I'm calling it - people aren't complying.

[TheFormattingIsWrong]

Local lockdowns aren't working. The North has proven that. Why would it be different in London or anywhere else for that matter? People have stopped complying. They did it in March when it was implied by Bojo that it was going to be a 3 month thing, but as it has become abundantly clear that that this is going to be a way of living until there is a vaccine, and there is no guarantee on a vaccine, people have just said sod it then, I'm not living that way.

I won't be complying. I'll be continuing to see my mum and my sisters. I'd obey it to the letter if it was a 2 week circuit breaker, but as it's clear we're going to have to live this way until at least next Spring, no, I won't be complying.

And for those who say "oh well that's why cases are going up" - until this government kicks itself up the arse and gets a functioning test and trace system in place, they always would anyway. Either it's lockdown or it's cases rising. And most of us aren't prepared to live without seeing family or friends (yes, indoors!) until Spring.

I just can't understand why people aren't more furious about test and trace

Its easier for people to blame those around them and make villains out of their neighbour for wanting to hug their parents than it is to hold the government to account for twiddling their thumbs and handing contracts to their mates.

I agree. It has gone on too long. There is no definite plan. We have been lied to numerous times. Any form of locking down is simply not going to work now. The time for that when people did comply has gone.

And large swathes of the general public have no respect for anyone but themselves it seems

hmmm that was a tenuous connection there @Bluesheep8 - not sure how that has anything to do with theatres being shut.

I think it's got to the point now where it's just farcical. If any of it made any logical sense, I could agree. As it stands, I don't see how anyone with a brain thinks this is acceptable.

Plus, the government have done an utterly fantastic job at setting up the rhetoric that we, the public, are fully responsible for the spread of a virus. They have, from the start, made it our job to fix this. Never have they admitted the fact that this is a VIRUS, so by definition, it will spread. We never blamed people around us for getting colds, but apparently now we can all beat invisible nature.

@pontypridd

And btw, both France and Spain have managed to keep their theatres open.

Why are our theatres shut when hoards of people can sit and chat in a pub all night?

Theatres would be a perfect place to socially distance. All facing forward (like in schools now supposedly). No mixing of households.

Why are they shut?

Because they're not viable if they're not full or nearly full. If they can't even cover their costs due to restricted numbers, why would they open just to make a loss? Where would the money come from to cover the loss?

My area is tier 2 with mutterings that we may go into tier 3 quite soon. I have no intention of breaking the rules however it's ridiculous that 2 people from different house holds can work closely together yet nip for a pint after work and are forced to sit at separate tables.
Madness!

I'm with you.

Here here Op, I won't be complying with it either. I complied to it to the dot and realised this virus isn't going anywhere. I have lost my business. I have lost my mental health. I have lost my social life and holidays for what? For the NHS that was full of nurses having enough time to do tik
tok videos during the peak? For cancer patients and other Ill patients not getting vital treatments because of COvid being a priority despite Covid wards being empty? No. I've sacrificed too much and therefore won't be complying. And I am yet to know one person to have had this. Enough!

Discussions like this make me wonder - where do people draw the line? Is there a line over which you would not step, a point at which you would say no more?

It's obvious that many people have already reached their line and many people have not yet. But surely everyone has a line? Does liberty have any value at all and do the harms of lockdown measures have any weight?

I don't live in the UK any more so I'm not fully in step with exactly what restrictions are being imposed on you right now, but I'm not following all the rules any more, just the ones I have absolutely no choice about and the ones that suit me anyway. For me the scales tipped too far.

But let's not forget, there are people who've refused to provide contact details, refuse to answer their phone to withheld numbers and refuse to isolate even when they've been told they've got it

People don't obey because the govt gives them reasons not too, we ve shite leadership and like an army led by poor generals, we rebel, we ve lost respect for these people.

I have no intention of breaking the rules however it's ridiculous that 2 people from different house holds can work closely together yet nip for a pint after work and are forced to sit at separate tables.
Madness!

So why not break the rules @Popcornismandatory?

If it's madness and makes no sense ... if it will make no difference ... why follow the rules?

I think it's fine so long as your happy to stay at home and potentially die at home should you become ill and don't intend to pass the consequences of your actions onto the doctors and nurses. You will of course made a choice for all those you come in contact with by upping your risk level. This isn't about personal choice because your choice affects everyone.

@SqidgeBum

I just can't understand why people aren't more furious about test and trace

Its easier for people to blame those around them and make villains out of their neighbour for wanting to hug their parents than it is to hold the government to account for twiddling their thumbs and handing contracts to their mates.

I'm more furious about the huge numbers of people who've refused to download the NHS covid app, or who've deliberately bought/dug out old phones that it won't work on, or who pretend not to have a mobile phone, all so that they have an excuse not to scan-in at a pub or restaurant and then write false details on the signing-in sheet.

I haven’t been complying because I seriously don’t understand how I can go to work in a school and be around a thousand children in very close proximity (with little in the way of SD or PPE), and my child can go to another school around over a thousand more children...yet it’s absolutely vital that I don’t see my own mother and father who live in the middle of nowhere.

It’s not just ridiculous that we’re being asked to do this, it’s shocking. And it’s unfair.

I am not living to work, I work to live, so I’m just not willing to only prioritise that single (and the least enjoyable) part of my life.

@IcedPurple

This was predicted all along.

