Manchester- screw you Boris

[Napqueen1234]

F you Boris

There will be civil unrest in Manchester following this and I don’t blame them.

People won’t follow the rules as they have no respect for the government any more. Does anyone? Incompetence bullshit and lies.

It wasn't just Andy Burnham. Local politicians from other parties agreed with his views actually.

@Springcatkin

Well I'm in Manchester and I wont be complying. Boris hasnt proven anything other than let's bash the North yet again. TBH I won't be doing anything forbidden but i will be travelling to my family in a tier one area (relevant exemptions apply)

I'm in Liverpool and don't think Boris hates the Northerners. Your rates are high because idiots like you are carrying on the way you are. My whole family have socially distanced, kept hand washing and worn masks. None of us have had it.

ICU in certain points of GM are generally full at this point.

In fact on North West tonight two days ago the MRI had 68 out of 220 beds occupied and more suitable space in the local hospitals (Wythenshawe which took most Covid patients back in May) because departments that have moved out haven’t moved back and won’t do until next year.

The scientific graphs didn’t take into account the current availability that’s already been provided for in the local hospitals and more importantly how full these hospitals usually are at this time of year. Not to mention the Nightingale Unit in the city centre which has capacity and is currently empty.

Most of the cases were transmitted in Uni’s. And three of our local boroughs are showing a decrease in infection.

I’m not a fan of Burnham but he wanted clear figures on hospital capacity (still not accurate figures being provided by BoJo today) and also wanted a fair proportion.

And some of us northerners have followed all the fucking rules and didn’t ask for any of this. I’ll do whatever is necessary but please stop the hatred against Mancunians most of whom do want to be safe, but want that to be balanced against not having a sinking economy.

It will be interesting to see what happens between Graham Brady and Boris now though.

I have followed all the rules to date and will continue to follow the tier one rules. I dont go out clubbing or anything and ds self isolated when told to by college. I wear a mask in shops and at work. As do the vast majority of Manchester residents. We are in one of the boroughs that have seen a decrease so what we have been doing is working which is why we dont need tier 3.
Nothing I do is against the rules including my trip for half term to family in the SW.
It just annoys me that Bojo just imposed things.

@Drogonssmile

This is the update from Bolton yesterday. If anyone can't read it, it's teeny writing, it says that while we we at capacity briefly, we aren't now. The numbers are not terrifying. It's exaggerated by the media just as Andy Burnham said.

Should you really have posted this @Drogonssmile

I haven’t seen the sit-rep published externally in this way before.

Aren't China and New Zealand examples of the fact that if people were more compliant we could get numbers incredibly low?

I was under the impression that In China people were forced to comply and restrictions were much harsher. Numbers went back up when lockdown eased and then down again with effective track and trace.

Nothing I do is against the rules including my trip for half term to family in the SW

Well, that's totally against tier 3 guidelines, so don't pretend that's anything but selfish.

@Didkdt @Morsmordre

Does anyone remember the respect Andy Burnham had for the NHS when he was health secretary? Mid Staffordshire hospital ringing any bells.

Alan Johnson was health secretary at the time not Burnham.

Health Secretary
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secretary_of_State_for_Health_and_Social_Care
Alan Johnson 28 June 2007 - 5 June 2009
Andy Burnham 5 June 2009 - 11 May 2010

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stafford_Hospital_scandal
Julie Bailey, whose mother died in Stafford Hospital in 2007, started a campaign called Cure the NHS to demand changes to the hospital. She was supported by the Staffordshire Newsletter, but the Public and Patient Involvement Forum and the Governors of the Trust were defensive.

The scandal came to national attention because of an investigation by the Healthcare Commission in 2008 into the operation of Stafford Hospital in Stafford, England. The commission was first alerted by the "apparently high mortality rates in patients admitted as emergencies". When the Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust, which is responsible for running the hospital, failed to provide what the commission considered an adequate explanation, a full-scale investigation was carried out between March and October 2008. Released in March 2009, the commission's report severely criticised the Foundation Trust's management and detailed the appalling conditions and inadequacies at the hospital.

But please don't let the facts get in the way of a good smearing.

