I'm so angry...

[MaryShelley1818]

We are in an area with local restrictions so high transmission rates in the North East of England.

Someone I know had her 40th at the weekend and photos on FB of her having a party in a pub, cake presents, her and kids, her parents, her sister who works at a local University in a very high position, and about 4-5 friends. No Social Distancing, drinking, cuddling, shots, photos.
How are people just carrying on as normal??!! How can you be so bloody thick as to post all the photos on FB. Am I missing something?? I'm furious.

We've followed every single rule but seems I'm in the minority and the longer people just do whatever they want for, the longer I'll have to go without seeing my friends and family.

I think this thread really does sum up the problem the government has!

It wants to follow both scientific opinion (which is split) and electoral opinion (even more split) whilst balancing out keeping the economy going and protecting the NHS (and lives)

All that’s being asked at the moment is people stick to the rule of 6, it’s not difficult.

That’s not all that’s being asked where I live. We are banned from seeing anyone from another household again. And may stay this way until Christmas. That is a lot to ask. We’ve also given up regular religious worship, anything approaching acceptable standards of care for non-COVID illness, having immediate family at weddings... The list goes on and on. Thousands have lost their jobs, and are facing the potential loss of their homes, ability to feed their children. And then we get to a video doing the rounds of twitter, showing a man being told off in the middle of his dad’s funeral for comforting his grieving mother. In many cases, the restrictions aren’t just irritating, they are inhumane.

Enoughnowstop

Well said

@vanillandhoney

Schools, most jobs and social lives are normal though. Isn't that more important than travelling?

Depends if you have family overseas that you can't see for the foreseeable future, I guess.

Not all foreign travel is for people to go and lie on a beach and get drunk.

Well I'm fucked both ways then and nobody cares about me apparantly. My sisters live in Melbourne, I won't be seeing them this year or probably the next. I'm very vulnerable but with so many people not being cautious about Covid I have to stay away from everyone (and had medical advice to do so). I would like to see someone other than my husband. Would like to see my dad again. Or a friend. But as a vulnerable person I'm badically improsoned in my home.

But hey, as long as you can go where you want.

The Gov have NOT lost control of the virus, for the simple reason they cannot control a virus in the first place.
Unfortunately, it is not possible to lock people up forever, because things happen; e.g;
people's boiler's burst and need fixing,
babies get born,
children go to school,
we go shopping, etc

Originally lockdown was to 'save the NHS', now it has morphed into some kind of complete suppression of the virus, which is not possible.
So, I am trying to keep to the rules, but it looks as if some people are deciding for themselves

I'd be scared of getting snitched up by my neighbours if I did anything wrong but I do understand why people break the rules.

Just to add, I’ve already had an ambulance take my child to hospital in the last few days and the A&E was packed. The nursing staff could not have been more patient and kind with here. I want to know where everyone lives that has these empty hospitals. While we haven’t been able to see one of her consultants (different medical issue) due to them wanting to keep COVID out of their unit, I’ve had an excellent an excellent phone appointment with them. I just want to thank the NHS staff for all you do, even though the so many of the selfish, spoilt and fickle public seem to have turned against you.

@Oodlesofnoodles20

“I wonder how all of you who are not following the rules would feel if someone died because of you.“

Honestly it would be as much their responsibility as it is mine. I don’t force my parents to come round, they do so because they have also weighed up the risks and have decided that it’s one they’ll chance.

This.... And also sometimes people die, young and out of the blue. In their sleep, in their cars, from accidents, from other illnesses. We don't know how long we have. We have to make each day count.

@DeliciouslyFemale I’m so sorry you had such a scary experience with your wee one and I hope they’re doing ok

Purely from my experience, my SIL is a nursing auxiliary at one of Ayrshire’s biggest hospitals and it is very quiet, much more so than usual. Their Covid ward wasn’t used.

@TheDailyCarbuncle

👏👏👏

Thanks for being a voice of reason. I just can't see the logic in:

"Hey public, if you don't socialise and do these things that spread the virus, then we will allow you to socialise and do these things that spread the virus quicker."

Its a fucking farce. To expect thousands of years of human psychology to change in order to control a virus doing what a virus does is insanity. What's being done to old people in care homes is fucking disgusting, not being allowed to hold hands with their partners of 50 years. People are fed up and are making their own decisions, they don't want to live this joyless life.

