To think the govt has no right to tell me who I'm allowed to have in my home?

[HumanFemale1]

Anyone else feels the same? I just don't think this is OK. Govt making the rules of who I am allowed to have in my home or how many people I'm allowed to have in...

Especially when it's to keep a virus from spreading when the average death of a virus is higher than the life expectancy. But for any reason really. If the govt was making this rule for any other reason people would be horiffied.

@amicissimma

"And that's not fair when as a result of their actions, there wont be enough NHS resource to deal with the consequences, especially if everyone acted like them."

According to the National Audit Office, at the height of the epidemic in April, with the highest Covid bed occupancy, only 42% of hospital beds were occupied by Covid patients. (43% were unoccupied)

Bearing in mind that more people are aware of Covid now and voluntarily taking care not to catch/spread it than in March, when spreading was at its peak, I think it is very valid indeed to ask if it's right that the Government impose restrictions on its citizens by law.

That doesn't make sense. There were people in hospital for other reasons at that point.

*suppress hard

If the government brought in all the new rules at once there would have been uproar.

But as it's been done incrementally people say it's only this ect but all these onlys add up and a lot doesn't make sense.

@CountessFrog

I agree with the OP however oohthestats has nailed it completely.

If you dont want to follow the rules, sign a waiver to say you won’t use the nhs.

This is exactly the issue, I agree completely that this is a massive infringement on liberties, however we can’t swamp health services.

Should smokers, drinkers, drug takers, people who drive like arses and those that do extreme sports also sign a waiver and not use the NHS?

Are those things illegal?

Not all of them but they generally aren't good for you so is it selfish to do them and expect the NHS to pick up the fallout? I'm not saying it is it or isn't but the notion that anyone that isn't following COVID law deserves to suffer and presumably die quietly at home is utter crap!

I actually think this is something we should be discussing; and I say that as a healthcare professional who fully sees the awfulness of Covid and the effect on the NHS. I agree with the lockdowns, but I do think we need to be watchful of what liberties we hand over and make sure they're handed back to us at the other side of this.

Yes, it is utter crap, healthcare for all, includes those who naively didn’t realise the risk, perhaps because of the way that politicians in this country have ALL behaved over the last 6 years.

Everyone deserves NHS treatment when they need it.

Most people will grossly follow the rules and the overall effect will therefore help.

It doesn't have to divide us so bitterly.

@Pandamanium

Govt making the rules

That's what Governments do.

That's what governments are for!

I must add though, and I didn't want to because it is a bit raw at the moment, but the collapse of the NHS, or raised covid in hospitals isn't something to live in denial about.

My dad died a few weeks ago, he was discharged with a temperature of 40.9, he wasn't given any medication, nor a hospital bed. He died 4 days after discharge with my family having had to drag him back in to the bed repeatedly when he fell out in the meantime. The doctor refused to come out, nor prescribe him anything to make it easier.

He died horribly and his death was certified by the undertaker, not a medical doctor as this is no longer legally required. It was certified as prostate cancer. Despite the fact that he had been on dexamethasone for 4m prior to his discharge.

Its funny because prostate cancer didn't cause his evated temperature or the bruising all over his body. And I don't know how an undertaker managed to determine cause of death.

I wouldn't wish that death on my worst enemy.

It isnt recorded as covid, despite a ground glass chest x Ray. So yeah, I'm kind of sore about people having tantrums about their own home. However, if your mental health depends upon breaking some rules occasionally, I don't blame you.

Everyone deserves a dignified death. Everyone deserves NHS treatment.

@chickenyhead

I must add though, and I didn't want to because it is a bit raw at the moment, but the collapse of the NHS, or raised covid in hospitals isn't something to live in denial about.

My dad died a few weeks ago, he was discharged with a temperature of 40.9, he wasn't given any medication, nor a hospital bed. He died 4 days after discharge with my family having had to drag him back in to the bed repeatedly when he fell out in the meantime. The doctor refused to come out, nor prescribe him anything to make it easier.

He died horribly and his death was certified by the undertaker, not a medical doctor as this is no longer legally required. It was certified as prostate cancer. Despite the fact that he had been on dexamethasone for 4m prior to his discharge.

Its funny because prostate cancer didn't cause his evated temperature or the bruising all over his body. And I don't know how an undertaker managed to determine cause of death.

I wouldn't wish that death on my worst enemy.

It isnt recorded as covid, despite a ground glass chest x Ray. So yeah, I'm kind of sore about people having tantrums about their own home. However, if your mental health depends upon breaking some rules occasionally, I don't blame you.

Everyone deserves a dignified death. Everyone deserves NHS treatment.

