Are more people following the rules now?

[Watermelon999]

Just that really......

Anyone still not following the rules?

What are your reasons/ rationale.

On a side note, even when they have gone there is no way I will stick to the rules. We are social creatures, we aren’t designed to not socialise. I’m not going to stop seeing friends and family in my house.

If you're in tier 2 or 3, this just makes a mockery of all the sacrifices other people (like me) continue to make.

We are following rules pretty well. We are in Scotland so no mixing indoors in houses at all but can meet in cafes/pubs etc. We are in a university town where students make up a lot of the population so we are choosing to meet outdoors rather than in pubs/cafes . We’ve just got better clothes and are going outside regardless of the weather which is good I guess, making us tough 🥶
The problem i have is that I don’t think it’s sensible that I can take my kids the trampoline park or pool, they can go to school, all with loads of people but I can’t have one of their friends over after school which is way less risky. I think as the nights get darker I may start just risk assessing sensibly if nothing changes. In Scotland under 12s don’t have to social distance at all so I think you should be allowed to have them in your house. That’s the only rule I’m bothered about. I can cut my socialising down to outside walks etc but kids need be able to play properly.

@AllieCat26 will you start following rules when your dad (or someone else important to you) has hospital scans/treatment delayed due to a lack of capacity caused solely by Covid19, which was almost certainly caused by people like you not following the rules?

I'm assessing my own "risk" and acting accordingly. I'm not attending house parties inside, but I wouldn't have been doing that anyway.

As for the rest of it - i've stopped listening to Nicola's daily lectures about how naughty we all are. If my elderly parents decide they want to see us indoors, I will go and see them. I won't stick to an arbitrary line drawn over how far I can travel. I have been for a coffee in someone else's house which isn't allowed in Scotland.

If a MP can get on a train and go to London while waiting for rest results, then travel back knowing she is positive, and face no consequences, then I have lost all faith in the government to tell me what to do. I am an adult and will decide for myself.

Ok, I see! I’m personally responsible for people not getting their medical treatment now? that really is very uncalled for and a low blow. Especially when children are at school mixing it like there is no tomorrow, and we were all told to go and ‘eat out to help out’., and the contract tracing scheme is in tatters.

I always wear a mask where I am meant to wear one. I haven’t ever met in more than six people. I have followed EVERY rule to date, but god forbid I want someone in my home and I am now the one to be blamed for causing people having their medical treatment stopped. 😡I can only hope you exercise more empathy in real life.

bibbitybobbitycats

The other thing about not following the rules is that it is giving Johnson a get out of jail free card. When things go even more tits up, he will blame the public.

You are so right. I hadn’t even thought of that. Makes me even more determined!

Johnson will blame whatever he wants to regardless of what we all do - that's politics!

I have followed the rules/guidance throughout as is DH and our teen DC. However, we seem to be in the minority among many people including friends, extended family, work colleagues and facebook friends who all always seem to be bending the rules, deliberately misinterpreting the rules to suit themselves and own behaviours.

I think now that numbers have increased more people are following the rules so that we don't end up like Liverpool or Manchester.

Every restaurant I have done at or bar is stringent with track and trace or taking details, mask wearing, hand sanitiser. People I know are not mixing in larger groups. Having seen the consequences of university students Exeter and their spike in numbers then the vast majority in this area seem to be doing what they can to keep infection rate low

Johnson will blame the public no matter what. Judging by the comments here, the government's persistent rhetoric of 'its up to you following our rules to control this virus .... rather than us admitting a virus cannot be controlled' has worked a charm.

For those of you thinking the spread is down to people mixing in households, do you think the sudden rise in casea from september, when schools started back, universities went back, and workplaces and offices were told to go back, were just coincidence? News outlets were clearly showing last week that over 60% of transmission was down to these three places. 11% maximum was from people in your home, and that was included in international travel and unknown sources.

