I'm so angry...

[MaryShelley1818]

We are in an area with local restrictions so high transmission rates in the North East of England.

Someone I know had her 40th at the weekend and photos on FB of her having a party in a pub, cake presents, her and kids, her parents, her sister who works at a local University in a very high position, and about 4-5 friends. No Social Distancing, drinking, cuddling, shots, photos.
How are people just carrying on as normal??!! How can you be so bloody thick as to post all the photos on FB. Am I missing something?? I'm furious.

We've followed every single rule but seems I'm in the minority and the longer people just do whatever they want for, the longer I'll have to go without seeing my friends and family.

People have been handed the responsibility of protecting people from a virus that they may or may not have. They have been told that if they, without any malice or intention, infect another person while going about their everyday life they are personally responsible for that. And in order to prevent it from happening, they have to deny themselves a job, a social life, the potential to travel and meet new people.

Where does that responsibility end? When does it end? When does my being a human, one that can get sick and can pass on illness, stop being a problem? Perhaps everyone should isolate indefinitely to prevent the many millions of other deaths from infection that happen every year? Why don't we care about those deaths? Why don't they count? Why was it ok for me to pass on flu last year and potentially kill someone, but not ok for me to pass on covid this year?

Beyond actual actions I take to hurt you, I am not responsible for your health and you are not responsible for mine. Living means risk, and some of that risk is getting ill. I will not stop living my life to prevent a risk that I can't help posing as human being. I will NOT.

Sally would still feel suicidal if her grandma down the road got sick with Coronavirus and died. Who is she going to turn to now?

It's not my new normal at all. I hate living like this. I'm depressed, lonely and isolated.
You really are just trying to be insulting because it's clear that I'm upset because I'm following the restrictions. I'm VERY clearly not happy.
I work in a responsible job though where not following the law isn't an option as has been made clear by many emails.
I guess I could just jack it in, not follow restrictions and stop giving a shit about others and then apparently I'd be a better person according to you.

"Fuck the rules" from people like you is going to keep the rest of us having to follow them for longer. Thanks so much!

I keep seeing this idea expressed in various ways. I genuinely don't understand it. If everyone follows the rules, the infection rate goes down, as it did in the summer, then the rules end and the rate goes up again, as it has done recently. What then? Back to rules? Forever? Where does it end? How does following the rules now make any difference long term? That's a genuine question I keep on asking and not getting an answer to.

Just wear a good mask, wash your hands and keep the party small and distant and you can still see your family

@MaryShelley1818

It's not my new normal at all. I hate living like this. I'm depressed, lonely and isolated. You really are just trying to be insulting because it's clear that I'm upset because I'm following the restrictions. I'm VERY clearly not happy. I work in a responsible job though where not following the law isn't an option as has been made clear by many emails. I guess I could just jack it in, not follow restrictions and stop giving a shit about others and then apparently I'd be a better person according to you.

Who's that directed at? If it's at me, I don't think it's about being a 'better' or 'worse' person.

You're struggling, you need human contact. That's not a failing. You can make a decision for yourself to have that contact. It won't make you a bad person.

And let’s wait til a vaccine come out or less people have complications from it.

I still have not had coronavirus yet. A lot of people haven’t and we don’t know what it is like yet. I don’t want to know

@TheDailyCarbuncle

I'm sure you're working very hard to help the many many children that were thrown under the bus by lockdown *@MaryShelley1818*.

What really irritates me is that when all the analysis of this shitshow comes out next year, there'll be endless handwringing about the long term effects of isolation, about how for many people 'the cure was worse than the disease.' And yet now all people can say, zombie-like, is 'law, law, law,' while pointing fingers at other people and claiming to occupy a moral high ground. Everyone will act next year like it wasn't foreseeable, like they couldn't have known it was happening. It's so fucking predictable.

Only if people don't look at the bigger picture.

Not being able to breath is more important than those other variables . It just is ! sadly its more pressing.
The Nhs being overwhelmed has a knock on effect to cancer treatments and other treatments.

I don't know how you fail to see this.

Great post TheDailyCarbuncle

This understanding of ‘responsibility’ is so flawed

@TheDailyCarbuncle no it wasn't. It was a reply to the person who said basically this was my new normal and I love being miserable (clearly have very poor comprehension skills).

No unfortunately I can't make my own choices or decisions over this. That's the purpose of laws.
I also have a duty to not contribute to the spread when working with vulnerable children and families.

[quote MaryShelley1818]@TheDailyCarbuncle no it wasn't. It was a reply to the person who said basically this was my new normal and I love being miserable (clearly have very poor comprehension skills).

