Is a change beginning to happen regarding schools?

[Covidfears]

I’ve been noticing more articles lately in the mainstream press about the difficulties in schools (which will come as no surprise to most people). There’s also been some research which has basically confirmed that schools are driving infections. So, along with it looking like this lockdown has been a waste of time (due to schools being kept open to continue the spread) and people in power calling for Hull schools to be closed do we think that schools will be closing early for Christmas?

Is there any chance that blended learning or rotas will be coming in after the Christmas holidays?

We are a vulnerable family with children in primary school and the risk that sending them every day with no safety measures poses to our family is causing me huge amounts of stress.

[quote Delatron]@ChloeDecker I’m taking about in our local area. Anecdotal but I’m hearing similar stories. None of the isolated cases in schools here are causing any outbreaks (yes they may be asymptomatic but all of them?) amongst children or parents. Make of that what you will.

In March we were all dropping like flies round here.[/quote]
What’s your local area?

@MostDisputesDieAndNoOneShoots How about closing schools now but open them for longer over spring/summer instead?

Parents, despite all the moaning about the length of them, are really reluctant to lose the summer holidays. I think it’s one of the reasons the GREAT SUMMER CATCH-UP was binned.

People are still pinning their hopes on getting away next year.

@noblegiraffe

Parents, despite all the moaning about the length of them, are really reluctant to lose the summer holidays. I think it’s one of the reasons the GREAT SUMMER CATCH-UP was binned.

People are still pinning their hopes on getting away next year.

Yep! All of those who say ‘schools must stay open for the good of the children’ would probably be the first to complain if the summer holiday was out the window

I think, tbh, the issue is there's a big group of people who have resisted dealing with Covid full stop.

They moan about masks, tests, distancing, school, work, travel, socialising...

Because of these people who are 'upset' all the time we can't deal with anything.

So yes, that group would also moan if summer holidays changed. Because they can't deal with change.

I'm sick of them tbh, they block everything!

I was absolutely at the tossers who were so unimaginative they couldn't think of anything to do instead of trick or treating for one year. They'll be the same about Christmas.

Hospitality/tourism based businesses would suffer a lot if the summer holidays changed, I think - assuming they manage to survive until next summer!

@TrustTheGeneGenie

Why is that a given?

And I'm sorry but calling people "batshit" because they don't agree with you, is offensive.

It's not offensive when they are batshit, though. And a glance at their website would confirm that to the person with half a brain.

They are in favour of putting children and school staff in danger. If that's not batshit I don't know what is.

@BefuddledPerson

I think, tbh, the issue is there's a big group of people who have resisted dealing with Covid full stop.

They moan about masks, tests, distancing, school, work, travel, socialising...

Because of these people who are 'upset' all the time we can't deal with anything.

So yes, that group would also moan if summer holidays changed. Because they can't deal with change.

I'm sick of them tbh, they block everything!

I was absolutely at the tossers who were so unimaginative they couldn't think of anything to do instead of trick or treating for one year. They'll be the same about Christmas.

Absolutely! Great post. The absolute lack of flexibility and totally fixed mindset. It's really irritating, this sector or society are so hard to drag along with us.

[quote TheSunIsStillShining]@Quartz2208

1. because most of the childcare is on mothers.
2. I agree that if both are wfh then it has to be split. But even in that case counting just one parent and saying how about the gov pay 1 parent's salary for x month is logical.
3. This is an approximate number to make a point. It's purpose on a forum is not to be perfectly precise.

Could you please explain why my point doesn't work in a bit more detail than this sentence?[/quote]
It was late and I got angry about your assertion that childcare is women (although I see based on previous posts now that telling you that isnt my experience will not go down well with you but neither is a blanket women do childcare - the reality is far more nuanced.

So please can you explain to me how schools equal childcare equals 100% of the workforce being sacrifice for the 8-10. (As an aside at the very least it should be 90-92%)

Because none of it makes sense to me.

@BefuddledPerson

I think, tbh, the issue is there's a big group of people who have resisted dealing with Covid full stop.

They moan about masks, tests, distancing, school, work, travel, socialising...

Because of these people who are 'upset' all the time we can't deal with anything.

So yes, that group would also moan if summer holidays changed. Because they can't deal with change.

I'm sick of them tbh, they block everything!

I was absolutely at the tossers who were so unimaginative they couldn't think of anything to do instead of trick or treating for one year. They'll be the same about Christmas.

Interesting, I've often thought the same. But then I sometimes think that back to other small crisis situations and how people have reacted. Its driven by a desire to regain control of the situation, because people fear that out of chaos is annihilation. Life is precarious, and most of us have so little control and real autonomy. Its a constant struggle to survive under the economic and social conditions of advanced capitalism. Support networks are in short supply, life is competitive, and people have become so selfish towards others. People fear that losing their tenuous grip on their normal life, and giving up a little control will lead to chaos and personal harm to them. What is needed more than ever is collective action, calm dialogue, consensus and empathy. What we have is social Darwinism and fear. Its perfectly possible that these 'tossers' are just more afraid than the rest of us.