@Janevaljane

Nothing I do is against the rules including my trip for half term to family in the SW

Well, that's totally against tier 3 guidelines, so don't pretend that's anything but selfish.

Read up on the exemptions before making stupid sweeping comments

It's quite comforting to believe that the increase in cases is down to "selfish" individuals ignoring the rules, hugging in pubs, in and out of each other's houses, attending illegal raves. It means that the situation can be remedied by those individuals acting more responsibly.

It's certainly more palatable than the reality, i.e. that the spread is mainly caused by people going about day to day business within the rules - going to work, going to school, living in a care home. And it's definitely better than realising the only way of stopping it is for us all to hide indoors until a vaccine or treatment saves us.

so don't pretend that's anything but selfish.

Here we go 💤

@PetitFours EXACTLY.

[quote RedToothBrush]**@Didkdt* @Morsmordre*

Does anyone remember the respect Andy Burnham had for the NHS when he was health secretary? Mid Staffordshire hospital ringing any bells.

Alan Johnson was health secretary at the time not Burnham.

Health Secretary
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secretary_of_State_for_Health_and_Social_Care
Alan Johnson 28 June 2007 - 5 June 2009
Andy Burnham 5 June 2009 - 11 May 2010

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stafford_Hospital_scandal
Julie Bailey, whose mother died in Stafford Hospital in 2007, started a campaign called Cure the NHS to demand changes to the hospital. She was supported by the Staffordshire Newsletter, but the Public and Patient Involvement Forum and the Governors of the Trust were defensive.

The scandal came to national attention because of an investigation by the Healthcare Commission in 2008 into the operation of Stafford Hospital in Stafford, England. The commission was first alerted by the "apparently high mortality rates in patients admitted as emergencies". When the Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust, which is responsible for running the hospital, failed to provide what the commission considered an adequate explanation, a full-scale investigation was carried out between March and October 2008. Released in March 2009, the commission's report severely criticised the Foundation Trust's management and detailed the appalling conditions and inadequacies at the hospital.

But please don't let the facts get in the way of a good smearing.[/quote]
Well he was the health minister who proposed freezing NHS funding. This would have been the largest cuts to the NHS in generations. Way more than the Tory cuts.

Not defending the the government just pointing out that Burnham is well aware of the fiscal limitations of government. And that sometimes hard nosed decisions need to be made.

So much for "One Nation" Conservatives,

@ChloeCrocodile

For only my second time on this thread, GM has the offer of £82m in total which is in line with the other tier 3 areas.

Can you link to that? I’ve not seen anything like it from government sources, and I’d completely change my tune if that were true.

From the BBC website:

He [BoJo] added Greater Manchester would receive £22m in funding as part of a "comprehensive package of support" but that the "door was open to continue the conversation" about further aid, so long as it was in line with that offered to other areas in same position.
The £22m mentioned by Mr Johnson - which is for expenses such as local enforcement and test and trace - is separate to the £60m that Mr Hancock spoke of.
In addition, the new Job Support Scheme will cover 67% of the wages - funded by employers and the government - of people affected by tier three closures.

And from Sky News:

The PM said Greater Manchester would get £22m to implement and enforce the new measures.
Mr Johnson added that in addition to this support, a "generous and extensive offer to support Manchester's businesses" was put on the table, the £60m in support.
This offer was proportionate to the support we have given Merseyside and Lancashire [the other areas in Tier 3], but the mayor didn't accept this unfortunately," the PM said.
Downing Street later confirmed that the offer of £60m is still on the table, something that was echoed by Health Secretary Matt Hancock in the Commons.
"Our door is open to further discussions with local leaders in the coming days about business support," he told MPs.
The Liverpool City Region received £44m as it moved into Tier 3 (£14m for enforcement and £30m for businesses), while Lancashire got £42m (£12m for enforcement and £30m for businesses).^

This thread is grim. So many people are hanging on to Boris’ every word without a moment’s hesitation.

I don’t live in the north so none of this affects me, however I fully support Andy Burnham. He doesn’t want more for the people of Greater Manchester, he wants the same and he wasn’t going to get anything like that even if he’d got the £65m.