The longer restrictions remain in place, the more additional 'rules' are added on, taken away then added on a week later, the more people will think 'Fuck it!' and no longer pay heed. And obviously, resentment among those directly affected - such as those working in hospitality - is going to grow, and it's hard to blame them for feeling this way.

"All in this together" is fine as far as it goes, but there is a limit to what you can expect people can do to 'protect' people they have never met. This was known all along. I think most people will reluctantly go along with a few more months of this, but I doubt people will want another spring and summer like the ones we've just been through.

This. And I say that as a nurse who was redeployed to the front line from my education post in March for 4 months and my partner is front line health care staff. The number of people testing positive is on the rise (massively) only because we are testing more people. The death rate is not rising significantly. And whilst I really feel for people with eldrely relatives, most are dying less than a year before they would anyway. We really are at the point where the treatment is worse than the disease.

Interesting how people are quick to point the finger of blame at The North & say how badly Northern people are behaving, how selfish they are etc for not complying with lockdown restrictions, but in the next sentence say that they themselves will not be complying, will be seeing family etc, as they don't want to have to live this way until at least next Spring, there's no guarantee of a vaccine anytime soon, etc etc.

Frankly my personal likelihood of catching covid given I don't go to shops, don't have a child in school and work from home and only see others in the same boat is pretty much nil.

My NDNs haven't been out in months. One is a disabled teen, their college course has been suspended since spring, & the parent (also shielding due to severe illness) has WFH since Feb or March, I forget. They only see people at the door for deliveries, & care assistants come to the driveway weekly for a chat to check they're coping (but don't go in). They just tested positive for covid. No idea how they got it, probably on something the surface of something that was delivered, or someone was an asymptomatic carrier. Never say never...

@TheFormattingIsWrong
I'm not sure I follow your argument in your last post. Can you explain how you not complying with the restrictions benefits any of those people you've mentioned? Labouring women, the mentally ill, the elderly etc.

The restrictions are about ensuring the most basic welfare services don't become overwhelmed and cease to function. They're about ensuring labouring women can access midwives to help deliver their babies, ensuring there are enough staff to care for the elderly in care homes, that children can still receive an education.

I understand you disagree with the restrictions and how effective they might be, but I don't think advocating non-compliance is an effective or even logical form of protest.

@everybodysang

this is a very depressing thread. You all know you're being selfish and you just don't care. Why is it harder for you than everyone else?

Honestly, because you're correct: we are past caring. We know we will be taxed to death to pay for the economic collapse and that's before we make it worse by introducing further lockdowns. We choose to see our families because it matters more to us than following unenforceable guidelines/laws. We don't believe following these arbitrary rules will make a big difference. So we won't comply.

Plus, My dad is 85. If he lives another 5 years, fab. But he’s already outlived the average life expectancy so he’s not fussed.

Fair enough, as long as he knows it can be a horrible way to die.
People don't just fall asleep and not wake up.
I've had an elderly relative die from covid. He was very frightened and fighting for breath.

Everybody is going to do what they think is best we have a lot of elderly and sick people in this country who need shielding if the virus gets out of hand and we won't have enough intensive care facilities for everyone as it will be clogged up with covid patients . I think just try be sensible meaning if your displaying any symtoms stay at home. I hoping it will be ending in sept 2021 as in history says 18 months pandemic.

This. And I say that as a nurse who was redeployed to the front line from my education post in March for 4 months and my partner is front line health care staff. The number of people testing positive is on the rise (massively) only because we are testing more people

The infection rate is worked out by per capita
The number per 100,000. It has nothing to do with increased testing. It's the rate by population and how quickly that rate is increasing

@WickerBeetle

Discussions like this make me wonder - where do people draw the line? Is there a line over which you would not step, a point at which you would say no more?

It's obvious that many people have already reached their line and many people have not yet. But surely everyone has a line? Does liberty have any value at all and do the harms of lockdown measures have any weight?

I don't live in the UK any more so I'm not fully in step with exactly what restrictions are being imposed on you right now, but I'm not following all the rules any more, just the ones I have absolutely no choice about and the ones that suit me anyway. For me the scales tipped too far.

That's why we end up with more severe actions. I.e. if people won't social distance in pubs, and the pub management won't enforce existing rules, then the pubs get closed, either on an individual or local/regional basis. It's why Paris is now under a curfew. Why Madrid is under a state of emergency. If people don't follow the rules voluntarily, then ultimately, they get forced to do so.

Discussions like this make me wonder - where do people draw the line? Is there a line over which you would not step, a point at which you would say no more?

It's not so much where they draw the line, as in what lies over the line. If you feel you have absolutely no future in sight, you might not have the same sensibilities as if you feel there's something worth going on for. It's how armies have been recruited since time immemorial.

The fear that people have over this, those who are healthy and well, is mind boggling. The cure is worse than the disease indeed.

I'd be interested to know how many children die or are seriously unwell after contracting chicken pox or being in car accidents versus the number that have been seriously affected by covid. No one doesn't drive their child about on the off chance they may die in a crash.

This isn't going anywhere, no matter how many national or local lockdowns we have, and one of those reasons is people are fed up. I wonder if people would comply more if the social restrictions hadn't ever been so tough. I really don't anyone to lose their jobs but personally on a day to day basis I can live without pubs, cafes, theatres, cinemas, I care about seeing my friends and family and ds going to school.