Great post Mini agree 100%

It is a shame that there wasn't more schooling in the summer - not least because there was some extra money to make things safer then and so at my DD's school it was safer - they had extra staff (inexperienced TAs, but they were great), small class sizes and did social distancing. She never got sick as a result. And learned more, obviously, both because of the smaller class size and because she didn't have to isolate or have time off sick once.

I think it's really, really weird, and quite telling when people are offended that a teacher who is having to go into the most unsafe working environment in the UK daily uses a word like 'batshit' to describe a group of people that are actively campaigning to make her job as unsafe as possible.

When there are many teachers who are reporting catching covid in schools and being really, really ill as a result. Pregnant teachers, for goodness sake. Teachers who've had to be taken to hospital in ambulances.

It's like someone shooting someone else then everyone focusing on the fact that the victim called the shooter a name.

The levels of harm are just so wildly different as to be ridiculous.

If I was being forced to work in schools as they are 'batshit' would be the very least of it.

And yes, it's a good idea, how about closing schools now for a few weeks and having them open a few weeks longer next summer instead? I expect at this point a lot of teachers would back that given how things are deteriorating now. By next summer there should be a vaccine.

The lack of creativity or willingness to change anything in this country is frankly astounding.

Haven’t their been several studies recently showing teachers don’t get the virus more than any other occupation? I’m pretty sure they weren’t in top 3/4

No those studies were comparing to frontline health workers. It was presented in a very misleading way so the category with the highest number of teachers was 'other' and they actually IIRC had a HIGHER risk than health workers of catching coronavirus. I'm sure someone will be along with the statistics.

@IloveJKRowling

And yes, it's a good idea, how about closing schools now for a few weeks and having them open a few weeks longer next summer instead? I expect at this point a lot of teachers would back that given how things are deteriorating now. By next summer there should be a vaccine.

The lack of creativity or willingness to change anything in this country is frankly astounding.

This is not a good idea. Many of us lost our family holidays last summer due to travel restrictions and have rebooked at the start of the summer holidays so that we will be able to quarantine if necessary afterwards. Furthermore what are kids supposed to do during a four week holiday in December with travel restrictions in place preventing anyone going away and restrictions on socialising. There wouldn’t be anything fun for teachers to do either and they will also have missed out on holidays. It would be better to have a couple of weeks of remote learning for secondary schools if anything

I was absolutely hmm at the tossers who were so unimaginative they couldn't think of anything to do instead of trick or treating for one year. They'll be the same about Christmas.

Yes. I suspect these are the people who haven't lost a loved one or had a loved one very ill from coronavirus. Or are having to work in schools at the moment.

After all, if you can't think of another way of having fun or changing things up TO SAVE LIVES DURING A PANDEMIC then I really do despair.

@grenadines
I don't think "having fun" is the biggest issue here. OR holidays.
What many are saying -rightly- that there needs to be proper health safeguarding practices in schools. For any safety measures to work the community numbers need to be low (below 5% positivity rate if I remember correctly) and effective track/trace system needs to be in place. That can only happen is transmission chains are broken. For that to happen one of the biggest infection risk places: schools (and mainly sec. schools) need to be closed to mass gatherings - as in kids/teachers having lessons.

So in this case nobody in their right mind gives a toss about fun or holiday. We would need to bring community rates down to be able to resume -with additional measures of masks, real SD and TTR- schools and actually deliver a consistent educational experience to all. for the rest of the school year.

@thesunisstillshining as I said Two weeks of remote learning could be put in place rather than giving kids a four week holiday with nothing to do in the gloomiest month of the year.

Well I'd be personally happy with home learning but there are always those that pop up and say it's bad for kid's education. If they really HAVE to be in school to get a good education then shifting some summer holiday makes sense. That would also mean that for those working they have to provide childcare for their children for the same total amount of holiday over the year - which presumably they already account for.

It makes so much more sense. Ventilation is more comfortable in the summer, and some classes can take place outside.

I'm really not sure that it is parents who blocked Boris's summer school catch up idea more that it was poorly thought through nor am I entirely sure that all teachers would welcome having their summer holidays cut short to have an extended winter break.

As a parent it seems a sensible enough suggestion to me - provided the dates were confirmed asap, and parents couldn't be fined for missing any of the summer classes as people - teachers included- will have moved holidays from this year to next year.

Alternatively online learning for a short period of time for secondaries is fine by me as well - provided it's of a strictly limited duration and doesn't become the default.

@Ginogineli

Haven’t their been several studies recently showing teachers don’t get the virus more than any other occupation? I’m pretty sure they weren’t in top 3/4

Wasn't there something released yesterday that put the order as 1 - supermarkets 2 - secondary schools 3 - primary schools

It would also benefit hospitality and tourism greatly to have holidays more evenly spread with, say, different counties/regions taking holidays at different times.

Hi yes I do work. I work from home and I manage our homeschooling timetable around work. I currently have two jobs and luckily I can more or less pick my own times with one of them, with the other, I’ve been furloughed and find myself furloughed once again, but when things go back to normal I will be able to work it round our schedule so I’m very lucky