What is with Mumsnet and pubs and restaurants.

[HeresMe]

What is it with Mumsnet and pubs and restaurants , they are responsible for everything to some small mindset but they do hate them

They have been open for a couple of months but apparently to some posters they are the spread.

I'm guessing the posters don't use such places and want the staff to lose just b's ect I'm not sure.

@GeologyRox Somebody feels my bloody pain 😭

Restaurants/pubs would be completely fine if people weren't so rude and shrug their shoulders to the rules! Yes this is kind of a for and against, but if restaurants weren't open, it'd be supermarkets getting the blame, or parks.

I have literally been asked why can't we do the eat out to help out on the weekend because it was more convenient for them 😂 and I have witnessed so many people go up to the sanitiser station and PRETEND to sanitise 🙄

Oh the wait on food 😒 Got told off for a 10 minute wait, and they didnt like to sit outside in the canopy even tho they CHOSE it on the booking system. I miss working in a bar were it was more acceptable to tell people to f off.

I'm a waitress waiting for a Covid test result. Now if I'm positive, it's possible my teenager brought it home from school and has passed it to me asymptomatically. But I think it would be more likely from work.
As airborne /aerosol transmission seems to be the main route, all the Covid hygiene theatre cleaning isn't going to make my work space much safer, when I'm surrounded by a succession of people for hours at a time. I'm pissed off that my work place may be the cause of my teenager having to miss 2 weeks of school ( in exam year )

I certainly do @JazzyJade!

It's really highlighted how badly people behave when they feel like they have a bit of power!
"We only have outside tables left I'm afraid, and there is no room inside should it start to rain or get cold until someone leaves, so we may not be able to let you in"
"That's fine"
*Starts to rain and suddenly the lobby is filled with all the outside tables with no social distancing and gobbing off about the bad service because there aren't any inside tables for them..... 🙄

@Perihelion

I get that, hope your test is negative and your teen can go to school still. I agree it's more likely you'll have got it from work, my experience is that people who diligently wear masks in other settings (and even have a go at anyone not wearing one) totally forget their responsibilities in favour of their rights in a hospitality setting.

Maybe it's different in cities but around us I don't see any blame on pubs. Most of the village pubs have set up tables across gardens and car parks, table service etc

They are pre-book or wait-to-be-seated and everyone I know welcomed them back. Most have been doing takeaways since lockdown started so have broken the monotony of cooking every night.
Some have been feeding the needy in place of old people's community centres/meals on wheels. One had a free takeaway service for ICU staff

@Oliversmumsarmy

Because going to pubs and restaurants is almost completely unnecessary during a pandemic, and I don't see why it's so difficult for people to just eat and drink at home, and to stick to small, important doses of socialising (like close family) for a while. It's a luxury that we should be able to go without for a few months or even a year: in the grand scheme of things is it really such a huge sacrifice for people to just put a pause on certain types of leisure activities for a while

Would you “pause” your salary for a year?

Because that is what you are asking people to do.

The only thing that has made the last month or so bearable is being able to go out and eat in a pub garden. Even just a cheese toastie and a cola or a plate of pasta, just something I haven’t had to prepare.

And yes it is a huge sacrifice asking people to not go out for a year.

Apart from our immediate family we have dmil who is in a nursing home and BIL who lives many miles away so we
Not everyone has extended family to pop in.

France, Germany are extending furlough.

There is a strong case for sectoral furlough, and hospitality is a strong contender.

Assume our government won't though.

Eat out to help out looked odd to me, it was basically a bribe to take risks.

On this graph,

3 = 4th July (pubs reopen)

4 = 1st Sep (schools reopen)

@BabyLlamaZen

Every place I've been in is very distanced. They have been open since July, numbers didn't start got rise until late August. It's not the smoking gun - every official I have spoken to has said its house parties and family gatherings. I would look to the changes made on August 15 for the clue as that fits with the rise.

In my experience these people haven't been to a pub recently. Thry want something to close down that they don't use so they feel the virus will be under control and they can sleep better.

@KatherineJaneway

In my experience these people haven't been to a pub recently. Thry want something to close down that they don't use so they feel the virus will be under control and they can sleep better.

Not true in my case, I loved meeting in pubs and cafes.

But I believe this virus is a concern, and that it spreads easily indoors, and where people don't observe social distancing. Like in pubs.

@KatherineJaneway the virus spreads through particles exhaled in the air. Perhaps science hasn’t been to the pub lately as it’s telling us being inside for extended periods with people who aren’t wearing masks is a high risk activity for contracting CoV.

There is definitely a correlation between the increased footfall in non-essential retail and recreation and the resurgence in growth of the virus. I'm not in a position to say whether there is causation, but it doesn't seem impossible, since any increased indoor contact is likely to lead to increased virus growth. This virus only travels when we do.

But I believe this virus is a concern, and that it spreads easily indoors, and where people don't observe social distancing. Like in pubs.

All the pubs I've been to have been SD.

@SoManyActivities

There seems to be a small but vocal group on MN that are relishing lockdown and just looking for something to be outraged about. Pubs and restaurants are the target now, at the start it was anyone who dared leave their home (remember the posts outraged that people were buying non essentials with their supermarket shop? or the neighbours who spent too long in their gardens or left the house too much/for too long or many other made up rules.

The absolute best one at the start which I will remember forever, is the poster who said that people shouldn't have BBQs in their own back gardens because it was disrespectful and people should be conducting themselves with 'solemnity'.