So sorry to read this. It really starts to hit home when you are personally affected. I agree with your comments wholeheartedly regarding a dignified death.

Which “rights” are you referring to OP?

My understanding is that, because Britain does not have constitutional law, it can enact any legislation that makes it through Parliament. And then it can be challenged in court etc.

In France we do have constitutional law. When the govt tried to restrict household gatherings, the constitutional court told them that this was not possible under the current constitution. Ass result they have only been able to advise re. household gatherings.

So yes, if you are in the U.K. the government does have the right to legislate on who / how many / etc you can have in your home.

So sorry @chickenyhead.

It's for your safety don't you know?

Especially when it's to keep a virus from spreading when the average death of a virus is higher than the life expectancy.

There’s no doubt that Covid risk is strongly correlated with age. Just because it is more deadly to the vulnerable doesn’t mean it’s risk doesn’t exist for those that are less vulnerable, and the fact the age of death is slightly above average age of death is pretty likely to be due to care homes which congregate the very old and vulnerable together.

For instance, if i starved 1,000 random people for a few weeks, the older and vulnerable would die disproportionately, simply because they’re weaker. It doesn’t mean those less vulnerable wouldn’t be affected or that a significant number will die.

Also, if we just let Covid rip through, there’d be a massive adverse impact on non-Covid illness, such as cancer, as health systems become overwhelmed.

I don't see it as doing what the government tells me. I see it as the data says if we all do nothing, the effects will be worse. So I am doing my bit to mitigate these.

It's social responsibility, not meekly following instructions.

Btw my then 18, now 19, DD caught Covid in April. She's still not recovered, is on heart medication and is bedbound. But she didn't die, so yay! Apparently!

Totally agree with @MarieInternette & @Flyonawalk points. I do wonder how long people like @JinglingHellsBells will go on following these awful measures in the home...years maybe?

@Gmom

Agree with OP that it is very worrying that the UK people think their government should be able to prescribe who they can associate with and how many visitors they can have in their own private homes.

I think I had Covid in March along with lots of friends. I get that it's real and that we need to take precautions and stem demand at NHS hospitals. I am following the rules even when I think they're illogical, inconsistent and stupid. (E.g. the tennis courts in the local park were closed today so I couldn't play singles with my husband while the playground was rammed with kids and parents from dozens of households close together etc.)

But I think this govt has gotten way too granular with their rules and I have lost respect for the dumb people who have accepted government meddling in private relationships unquestioningly. We need to talk about civil liberties.

Completely agree

@fuckrightoff I, and millions of others, will follow the rule for the next 3 weeks.

That's how long the science has said it may take to stop the numbers increasing to such an extent they overwhelm the NHS.

I don't need to defend my actions.

It's the posters here who are selfish and don't understand how it's spread who need to wake up and stop being so bloody stupid.

@Dustballs

Enjoy it because my prediction is that very soon you will be like us or much worse

Erm - sorry? What's that supposed to mean @Time2change2?

Are you not aware of the situation with Covid in the US at the moment?

What I mean is that I predict you will be locked down next year so enjoy the parties in the street as you put it

@Figmentofmyimagination

I think the problem here is that in the uk, we police by consent, but this requires trust and a sense that laws are enforced fairly, with everyone on the same level playing field.

This particular government, was so partisan and untrusted by millions - think Brexit, oven ready deal, johnson’s behaviour etc - that they never had sufficient levels of trust to start off with.

Successive actions, Cummings, Harding etc etc have given people the impression that the laws don’t apply to some, and that the virus is an opportunity for advancement for others so what little trust they enjoyed has been squandered.

So now, Unless police are going to start going house to house and arresting infringers in a very public way so as to promote enforcement among others, and/or making the penalties for having someone in your house frighteningly high, we won’t get compliance in the uk.

This is why the whole cummings affair was so corrosive.

^^ Exactly this

Nigel Faridge has a new grift going that you'll love.

Agree. And seeing pics of Jeremy Corbyn on the Isle of Wight last week is just more of the same.

Corbyn us in the past like Trump. Perhaps u should focus on Boris Cummings Matt Hancock and the Government who have ALL broke the rules at sometime during the first lockdown after and even now.

@Sostenueto

Corbyn us in the past like Trump. Perhaps u should focus on Boris Cummings Matt Hancock and the Government who have ALL broke the rules at sometime during the first lockdown after and even now.

And because they’ve broken them let’s all break them ! What about taking responsibility of our own acts ? Let’s stop blaming what others do and make sure what we do doesn’t contribute to the current crap situation cuz whilst some of you are happy seeing family and so ... others are losing their jobs or dying cuz of cancer because their investigations were stopped because the nhs couldn’t cope with COVID and not COVID