones ever gone " ill decline surgery now thanks Dr just incase someone else needs the anesthetist or theres a car accident while I'm under.."

As if other complete strangers factored into their decisions aby other time...

@Sushirolls

I won't be having it, even if it means resigning from my job( I work in care). I think DH is on the fence, DS1, DD1 & DD2 have all said they won't have it but I think DS2 will have it if offered (early 20's, so will be awhile). My DSis and I have agreed that we will refuse consent for our DM to have it.

I acknowledge your right to choose for yourself I think you're making the wrong choice, but it's your choice.

Genuine question as I am really trying to understand people's resistance to it...

For your mother? She's already in care - what risk do you think she'd be facing by having the vaccination that would be worse for her than dying of Covid?

What worries you fir you having it?

No, I won't be getting it.

@Covidiot

The ill-educated won’t get it.

The educated will as they will be able to look up and see exactly what processes have been followed and realise that it’s the same one as usual, just without the gaps whilst funding, admin etc is performed.

It’s a Darwinian thing.

If you’re not a twat (or obviously have a specific medical condition which makes vaccines problematic) the you’ll get the vaccine.

'ill-educated' - interesting! I think those who have actually considered things more carefully actually are more educated. There's never been a vaccine for a coronavirus ever despite many years of trying- the common cold is a coronavirus remember.

People quoting crap like 'oh but you'll be protecting others' have been listening to main stream media hype and believing it unfortunately in their desire to 'get back to normal'. The media and even the government have been pushing this yet then turn around and say ah, but masks etc will still be needed for some time yet-so it' won't be any kind of normal for a while.
Also the 'drop' in immunity- another load of rubbish! If so many people had recently had Covid as per the positive 'cases' from the PCR test (that actually can't even tell if you're actually infectious or not!) then there'd be a lot more people with antibodies. There's been various bits of research on the role of T cell immunity and how some people's immune systems mean that even without having Covid that they're likely to have a good level of immunity to it from past infections from other virus's. The government aren't keen to share that kind of information but it's out there.

For what it's worth, I am eligible for the flu vaccine each year but I chose not to have it- my immune system does a good enough job at the moment of fighting illness itself so I don't consider it necessary. IF as I get older I notice a difference in this then I'll think about it.
Vaccines=money for the government despite what they try to suggest

@generalexpert

Natural selection is a great thing.

Sadly though, those who can have it, but choose not to, are putting those at risk who cannot have it.

Peoples fear of this vaccine only highlights their lack of intelligence or understanding

Is that right? I must remember to tell my cousin's son ...

He's an epidemiologist, works for Astra Zeneca and is also refusing to have it for at least the first two years of rollout

@kifomadertonasomc usually its 3-4 years so yes you would have slightly longer term knowledge.

I'll get it if it's offered to me (which I doubt it will be). I accept others see it differently, which is up to them.

I will take it with gratitude as will my children. I've yet to meet someone who wont take it whose opinion I actually value. The last person who told me they wouldn't take it, also told me in the same breath that a witch in his country could cure cancer with herbs and that the government was trying to hide this! 🤔 need I say more?!🙃

And all this having to base a decision on everyone else..... as if someones ever gone " ill decline surgery now thanks Dr just incase someone else needs the anesthetist or theres a car accident while I'm under.."

And the irony is, by refusing a safe vaccine you're doing the opposite - putting yourself and your own health at risk, the health of others at risk and pressure on the NHS should you become ill because you refuse to be vaccinated.

The vaccine will only do what we need it to do if the vast majority of people who are offered it take up that offer.

I am a bit as I work in healthcare and will be one of the 1st get it. I will be getting it though although I do worry it's been rushed to be made and worry about potential side effects

Yes, at the high efficacy shown so far I think it's well worth it.

@Neron

Your freedom is just a safe vaccine away

This is the problem.
There are comms out there stating that things will not resume as normal as soon as people have the jab.

I think that's crap, but that aside, how does not having the vaccine help?

@clarcats

Honestly, if you're still using "we've never come up with a coronavirus vaccine before" line then you really just can't have looked into this at all, you just can't have.

First of all, we've had coronavirus vaccines for animals for years. Secondly "the common cold" is caused by around 200 viruses of which coronaviruses make up 4. Can you imagine it being commercially valuable to produce a vaccine that might marginally reduce the chance of catching an illness that for the majority is minor inconvenience? Yes, you wouldn't catch one if the coronaviruses but you could still catch one if the other 196 viruses and end up with a cold. Who would have that vaccine?!

Who knew that someone eating bat soup has resulted in nanobot injections around the world. Dont get me started on 5G masts