Month long lockdown to 'pay' for 5 days over Christmas

[NotAKaren]

PHE have confirmed Sage advice that for every one day of relaxation over Christmas would require 5 days of restrictions afterwards. So for 5 days relaxation, which is rumoured to be what the government have in mind, would mean 25 days of restrictions. Is it really worth it?

January is really going to be dark for some people isn't it? I wish there wasn't all this commercialisation of Xmas. It's ridiculous. Just have a nice meal with household , give presents and let's all have a giant party when we get vaccinated.

@lovelemoncurd sadly many households are only one or two people so opening presents and enjoying Christmas just won’t be the same. Honestly if it’s lockdown Christmas this year we just won’t bother. We haven’t decorated yet (as no small children) and probably won’t. I’m just hoping takeaways are open on Christmas Day as I also don’t see the point in cooking for two.

I read a good article earlier today (trying to remember where I read it so I can link).
It was urging us to remember the true message of Christmas and Christianity - protecting the vulnerable.

Christmas is what you make it. Its perfectly possible to have good time if you decide to. If you decide to not bother, you'll get that.

I absolutely feel for people on their own and could see that it could be possible to extend to 1 person, a maximum number. Big numbers, no.

Anyone who thinks it's okay to have big Christmas gatherings might want to spare a thought for the Lewis family in Pentre who did follow the rules.

@Jayne35 They Christmas cancellers don't care about your situation, they'll all be having a lovely time with their families the rest of us can bloody well top ourselves for all they care!

Just looked it up @dopenguinsdance
How terribly sad.

I wonder how many other people will end up forever spending Christmas away from their family because of losing them to Covid?

Lorraine Kelly has it right. Like she says, we need a leader who does what's right for the whole country, rather than trying to be popular and loved.

www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-wales-54828574

@tigerstail Agreed, that’s what I commented earlier, I might have a different view if we were younger with a couple of children at home, seems all the people happy to lockdown and celebrate alone, aren’t alone! Having not seen much of our families all this year it would be nice if we could get together, sensibly on Christmas Day. None of us are in at risk groups and my DH has recently had covid so I really can’t see an issue with maybe two households mixing for one day.

No I don't think it is worth it all.

The impact on people's mental health of further lockdown restrictions would be difficult. The impact on people's mental health if they meet up and are asymptomatic and pass this on to a relative who then dies would be horrendous.

The impact on the economy and small business of further restrictions would also not be good.

I think it is also decisive as why should Christmas be treated differently to other religions main festivals such as Diwali or Hanukkah?

I also wonder if this leak is to then justify that they only say only Christmas day and not longer to placate people. Also Boris wont want to be seen as the grinch in newspaper headlines!

@jillycat72 there were loads of fireworks where I live for Diwali so I suspect many celebrated regardless.

[quote Jayne35]@jillycat72 there were loads of fireworks where I live for Diwali so I suspect many celebrated regardless.[/quote]
Yes fireworks in their own back garden. Not necessarily mass gathering with extended family and friends.

One thing we really mustn't do (and never should've) is what we did with Eid. Wait until the night before any announcements.

jayne There is a great thread on how to make christmas lovely when there are two of you, the recommendations are excellent.

For all of those wanting big Christmas go and watch BBC2 now

Now, there seems to be mass public concern about mental health

Mainly because it is now affecting the masses, rather than concern for others. It is now on the national radar because it has become so serious in the last few months. I am all for making the most of Christmas and brining cheer as much as we can, but we have to be so careful that we don't end up compromising or killing older or more vulnerable family members.

We could be carriers, we could have children that are infected without us knowing. I find it so sad that given all the loss, the suffering people are still just thinking about their themselves. Moaning that there is no point in cooking for two etc etc, when really to be healthy and here is quite an achievement in itself in 2020. I have just come out of hospital, it was crowded, packed and over run and frightening - I can't imagine what it will be like in the middle of December when the winter hits, with this covid spike as well. I am really worried for all of us. We need to stay well, we need to stay out of hospitals and we need to start looking after each other before it is too late.