I really wish people would read actual statistics and evidence and use their sense as opposed to just believing everything the government says.

Allycat

Oh goodness. I’m so sorry if that’s how it came across. It’s not what I meant at all. I haven’t read your posts so sorry if it sounded like it was personal. I was adding to the debate as I’m genuinely worried about the impact on mental health in lots of ways. I see it first hand.

I think everyone should be following the rules as much as they possibly can. Some will be able to do it to a greater extent than others. I also agree that the English rules have been nonsensical a lot of the time. I also agree that for some, the rules are so detrimental to their mental health, that I can see that it’s too hard to adhere to them 100% - but wanted to warn about some, perhaps unpredicted, risks to mental health from breaking the rules. I know someone wracked with guilt about passing the virus on to someone who then died and there were no rules at that stage. It’s honestly awful for them.

I do have to say though, that the fact is that we are all now responsible for how well the NHS can look after us all in the next few months. It’s just how it is, sadly. The less we mix together, the slower the spread. I think research is showing that primary age children aren’t spreading it much at all.

I am not saying to follow the rules rigidly if it’s going to be detrimental to your mental health in a serious way or trying to make anyone feel bad if they can’t. Just adding a perhaps unthought about future consequence on mental health of breaking the rules.

“Do what we possibly can” whatever our personal circumstances is what I am saying, then we will know ‘we did what we could’ and feel good about our response regardless of the consequences.

So sorry if I my words were hurtful in anyway. Honestly wasn’t my intention. Hard to portray complex things in a few words. I wish you the very best.

I am, because they work with my circumstances, but I don't know many that are. If I needed to do something outside the rules I'd do my own risk assessment, which would be far more science based than the government's rules.

I can't stand this blame game that's everywhere. It's currently aimed at students, but it's older people I see that aren't complying. I don't blame either group, and I do believe that most are doing the best they can in such uncertain and ill-led times.

I'm in tier 1 , i wear a mask but don't believe it does much , wash my hands and pay attention to hygiene ,always have done anyway .
I lead a fairly simple life , at the moment pretty much work and 1 food shop in a week, but regards family /friends certainly don't go wild but will see family and happy to have people in my house .
We are a family of 5 so if breaching rule of 6 occurs that's fine with me.
I have no faith / trust whatsoever in what we are being told so i will continue to asses my own risk's.
I have broken the rules and will carry on doing so if its in the interests of my family .

Yes. We're in tier 2 but before we couldn't meet anyone from another household inside anywhere I met up with a freind in a pub when it was against guidance not against the law. I wouldn't do that now.
I don't like not seeing freinds and family inside but it is necessary to slow the spread down and stop hospitals becoming ovwewhelmed. So I will suck it up for a bit longer!
I'm angry the politicians have broken so many rules and guffawed about late night drinking in the commons and letting Cummings get away with his crap as people are pretty non compliant as a result of their bad example.
But the family I do see very carefully are vulnerable so my visits are care and support - but we sit very far apart next to an open door to protect them. I'm just hoping they get vaccinated first on the list as they were shielded so I can stop worrying so much about accidentally killing them!

SqidgeBum

The evidence and statistics are mixed. With any body of scientific evidence there will be different models, data collection methods, differing hypotheses, different ways of analysing and differing bias in how it’s written up. For us to make our own decisions based on the current evidence base we would need to read thousands of papers, have the background to both understand them and critique them and then decide. I doubt many of us have the knowledge base, skills and time to do that?

I think the basic idea that the more we spend time with others, indoors, the more likely we are to get it/spread it, is pretty clear though isn’t it? It’s just common sense.

Then the more it spreads, the more there are hospitalisations and the less we are all able to access the healthcare we might need.

So surely, regardless of this figure or that, this paper or that, which politicians are travelling with it via trains Etc, it’s common sense to limit our indoor social interactions as much as we can. For our own sakes?

So all those who are breaking rules and still seeing people inside, do you not worry that you might have Covid and will spread it?