@milveycrohn

The Gov have NOT lost control of the virus, for the simple reason they cannot control a virus in the first place. Unfortunately, it is not possible to lock people up forever, because things happen; e.g; people's boiler's burst and need fixing, babies get born, children go to school, we go shopping, etc

Originally lockdown was to 'save the NHS', now it has morphed into some kind of complete suppression of the virus, which is not possible.
So, I am trying to keep to the rules, but it looks as if some people are deciding for themselves

And none of those things have to involve more than six people being in close proximity.

There is a reason that the virus is spreading in the North East and other similar areas - spreading in people's homes.

Following the rule of six doesn't mean the end of everything. And it isn't trying to "supress" the virus. I don't go out of my way to get 'flu, and I'm not going out of my way to "live normally" because, guess what, there's a pandemic going on.

Nobody is going back to how they used to live, its not going to happen.
War, plague and technological advancement are always the things that have fundamentally changed the way lives are lived.
You might not like it but friends and extended family are going to be more of a virtual part of life now.
Life has changed for good -what you consider normal human things are no longer normal human things. It sucks but you will get used to it.

This is the sort of pessimism that can be just as dangerous as denialism. If people think there is no hope of going back to anything like a normal life ever again, then eventually they'll start saying 'oh fuck it, what's the use of taking any precautions?!' If they think that they will eventually go back to something like a normal life, they are far more likely to see the point in being careful for the time being. After all, even without a vaccine or effective treatment at that time, the Spanish flu eventually receded.

Things won't go back to EXACTLY what they were before; but things never do stay EXACTLY the same as in the past. There will probably be more flexible working procedures; more use of technology; more concern about hygiene and handwashing; and unfortunately quite a bit of economic damage for a while. But we won't always be in 'pandemic mode'.

At least that's what I need to think to keep me going; but it's also what most of my friends who work in medical areas say.

All that’s being asked at the moment is people stick to the rule of 6, it’s not difficult.

That’s not what is being asked of millions of people around the country. It’s currently illegal for me to have a cup of tea with my mum.

Not sure, I’m alright Jack.

Its a fucking farce. To expect thousands of years of human psychology to change in order to control a virus doing what a virus does is insanity.

Yes but there have been quarantines before, even before the medieval period. I believe even the word quarantine comes from the times of plague. When whole streets or even villages were placed in lockdown

70,000 years bc, some catastrophe, a virus or volcano, almost wiped out the human race, leaving only a tiny percent of survivors (our ancestors)

What makes us think we're so special now? Do we think it will just disappear because we want to go on holiday, or to the pub or restaurant. Celebrate in large gatherings for Xmas or birthdays, get married in a big ceremony in a packed church. No it's an ongoing massive crisis

Did somebody say the government have lost control of the virus? Of course they haven't. When I sit in the pub, I remove my mask, when I walk around I wear it. What happens if I have one bum cheek on the chair and the other off it?

Nobody controls a virus.

The government have lost all credibility and lost control and respect of the population.

@GregariousMountains

I don't think people are going to keep going because of fear of Covid. It will be because this is now how it is. Humanity very rarely if ever takes a step backwards- not all of what we consider progress was considered progress by people who wanted their lives to 'go back to normal' after whatever event. Regards concerts - yes unfortunately I don't see them coming back, along with large scale sporting event crowds and theatres. By the time the government allow them (if indeed they do) with sufficient crowds to be economically viable to many venues will have gone bust.

Too bad for the people that happen to work in those industries, hm?

@GregariousMountains

I don't think people are going to keep going because of fear of Covid. It will be because this is now how it is. Humanity very rarely if ever takes a step backwards- not all of what we consider progress was considered progress by people who wanted their lives to 'go back to normal' after whatever event. Regards concerts - yes unfortunately I don't see them coming back, along with large scale sporting event crowds and theatres. By the time the government allow them (if indeed they do) with sufficient crowds to be economically viable to many venues will have gone bust.

Too bad for the people that happen to work in those industries, hm?