No unfortunately I can't make my own choices or decisions over this. That's the purpose of laws.
I also have a duty to not contribute to the spread when working with vulnerable children and families.[/quote]
Fair enough. You don't have a duty to monitor the behaviour of people who are not your responsibility however, so maybe stick to following the law and just disregard other people who are making their own choices?

I just can't get worked up about this.

Even if everyone followed the rules, COVID would still exist and would still be a danger unless a vaccine was found.

So why do people think that following the rules to the letter will get all this over and done with quicker?

@vanillandhoney

I just can't get worked up about this.

Even if everyone followed the rules, COVID would still exist and would still be a danger unless a vaccine was found.

So why do people think that following the rules to the letter will get all this over and done with quicker?

This is the question I keep asking. Even if a vaccine is found, covid will still go around, it'll take a very long time for it to have any effect and even then the effect may be temporary. So when does it stop? When are we released from the idea that we must serve this one illness at the expense of everything else?

@TheDailyCarbuncle

"Fuck the rules" from people like you is going to keep the rest of us having to follow them for longer. Thanks so much!

I keep seeing this idea expressed in various ways. I genuinely don't understand it. If everyone follows the rules, the infection rate goes down, as it did in the summer, then the rules end and the rate goes up again, as it has done recently. What then? Back to rules? Forever? Where does it end? How does following the rules now make any difference long term? That's a genuine question I keep on asking and not getting an answer to.

Keeping the infection rate down gives time to develop vaccines and treatments.

You might not like it but friends and extended family are going to be more of a virtual part of life now.

No they bloody won't. We will still see our friends and family as long as we are allowed, we are adhering to the rules and always will and when things ease eventually we'll go back to going for group meals and days out etc

When are we released from the idea that we must serve this one illness at the expense of everything else?

Who the fuck knows.

But when the economic effects start being felt more widely, there will be a distinct change of tune, no doubt.

Ok @Asterion so the idea is, follow the rules, keep the infection rate down and then when a vaccine/treatment is available, start to open up more then. That means that the rules being lifted is dependent on vaccines and treatments, not on anyone's behaviour, doesn't it?

@TheDailyCarbuncle
Just what I needed to read today, thank you.

@TheKeatingFive

When are we released from the idea that we must serve this one illness at the expense of everything else?

Who the fuck knows.

But when the economic effects start being felt more widely, there will be a distinct change of tune, no doubt.

I imagine so, but it'll already be too late at that point. How can people not see this coming? Why, as usual, do we have to wait for it to happen before people suddenly have an epiphany and 'realise' the danger?

Keeping the infection rate down gives time to develop vaccines and treatments.

But the infection rate is high now, and deaths and hospitalisations, although on the increase, are still low.

I just want to know how long are people expected to put their entire lives on hold for? Because even when a vaccine comes out, it'll take months before we know what impact it has.

Asking people not to socialise or spend time with their friends and family for extended periods of time is totally unnatural. "Breaking the law" in this kind of situation is normal. What isn't normal is expecting people to spend time with one household at a time for months on end.

We are sticking (roughly) to the rules OP but I understand why others aren’t doing. It sucks but we can’t force people to follow the rules.

Seriously, we can’t. The U.K. simply doesn’t have the police power or ability to do it. Equally people have too much independent choice and freedom.

Make your own decision as to the level of risk you’re willing to accept and live that!

@TheDailyCarbuncle

Ok *@Asterion* so the idea is, follow the rules, keep the infection rate down and then when a vaccine/treatment is available, start to open up more then. That means that the rules being lifted is dependent on vaccines and treatments, not on anyone's behaviour, doesn't it?

I wish MN had a like button.

We are waiting for a vaccine, which means people's behaviour has nothing to do with long restrictions are going to last for.

Accepting the rules temporarily in order to keep older and more vulnerable people safe is one thing but accepting that life has changed forever and that we are doomed to some dystopian virtual reality future is something else. The vast majority of people very much want to get back to seeing friends and family in person as was evident when restrictions were relaxed. The economy depends on us being out and about spending money so the bottom line is this is what will prevail not everyone locked up permanently.

I imagine so, but it'll already be too late at that point. How can people not see this coming? Why, as usual, do we have to wait for it to happen before people suddenly have an epiphany and 'realise' the danger?

When the NHS is overwhelmed and more treatments are cancelled? When someone you know needs oxygen?
We need to slow the spread now not leave it until 1k are dying a day again.

It was a least a decade before we had effective treatments for HIV/AIDs btw. And there still isn't a vaccine.

Now I've every faith that Covid will improve on those timelines, but it shows us that there are no guaranteed quick fixes from a treatment/vaccine pov.

Just how long are people willing to deprive themselves of basic human contact?