If Covid is going nowhere what is the plan for schools?

[Marcellemouse]

www.walesonline.co.uk/news/uk-news/covid-here-stay-even-develop-19095194
Just asked this on a different thread but no response.
Bearing in mind the above, at what point teachers be happy to teach a full class of DC?

“So do you think if the elderly, the vulnerable and the front line workers are all vaccinated, all this 2 week isolating and whole classes or school years sent home will stop? Id like to hope so but I'm not convinced. Will it become treated just the same as flu or norovirus on terms of our response to it?“

What I know about epidemiology etc wouldn’t fill a postage stamp. But yes, if the nhs can manage the numbers, few people die or end up in intensive care and if there are treatments available, why would we lock down entire classes to prevent it spreading? It just gets added to the likes of chicken pox for children - very unpleasant for a tiny minority. And if, by some miracle, operation Moonshit actually happened and we could test school classes widely and frequently for asymptomatic cases you could probably make a big dent in transmission anyway.

Militant unions causing unnecessary chaos on one side..

Any evidence of this?

Blended learning does NOT make sense for (in no particular order):

• children whose parents who have to work and can't juggle childcare and work
• children whose parents cba to educate their kids on the days at home
• children who are vulnerable, for whom school is a safe haven (guess what - "vulnerable" doesn't just mean susceptible to covid)
• teenagers who cba
• children with learning difficulties
• early primary years children

Not much left outside that is there?

To me, if you're advocating for blended learning then you're basically advocating for vast swathes of our children to melt their brains on Minecraft/netflix/fortnite etc for the next god knows how long (forever?) instead of receiving proper education.

You can dress it up as much as you like, but that is the reality of blended learning.

Blended learning is not just remote learning. Blended learning for mainstream secondary even better than Wales are doing (year 9 and above) ie giving all children at least some time in school on rotas. That would be an improvement on what we have at the moment in terms of safety and transmission.

I have a DC with SLD who goes to a special school, DC's school staff are being shafted even more than us in secondary in terms of safety. Just heard tonight another of the bubbles in DC's school has closed due to a case, member of staff, possibly picked it up from asymptomatic pupil (? Don't know but is a possibility). It's disgusting that the government have done nothing to mitigate for this bloody virus (remember the laptop fiasco) to improve the education provision for all.

Full classes here in Japan since June-July and no school closures (and what's more, summer vacation was reduced to about three weeks in most areas), very few kids sent home. So it can be done. EVERYONE here wears a mask in school except when outside. I think this is a small price to pay for full schools. Not much else is being done, except that superspreader stuff like clubs, activities and sports days/parents days are being cancelled or greatly scaled back. But the classes look pretty normal apart from that.

If the UK does not want to mask the kids up.... well, it may be a slower process. But as vaccines are rolled out and treatments improve, the virus's impact will start to look more and more like that of flu, and full classes will gradually resume in the UK.

My concern, however, is that we are going to see an awful lot of goalpost shifting. IE, we'll unroll the vaccine and then a lot of people are going to say "No, it needs to be a 100% sterilizing vaccine before schools can fully open" "No, we need close to 100% vaccine coverage before schools can fully open" "No, we need close to 100% vaccine coverage in every country where people can travel to the UK before schools can fully reopen" "No, the virus needs to be eliminated before schools can fully open"....

In the end the government says how and when school open, not teachers, not the school and not the unions.

And we know they can and have shifted the goalposts in this respect, not in ways that set high standard for re-opening, rather a willingness to deny staff the opportunity to wear masks and by saying schools are safe. And then removing that statement.

@Kokeshi123

My concern, however, is that we are going to see an awful lot of goalpost shifting. IE, we'll unroll the vaccine and then a lot of people are going to say "No, it needs to be a 100% sterilizing vaccine before schools can fully open" "No, we need close to 100% vaccine coverage before schools can fully open" "No, we need close to 100% vaccine coverage in every country where people can travel to the UK before schools can fully reopen" "No, the virus needs to be eliminated before schools can fully open"....

We are already fully open, sans vaccine.

@Juststopswimming

Blended learning does NOT make sense for (in no particular order):

• children whose parents who have to work and can't juggle childcare and work
• children whose parents cba to educate their kids on the days at home
• children who are vulnerable, for whom school is a safe haven (guess what - "vulnerable" doesn't just mean susceptible to covid)
• teenagers who cba
• children with learning difficulties
• early primary years children

Not much left outside that is there?

To me, if you're advocating for blended learning then you're basically advocating for vast swathes of our children to melt their brains on Minecraft/netflix/fortnite etc for the next god knows how long (forever?) instead of receiving proper education.

You can dress it up as much as you like, but that is the reality of blended learning.

You are right, this is exactly the problem with blended learning.

[quote Marcellemouse]**@StanfordPines* You stated a fact and surrounded it with lies*
What lie????[/quote]
That teachers aren’t happy teaching full classes. Where is you proof of that and, moreover, what point are you trying to make? What, exactly, is your problem?