[quote Jayne35]@lovelemoncurd sadly many households are only one or two people so opening presents and enjoying Christmas just won’t be the same. Honestly if it’s lockdown Christmas this year we just won’t bother. We haven’t decorated yet (as no small children) and probably won’t. I’m just hoping takeaways are open on Christmas Day as I also don’t see the point in cooking for two.[/quote]
I appreciate you may feel Christmas won't be the same for just two of you, but please don't assume everyone who will spend Christmas as a two feels the same. There is no "sadly" about my Christmas plans. I will be with my bubble (my DP), we will enjoy opening presents, having a nice breakfast, cooking dinner together, watching some Christmas films, drinking some wine and probably playing some games.

I do understand that there will be people who live alone who will hate to spend Christmas alone, and people with terminally ill family, and other complicated situations in which not being able to spend Christmas together would be awful. In those scenarios I think people should take all the precautions they can (e.g. isolating beforehand, distancing on the day if possible, not too many households mixing, possibly not having lots of people all spending several days all cramped in one house) and then spend Christmas together if they need to.

I think those of us who have our own household or bubble in which they can spend Christmas should do so. I really don't think it's fair for the entire country to be put into a longer lockdown, with all the issues that will result in, to allow some people to have a big family Christmas, when there are plenty of people who either don't want or need a big family Christmas, or for whom it isn't even an option because they don't have a big family to spend Christmas with. They won't benefit from any relaxation of restrictions, but will suffer all the downsides of a longer lockdown.

I suspect I am missing something but if we don’t lift lockdown at Christmas and so lift it 25 days earlier than we would have, why won’t we then have to lock down for 25 days 5 days after that?

It is not worth it.

Even if it is allowed, I won't be mixing with family this Christmas. Much more sensible to keep each other safe and not mix, other than on Zoom.

I work in a school and feel like a lamb to the slaughter. If all the kids mix left, right and centre and come back to school I think infection rates will go through the already-too-high roof.

It is infuriating.

Quote from Ken Marsh chairman of the Met Police Federation. "People are likely to ignore the restrictions on Christmas Day anyway. The police are not going to go around dishing out fines to people when they are cutting their Christmas turkey"

So what next?
Lots of people drink drive so will the police say let's bother policing it because people ignore the rules?

lets not* bother

I'm on the fence.
Usually, I'm flat broke and full of cold until the end of January and the weather is atrocious. So it wouldn't make much difference to my normal January.
I also live in an area where numbers are going down, we aren't even in the top 200 or more for infections or deaths and our hospital chief executive has said this evening that they have contingency plans in place but as yet the hospital is fine, in fact they have less respiratory patients in than they usually do at this point as people for the most part are sticking to rules. So it feels like we should be rewarded a bit.
But I can see the potential damage it could inflict on areas which are still struggling because of the ignorance of some towards the rules.
I genuinely think people will ignore restrictions anyway and there's nowhere near enough police to deal with it.

@southeastdweller

I can't find any information about 2020 suicide figures in the UK but i see that they've doubled in London compared to 2019 - www.standard.co.uk/news/london/paramedic-callouts-suicides-attempted-london-double-year-a4573283.html

Very worrying.

Sudden deaths are investigated and ruled on by a coroner which takes time, so we won't have accurate figures until July 2021, but NCISH have compiled a report based on real time surveillance documents.manchester.ac.uk/display.aspx?DocID=51861

And the Samaritans have commented on it.

twitter.com/samaritans/status/1326184288958746625?s=21

[quote Jayne35]@lovelemoncurd sadly many households are only one or two people so opening presents and enjoying Christmas just won’t be the same. Honestly if it’s lockdown Christmas this year we just won’t bother. We haven’t decorated yet (as no small children) and probably won’t. I’m just hoping takeaways are open on Christmas Day as I also don’t see the point in cooking for two.[/quote]
This year, it will be me, DP and a newborn. We don't have any family in the UK, so even if restrictions are relaxed we won't be seeing anyone.

We've had previous Christmasses as just a couple before too, as DP hasn't been able to get enough time off to go abroad to see family. We were so excited the first time we got a Christmas 'just us' - lots of cuddling in front of Christmas films!

It may be hard if it's not what you're used to, and I do hope that whatever regulations there are won't leave anyone alone at Christmas. But Christmas in a small household doesn't have to be a disaster!

@SheepandCow

So what next? Lots of people drink drive so will the police say let's bother policing it because people ignore the rules?

There's a reason why we have to have laws to force some parents to keep their child safer by strapping them into a seat belt, or not smoking in an enclosed car with them. Or not to drive drunk.

Maybe it's the same sort of people who would cheerfully risk giving granny covid if they are not prevented?