I really don’t get the Cummings/Ferrier argument. I think people are just using that as an excuse to break the rules. Of course it’s bad but doesn’t mean we all need to sink to their depths!

@NaturalLight funny enough, no. I would be more worried if I was going in to work in a school or office every day, or travelling on a bus, or had kids in school. Funny enough, all those things are apparently ok according to the government. I worry DD may spread it in nursery so she has stayed home a few times as a precaution. But I never seem to worry about seeing the 3 households I see indoors.

I think many aren’t and it’s only going to get worse as it gets colder outside. All the talk of risk assessment but unless you don’t go to work, shops, schools etc then you can’t risk assess this just for yourself.

We have stuck to the rules throughout. I want the NHS to have capacity to treat those that need it, not just for Covid. It took months before routine smears etc were back up and running. I want people to have access to those as health is really important. So for me, I’d rather have less of a social life and have our health and access to medical care.

Tier 3 continuing to see parents and in laws but not as much as usual perhaps once a fortnight rather than several times a week thats about it.

In terms of risk assessment what is necessary for ds's safety is absolute. Our situation is not like the vast majority families and we have to use our own judgement about is required and the law does allow flexibility for that reason.

@Msmcc1212

SqidgeBum

The evidence and statistics are mixed. With any body of scientific evidence there will be different models, data collection methods, differing hypotheses, different ways of analysing and differing bias in how it’s written up. For us to make our own decisions based on the current evidence base we would need to read thousands of papers, have the background to both understand them and critique them and then decide. I doubt many of us have the knowledge base, skills and time to do that?

I think the basic idea that the more we spend time with others, indoors, the more likely we are to get it/spread it, is pretty clear though isn’t it? It’s just common sense.

Then the more it spreads, the more there are hospitalisations and the less we are all able to access the healthcare we might need.

So surely, regardless of this figure or that, this paper or that, which politicians are travelling with it via trains Etc, it’s common sense to limit our indoor social interactions as much as we can. For our own sakes?

Our individual circumstances are all different. You cannot declare the "common sense" approach for every person in the country is to limit social interactions indoors. What is doable for one may be totally untenable for another.

We're all human beings with the (alleged) freedom to make decisions based on our own assessment and tolerance of risks. I don't need to be told by boffins like Vallance and Whitty how to run my life.

At present, the risk of dying from COVID is, for a non-vulnerable individual, around the same as being killed on a bicycle. It's important to put things into context when discussing "common sense" precautions.

My circle is small, and my DCs needs will always come before that of the masses. All of those carrying on like you're responsible for the health of the entire country can continue to do so if you wish, but I will no longer shoulder that burden. I'll do what I need to do to follow guidelines when out in public but what happens in my own family unit is my business, not the government's.

@SqidgeBum

Johnson will blame the public no matter what. Judging by the comments here, the government's persistent rhetoric of 'its up to you following our rules to control this virus .... rather than us admitting a virus cannot be controlled' has worked a charm.

For those of you thinking the spread is down to people mixing in households, do you think the sudden rise in casea from september, when schools started back, universities went back, and workplaces and offices were told to go back, were just coincidence? News outlets were clearly showing last week that over 60% of transmission was down to these three places. 11% maximum was from people in your home, and that was included in international travel and unknown sources.

I really wish people would read actual statistics and evidence and use their sense as opposed to just believing everything the government says.

@SqidgeBum Do you have links to those stats please, as this must have passed me by last week. Thanks.

@NaturalLight no I don't. I've worked from home constantly since mid March. Followed all the original lockdown rules. During the week rarely leave the house except supermarket and gym once or twice a week. So meeting a friend in their house or mine (who are following a similar lifestyle to me) doesn't make me worry about giving or catching Coronavirus. To be honest it doesn't even enter my mind. I wear my mask, I wash my hands regularly and 90% of the time am only with my own household.