I am breaking up today for half term and I am exhausted. I need a week off from cleaning tables, having 20 minute lunch breaks before cleaning said tables and benches, washing hands and using anti bac gel so frequently and pushing the rows of tables back that my class of 6 year olds have to sit at. I will be going in at least one day to try to catch up on all the stuff I haven't been able to and to cable tie the table legs together!

I love teaching, it is what I was born to do. I am going to have the best day possible with my class today before I send them home with a pack of work I have prepared just in case. There is no easy option. I hated lock down and not having a proper goodbye with my class but I am struggling with the demands of the new way of working. I also have no answers. I will just keep going in standing in front of my class of 30 and try to make sure they have the best day and learn as much as they can and that is about it really.

@Kokeshi123 full classes are the norm here too!!! You seem to be under the impression that we're mostly closed and refusing to teach but that's not the case at all. Especially not in primary (secondaries have been harder hit than us I think) our school has been fully open to anybody who wanted to come back from June 1st, my dc school very similar except two year groups closed for a week each.

Perhaps Kokeshi123 was misled by the misleading OP.

@58Whyisitsodifficult

The child had COVID symptoms but sentthrir child to school regardless. Is that not a good enough reason?

@MillieVanillawhy on earth should everybody else’s child stay at home because your child is vulnerable? You have the choice to keep him at home if you’re that concerned but don’t expect the rest of us to do the same! 🙄

I despair

30 DC probably is too many pre Covid I agree. My DC have always managed ok though. Helps them become more independent learners.

Not so great though if your child isn't nt.

@VillageGreenTreeBeautifully expressed. Shame on anyone who can’t see the truth and justice in what you are saying.

Thank you to all teachers and TA's out there doing their best in difficult times and in an unsafe environment.

You do not deserve the bashing you get on here.

I just want to say a massive thank you to all teachers and all in education, this year has certainly been challenging for you all.

EVERYONE here wears a mask in school except when outside. I think this is a small price to pay for full schools. Not much else is being done, except that superspreader stuff like clubs, activities and sports days/parents days are being cancelled or greatly scaled back. But the classes look pretty normal apart from that.

Well that sounds sensible.

UK schools open fully and all out of school activities (mixing many children from different schools after school including things like singing) happening too - all without masks. How long until it all implodes? It already is in places like Liverpool where only 1 school has had no closures due to covid.

We're doing literally everything wrong from a public health point of view and our children will suffer for it one way or another.

The risk to the vast majority of children and teachers is very low and the benefits of school far outweigh the risks.

Thank you to all the teachers!

Its already in places like Liverpool where only 1 school has no closures due to covid

You must be talking about my DC school then as I'm in that area no year closures at all. They all wear masks in communal areas and wearing them in classrooms is optional for both teachers and pupils.
Although there are other secondary schools nearby that I haven't heard have had closures, maybe they have and I just haven't heard but it is usually splashed across the Liverpool echo when year groups are sent home

Schools are open! If you're child's bubble is closed, too bad - schools are open! If your child's school can't open as no staff - too bad, schools are open! If you can't get the remote learning going, it's too bad as schools are open. If you couldn't see this coming along from Johnson, you need to wake up and smell the coffee. Schools will continue to be open until it's just one on the Isle of Man or something, and that will be all you'll get back from the DfE.

Parents have been shafted as much as teachers here, but I do think it's the fault of the militant few parents who just couldn't get from A to B with their reasoning and see that that this was all inevitable. The vast majority of people on MN and in real life are intelligent enough to see where it all went wrong.

I’m not a teacher, but work in a school (Admin), DH is a teacher, and our two boys are primary and secondary.

We’re in France all slightly different rules, but tbh school is going much better than DH and I thought it would. Yes it’s chaotic, yes there are absences for teachers and students, yes it has been a learning curve, and it’s no fun wearing masks all day but... teachers are teaching, children are in school learning, life is carrying on. In our department of 20 employees this term, we’ve had two positive cases (both admin, one infected the other), two teachers isolating as contact cases (tested negative) and one isolating with symptoms (also negative). No positive cases in the teachers so far (some of them already had it though, back in March / April). It’s sustainable though obviously not ideal.

Nb here, masks are worn by all adults and all children over 11yrs. Plus the Isolation period for positive tests and contact cases is 7 rather than 14 days. This was a pragmatic decision to increase compliance.

**So do you think if the elderly, the vulnerable and the front line workers are all vaccinated, all this 2 week isolating and whole classes or school years sent home will stop? Id like to hope so but I'm not convinced. Will it become treated just the same as flu or norovirus on terms of our response to it?“

What I know about epidemiology etc wouldn’t fill a postage stamp. But yes, if the nhs can manage the numbers, few people die or end up in intensive care and if there are treatments available, why would we lock down entire classes to prevent it spreading? It just gets added to the likes of chicken pox for children - very unpleasant for a tiny minority**
This is all I was asking. At what point would it be considered acceptable to teach a full class.

@StanfordPines That teachers aren’t happy teaching full classes. Where is you proof of that and, moreover, what point are you trying to make?
MN is full of posts from unhappy teachers. I'm not making it up.