With no vaccination imminent, how long are we going to keep doing this?

[RubyandBen]

Disrupted education that will impact on some DC forever, sending perfectly healthy DC home from school for 2 weeks again and again, lockdown of university students who will only have mild symptoms (I know there's always one or two who suffer more but the vast majority won't), destroying whole industries hospitality, travel, retail, hundreds of thousands unemployed, huge recession. Not even going to mention the long term impact on all the OTHER non covid illnesses that have been shelved.
If there's no vaccination imminent what's the plan? Are we going to carry on in this horrible limbo that's going to destroy too much or admit defeat and realise people will die?
Before I'm accused of being a mass murderer, I've followed all the rules but don't know how much more I can take of this.

@toxtethOgradyUSA

It's only the I'm-alright-jack brigade that wants to return to lockdown. The rest of us have bills to pay ...

As do I, but like I say, a short break over half term is easier to manage given we need time off for childcare for that period anyway. Plus we wouldn't be homeschooling for a such a short period of time, which makes working from home a bit more bareable than last time.

But for me, with children potentially in and out constantly at a moments notice that's way more difficult to manage, employers are much less happy to accommodate multiple and frequently requests to work from home or unpaid leave at a moments notice.

But I guess everyone's circumstances are different, it's not about "I'm alright" so screw everyone else, it's basically, I'm not alright and about to lose my job or the fact someone is clinically vulnerable and much more likely to be affected right now. Very few of us are doing alright.

It's just one, at least in my mind, seems less destructive than the current situation.

Exactly OP, exactly!

@Requinblanc

The simple answer is that we can't carry on like this.

People will accept a few more months of this maybe but at that point compliance and society will break down.

There is a lot of naivety in thinking a vaccine will magically appear in the Spring and everything will go back to normal and I don't see how people keep swallowing the fairy tale that 'circuit breakers' or lockdowns have any effect beyond a temporary and artificial reduction.

I can't see the rational in putting an entire population under house arrest and removing everything that makes us human (such as interaction with others) for something that the majority of people can survive.

The general trashing of the economy, the mental health crisis and so on will kill more people than the virus will.

Shield the elderly and the vulnerable (although they should have a say in this too), the rest of us need to start living again.

There is no scenario here where no one dies. It is fantasy to believe otherwise.

Agree. With each additional lockdown more people will be pissed off that the virus just spreads again after its been lifted. And I know its to control the spread but at the end of the day people don't see it like that. Compliance will be less and less each time. I have noticed a huge difference here in Scotland in compliance between March and now where we are not allowed to visit others houses. Most people I know just aren't following that rule frankly.

Another milestone where people give up will be the year anniversary of lockdown.

Someone said to me , and I believe this is true: lockdown ends when the people decide it ends. I also believe 100% that people will not live this way indefinitely without civil unrest soon.

We all know the arguments on all sides and there has to be a balance as best as can possibly be between health, wealth and education.

And every household is going to sacrifice something. Some more than others.

The help from government needs to be targeted to those who stand to lose the most. And it won't save everyone we can only strive to save as many as possible.

Personally if I catch Covid-19 and need medical intervention to survive it I want it to be there, the kids can repeat a year at school, I would rather that than their dad or I don't see them finish school. Being totally morbid. But whether this will be an option if ever required is out of my hands. So we try not to catch an invisible, teeny-tiny virus. That I might have already have had who knows?

We just cling to the possibly misguided hope there will be a vaccine or effective treatment dispensed by a chemist sometime in the not too distant future.

@frozendaisy the kids can repeat a year at school
No they can't.

@frozendaisy that comment make me so annoyed and it shows a complete disregard for this generation of DC.

Actually they could repeat a year if the government implemented it correctly.

It would solve the off/on education that some are receiving now.

@TheEmojiFormerlyKnownAsPrince so what about all the children that would need to start in reception next year? Where would they go? Or would they repeat a year of childcare? At whose cost?

Would universities not open for a year because the upper 6th are repeating

@TheEmojiFormerlyKnownAsPrince

Actually they could repeat a year if the government implemented it correctly.

It would solve the off/on education that some are receiving now.

How would this be possible? What about the children starting reception next year? There would have to be room for a whole extra year group.

There is no nhs dentistry here, NW. Very basic real emergency treatment only. Private seems ok I had a check up last wk.
Been getting prescription from gp I don't know how accessible they are for treatment

@TheEmojiFormerlyKnownAsPrince and what do you want them to do for the next year while they're waiting to restart the year?

I said they could repeat a year if the government implemented it by building extra temporary classrooms. Students this year could be given the option to defer to next year. There would be one year of low numbers at university.

Initially (I’m a teacher) l was dead set against this. Absolutely against it. But so many bubble are popping and students getting disrupted education that it is really becoming a very unlevel playing field. Some schools aren’t closing at all, and some are constantly closing. At GCSE and A level this is totally unfair. They should all be getting equal treatment.