[quote AgentCooper]@DeliciouslyFemale I’m so sorry you had such a scary experience with your wee one and I hope they’re doing ok

Purely from my experience, my SIL is a nursing auxiliary at one of Ayrshire’s biggest hospitals and it is very quiet, much more so than usual. Their Covid ward wasn’t used.[/quote]
Thank you. The pandemic certainly does add a new level of worry. It probably depends on what kind of nursing your SIL unit/ward does. If she isn’t looking after those with life threatening or urgent illnesses, then those in charge won’t want to take in none urgent cases, to prevent the risk of COVID. One of our local hospitals had a COVID outbreak on their cardiology wards, of all places!

Nobody is going back to how they used to live, its not going to happen.
War, plague and technological advancement are always the things that have fundamentally changed the way lives are lived.
You might not like it but friends and extended family are going to be more of a virtual part of life now
Life has changed for good -what you consider normal human things are no longer normal human things. It sucks but you will get used to it.

Well, well.

I hope nobody who's currently weighing up whether or not life is still worth living at all doesn't read this.

Fortunately, it's the kind of weird view peddled by very, very strange people who either want to make everyone else feel even worse than they already feel, or who have a generally peculiar view of the world.

What it makes people who are already inclined to be rule-breakers think is that they'll be buggered if they're going to engage with their families and friends only virtually. If you want to convince people to be cautious, this is the very worst way to do it.

I live in an area where no household can mix in house or garden. I saw on facebook over the weekend somebody celebrating their birthday. First in pub then all back to their place for a drink with friends it infuriated me

Yes but there have been quarantines before, even before the medieval period. I believe even the word quarantine comes from the times of plague. When whole streets or even villages were placed in lockdown

It comes from 14th century Venice, in relation to the plague. It’s quarantine because it was 40 days. 40. Not years. Or months. Days. Not the rest of our lives.

People didn’t stay in those quarantines forever. They returned to socialising with their friends and extended family afterwards. They had to live with the diseases/viruses which caused them (or enough people contracted them that they fizzled out). At no point in human history have human beings permanently changed their natural human behaviours and lived alone or in small households with no mixing whatsoever. We have to go back to some kind of normality because life isn’t worth living for most humans otherwise.

Op Its totally understandable to be angry. In its simplest form its no different than someone blocking in your car, queue jumping, gazumping, partying loudly at 3am, or any of the other selfish convention-ignoring social actions that traditionally make MNers incensed. Except the potential consequences are much greater.

To TheDailyCarbuncle and all the posters declaring the rules are shit and feel the need to ridicule 'zombie-like' compliance. However articulate the statement of your position may be, what exactly would you propose should happen instead? I just want to clarify if you accept that an uncontrolled virus ripping through the population would break health services and result in many preventable deaths. Or are you saying that this wouldnt happen? Or do you have an alternative solution? As far as I understand, it is the lack of rule compliance that is causing the new spike, and necessitating tougher measures, rather than the rules themselves failing. So I am struggling to see how decisions to not comply improves matters, even in terms of mental health benefit.

Interestingly, a New York Times editorial this morning characterised our collective UK response to covid compliance as 'cavalier' and this thread is not persuading me otherwise.

However articulate the statement of your position may be, what exactly would you propose should happen instead? I just want to clarify if you accept that an uncontrolled virus ripping through the population would break health services and result in many preventable deaths. Or are you saying that this wouldnt happen?

They’ll bleat on about herd immunity and ‘it’s only the vulnerable’, to assuage their conscience, or lack of.

@DeliciouslyFemale

I really wish that all the experts on here that know better that the medical experts, were in charge. I’m sure that we’d be absolutely fine once herd immunity - -survival of the fittest- - kicked in. Of course I will have lost my youngest child and quite possibly my oldest, but so long as people can have house parties, that’s then main thing. 🙄 And yes, before you bleat on about I have been horribly financially affected by the COVID situation.

But it's not the medical experts that are in charge, it's clown BJ and this circus show of a govt and in case you haven't notice they have no idea what they're doing. NONE.

At this point I would not be suprised random mumsnetters could do a better job than this govt!

However articulate the statement of your position may be, what exactly would you propose should happen instead? I just want to clarify if you accept that an uncontrolled virus ripping through the population would break health services and result in many preventable deaths. Or are you saying that this wouldnt happen?

Well what is your alternative? Because posters above are saying we accept this is now how we live forever. What do we do after the next lockdown, and the next, and the next? Even the head of the vaccine trials says don’t wait for the vaccine. And it’s probably only going to be given to the vulnerable. So what, do the under 50s have to socially distance for the rest of time? What’s your exit strategy?