But yes, I remember the 'don't sit on a bench, don't open gates on a walk, don't buy Easter eggs in your shop, don't go for a 61 minute walk' etc. To be honest, the batshitttery is one of the reasons I love MN so much!

A cracker I saw was one having a right rant, saying people have had a too "middle class" lockdown and many just haven't suffered enough.

@KatherineJaneway

But I believe this virus is a concern, and that it spreads easily indoors, and where people don't observe social distancing. Like in pubs.

All the pubs I've been to have been SD.

Yes, but even with SD you risk picking it up in a pub.

It's a bugger this virus.

SD doesn't prevent transmission, just reduces the risk.

And many people don't and won't observe it in pubs, especially after drinking.

[quote turnitonagain]@KatherineJaneway the virus spreads through particles exhaled in the air. Perhaps science hasn’t been to the pub lately as it’s telling us being inside for extended periods with people who aren’t wearing masks is a high risk activity for contracting CoV.[/quote]
I'm aware of how the virus spreads thank you

Most pubs are doing SD and taking sensible precautions. I don’t see why shutting an entire industry is required. If an individual chooses to sit all day in a pub then yes, their chance of getting Covid will increase. That's on them. However short visits for a meal and a glass of wine will not guarantee a patron gets Covid.

Yes, but even with SD you risk picking it up in a pub.

You're at risk most places.

And many peopledon't and won'tobserve it in pubs, especially after drinking.

Not my experience. Of course there will be some pubs that flaunt the rules and some people who won't socially distance but each individual decides whether to stay in that situation once they see those behaviours or leave.

However short visits for a meal and a glass of wine will not guarantee a patron gets Covid.

Nothing is guaranteed with covid. Some medics treating infected patients did not get the virus.

Why are we arguing about this? We all know the science. Indoors + alcohol is causing transmission in pubs, because ventilation is insufficient and SD breaks down. Plus some touch transfer I expect, in toilets etc.

All the pubs I’ve been too have had table service, no standing at the bar allowed, screens between tables, staff wearing face masks, extra cleaning and hand sanitiser stations.
Really depends on the pub and not carefully chosen photographs from the Daily Mail.

You're at risk most places

Risk is infinitely varied. It isn't binary.

Pubs are especially risky because people talk, often loudly, and face each other.

The cinema is loads less risky - facing same direction, quiet, not moving.

It doesn't surprise me that those on this thread who have been to pubs are reporting they're all clean, safe, places that are run responsibly. I'm sure they are. But that's not the case for many pubs that have reopened, which is why enforcement notices are being issued all over the place.

Council staff investigating have reported no social distancing, no track and trace, no cleaning, no limit on numbers. It's more likely its these places that are causing the correlation between Covid and licensed establishments, not naice country pubs or upmarket hipster bars.

And yes there should be more enforcement, but councils are understaffed and skint. Sadly not everyone is being responsible, and it's a shame for decent business owners and staff.

Just a couple of examples, but there are loads:

www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/18653965.hyndburn-pub-closed-police-breaching-coronavirus-rules/

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/the-granby-arms-closed-coronavirus-18803896

screens between tables

This doesn't mean anything for the people at the table.

Four people around a table, if less than 2m apart, are spraying a lot of very small pieces of spit in each others faces.

I fully accept people may be happy/entitled to take the risk, but I do find it odd people deny it is an increased risk.

I've been to restaurants and bars a couple of times over the summer just for a change of scene and to meet friends/family. The pub I went to (and not Wetherspoons type ones) didn't seem to be doing table service at all (I thought their approach was a bit slack TBQH). The restaurants seemed to do a much better job and I felt confident that we were socially distanced enough from others not to be at risk. However, I am not naive enough to think that doing out of the home socialising is ever entirely 'safe' at the moment. It is a risk but there again life is for living not being wrapped in one's own safe cocoon all of the time.

THese are not my opinions, but according to some mumsnetters:

• pubs are hubs of non-social distancing. As soon as someone gets one pint in them they're hugging everyone and kissing the barmaid.

-Nobody has self control. Everyone in a pub is drunk, always.

• mcdonalds is the only restaurant frequented. It is encouraging obesity and everyone just wanted a half price big mac.

• people who work in pubs and restaurants dont have a career and therefore their jobs aren't important, they could just get a job in a supermarket.

Unfortunately I do think these places are likely to see spread of cases because they're busy and because of the fact they only have a 1m+ rule, not 2m and therefore people are close together. Plus the bar staff/waiters only wear face shield and in my experience often don't- so if a waiter has the virus they would pass it to a lot of people.

@HeresMe

That's. It they have been open over 2 months but its their fault.

Ive spent a afternoon alone socially distanced in a pub no one around me at all but let's blame them.

Me too My work is predominantly in pubs so the more that shut down down to this and there have been plenty the less chance my business will survive. It is just abject snobbery, like most of MN. They think pubs are like the ones they see in soaps. My local has had more enforced Social Distancing and one way systems than any supermarket I've been to, the landlord actually barred on guy who ignored the one way system repeatedly. If you don't sign in with your mobile number and time of visit you get no service. Pubs are not spreading it, there have been a few exceptions but stupid is as stupid does and the one pub in my area which ignored tracing and covid rules which got shut for cleaning after a case is now the pub no one goes to as people were cross. And that was the posh bar and wine bar so there you go.

I also think the government policy that people can sit on a table with 5 other unrelated people, obviously less than 1m apart, is really counterintuitive. They should have limited eating out to a single household/bubble.