I don’t have the answer to what to do with the children. But as someone who is on education, the constant disruption in the high level areas is having a huge impact.

I’m trying to say that some children are still getting no education and some are getting perfect education. This needs to be addressed somehow.

When I see a post saying Hospitals, GPs and dentists are shut I think I must live in a parallel universe
Enjoy it.

Here GP surgery refusing anything but online form to get in touch and then they will contact you within 48 hours.

I have broken my front tooth and dentist has no idea when they will be able to see me. (Maybe at Easter??)

@MummyPop00

People saying society would cease to function if we don’t have lockdowns. If it got that bad have we not got a rapidly increasing amount of unemployed to call upon? Students? Recovered retirees? Society wouldn’t ‘implode’ as this disease mainly affects those above working age does it not? And there are a lot of asymptomatic cases out there.

Not saying the NHS wouldn’t be up against the cosh - it obviously would be - but this ‘society would completely implode’ is a little OTT imo.

And even society did ‘implode’, it would be over a lot quicker wouldn’t it? What happened after the 1918 pandemic? Did we carry on or completely implode?

I would call the great depression and ww2 "implode", yes.

[quote RubyandBen]@frozendaisy that comment make me so annoyed and it shows a complete disregard for this generation of DC.[/quote]
Ok then have some exam kids sitting the same exams with completely different taught hours, that really helps towards a level playing field.

Everyone is so selfish right now, that all my care of outside our household has evaporated at the moment. We don't have GCSE, A level or university children right now. If we did and ours missed big chunks they would resit a year.

Just saying you can catch up with education, slightly harder to recover if you lose a parent. I know which issue I would rather deal with IF it comes down to that binary choice and would support measures that mean as many children keep their parents as possible. So yeah a real disregard for this generation.

Until we are at a stage where an outbreak is unlikely to overwhelm health services.

@randomer

What is your actual plan?

Isn't this why we have an elected government, allegedly headed by a very intelligent man?

Isn't that their job?

Exactly.

It’s not our job to come up with a plan. We have done the government’s job for them enough this year as it is!

No clap for the NHS from me, we have had to pay private for nail surgery for our 13 yo disabled child because the NHS wouldn't see him. He could hardly walk and the a and e doc said he was at risk of sepsis because it was so badly infected. How many people are going to have incurable illness because the NHS is shut down? Unless you have CoVID the NHS don't want to know. I am angry about this

Lockdowns are not an effective strategy to control a pandemic, the fact we are facing them again is a direct result of our inept and corrupt government. Instead of using the time bought by the last lockdown to implement an effective and robust track, trace and isolate system. Our incompetent leaders pissed billions up the wall paying their mates to use fucking excel spreadsheets to track critical clinical data! They continued to argue over crapping Brexit and many other pointless vanity projects. Meanwhile unsurprisingly the virus did what viruses do and continued to spread.
Look at Germany and Italy, the virus is still there but with proper systems in place they can continue life more normally. Do not buy into the idea that lockdowns are inevitable and somehow the fault of students/ pubs/ hugging your granny (as the right wing media will tell you) The sole blame lies at the door of this government and we should not let them get away with it

@Requinblanc

The simple answer is that we can't carry on like this.

People will accept a few more months of this maybe but at that point compliance and society will break down.

There is a lot of naivety in thinking a vaccine will magically appear in the Spring and everything will go back to normal and I don't see how people keep swallowing the fairy tale that 'circuit breakers' or lockdowns have any effect beyond a temporary and artificial reduction.

I can't see the rational in putting an entire population under house arrest and removing everything that makes us human (such as interaction with others) for something that the majority of people can survive.

The general trashing of the economy, the mental health crisis and so on will kill more people than the virus will.

Shield the elderly and the vulnerable (although they should have a say in this too), the rest of us need to start living again.

There is no scenario here where no one dies. It is fantasy to believe otherwise.

This! Unfortunately

People have got no idea how much training, staffing levels, professionals, equipment and resources go into looking after even the less sickest of patients... it’s quite shocking

But yep stick the unemployed or retired in the nightingales or hospitals or force NHS staff to move. Then when their quieter hospitals spike send them back Fucking hell.

@tootiredtobeinspired completely agree!

[quote Char2015]@Worriedmum999

You are incorrect. The 'oxford vaccine person' poster is referring to is the leader of the trial. He is part of Oxford and not part of the government as you say. He will be liaising with people from the vaccine taskforce as the head of the trial and this is what you would expect.[/quote]
Oh sorry, there was another article today which was the one I thought you were referring to. I have read the one by Andrew Pollard now. My points though still stand. It will take time to roll it out to everyone but things should start looking better by the first part of next year if the vaccine is successful.