I had a very privileged upbringing and I’ve done ok since I’ve been married so I’ve never known hunger, or holes in my shoes, or being cold or not being able to do Christmas for my kids, but that’s what many in Greater Manchester are now facing. It’s so wrong. There’s been money wasted left, right and centre during this Covid crisis but Boris and his mates don’t give two hoots about that, but we can’t possibly find £5m, which let’s face it is a drop in the ocean, to help the ordinary man in the street. It’s beyond me.

He’s played a blinder though hasn’t he? He’s got us all arguing, finger pointing and blaming and it’s distracting from the complete and utter balls up that he’s made of the Brexit negotiations.

I really do hope this is the final nail in his coffin.

Alan Johnson 28 June 2007 - 5 June 2009
Andy Burnham 5 June 2009 - 11 May 2010

And Burnham was Minister of State at the Department of Health in 2006

He was widely condemned over the Staffordshire scandal. All you have to do is google "Burnham Staffordshire" to see what happened. It was a huge scandal at the time

I get that he has an axe to grind with the Gov't and he's right about the north being underfunded and so on but what I don't understand is why he used blocking tier 3 as his political lever. He used a public health emergency to score his older political points

Why couldn't he just agree to tier 3, like Liverpool did, and then bash the government afterwards. His grandstanding for the cameras, in front of the town hall, or library i think, or wherever, has been going on for 10 days

The Liverpool mayor confirmed on Twitter that he didn't agree to the restrictions- they were imposed by the Government. Boris was lying about that.

mobile.twitter.com/mayor_anderson/status/1317156612348497920

@Bromeliad

They keep waffling along about our local hospital being full. It's always sodding full by now. It deals with half the Peak District as well as our borough. The local Public Health director was trying to point this out at the weekend. So their scary graphs are great except they don't seem to bother to have spoken to people on the ground who know what it's like normally.

This. The hospital (and I know the one you mean) is always full at this time of year because the Conservatives have wrecked the NHS. I take Covid seriously and think we are headed for a bad ride nationally and especially in the North BUT the state of hospitals is about far more than Covid. The gov’s hospital assessment doesn’t include the huge Nightingale either. It’s deceitful data manipulation.

@TheFairyCaravan well said. Divide and conquer and the Tories will go on smirking for another day whilst the plebs fight it out.

The Liverpool mayor confirmed on Twitter that he didn't agree to the restrictions- they were imposed by the Government. Boris was lying about that

Obviously a Liverpool, or West and South Yorkshire etc, mayor wouldn't agree with the government. These are traditional northern Labour strong holds, but Anderson came out straight away and said, and I remember it clearly on the TV, that he agreed with the tier 3 lockdown. He said "we need it, yes"

Along with very positive data about less being on ventilators and many more recording after ICU as well. Good to read
I think that back in Spring ventilators were used as the default treatment in ICU now instead they are using CPAP and dexamethasone.

This change in treatment is saving peoples' lives which can only be good new.

(Please correct me if I am at all mistaken here)

There is a Nightingale hospital in the heart of Mcr which can free up huge numbers of beds - this was intentionally excluded from Boris’s ICU estimations. Infection rate is dropping in Manchester. Price per head of population for T3 support, GM is being shat on, which is what AB is fighting for. This government is abominable, utterly incompetent and just driving division.

I had a very privileged upbringing and I’ve done ok since I’ve been married so I’ve never known hunger, or holes in my shoes, or being cold or not being able to do Christmas for my kids, but that’s what many in Greater Manchester are now facing. It’s so wrong. There’s been money wasted left, right and centre during this Covid crisis but Boris and his mates don’t give two hoots about that, but we can’t possibly find £5m, which let’s face it is a drop in the ocean, to help the ordinary man in the street. It’s beyond me

But Greater Manchester is not the only deprived place in the north and he was asking to for GM to get special treatment, more money. It will also not be the last to go into tier 3

People here might agree with Burnham on other issues, I do on some things, but his tier 3 refusal has divided people. Not everyone in the north, or GM, agrees with him this time.

But Greater Manchester is not the only deprived place in the north and he was asking to for GM to get special treatment, more money. It will also not be the last to go into tier 3

He wasn’t asking for more money than everywhere else. He was asking for the same, that wasn’t offered. The £65 million was less. Now this sets a precedent for the other areas. It’s bad for all of us.