How can you do this to your children (and yourselves)?

[endoftheworldaoife]

It has been six months and it's now very clear that covid won't be doing away in our lifetimes. A vaccine won't eradicate it (just as a vaccine didn't eradicate flu).

Most of you seem to be willing to accept social distancing and masks for the foreseeable. And I don't get it. We are a tribal species. We literally die without contact and get sick without communication. Kids are learning arrange, stilted ways of being that will just worsen their digital reliance. OCD is being normalised. Dating will be neurotic and masked. Freshers won't make new loves or lifelong friends like we did. As for their working lives...

I wouldn't mind catching covid (indeed I'm sure we all will sooner or later) so can someone explain to me what on earth is happening in their heads to tip the balance? If it only affected us, I could understand (well, I couldn't but this feels like child abuse on a giant scale).

@Puzzledandpissedoff

*And all those quoting the current death figures, the government admitted that some of these are unreliable due to the way the numbers were counted originally*

There's also the point that even the official figures mention deaths which have involved Covid rather than the sufferers having died OF it

Obviously a virus can complicate pre existing conditions and even tip some over the edge, but a couple of weeks ago the NHS released figures of those who've died purely due to the virus

I'll try to find it again, but FWIW the number was about 1380

Yep I saw that too

Here you go, Flyonawalk ...

www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2020/08/COVID-19-total-announced-deaths-27-August-2020-weekly-file.xlsx

Lady, you are undoubtably right about hidden casualties. As a former teacher I feel desperately sad for (probably tens of thousands) of UK children who needed the structure and security of school and who will have suffered without it. And that’s not even considering the vast numbers of children worldwide who can never go back to school because their families are plunged into poverty.

We will be able to count the cost of lockdown one day (on a human level, not just economic) and I think history will judge that it cost too much.

Thank you Puzzled! Settling down to read.

What's Belgium and France etc doing in school though?

It's pretty much a free for all in our schools... If it's the same in Belgium great, if not then groups of 5 doesn't make much difference.

I agree with you OP. We are sacrificing the lives of the young for the sake of the sick and elderly. I know youngish people feeling suicidal and it will only get worse. It might be selfish to say you aren't prepared to give up your kids education, job and social life for a few months to save others' lives. But it's not selfish to say enough is enough - we've done that, it didn't make it go away - why should we go back into lockdown? Why is your life worth more than mine? That's not being over-dramatic - the suicide rate is increasing. If you ask me it's the elderly who are being selfish - they can stay at home to protect themselves if they don't want to risk catching it. I'd rather take my chances with the virus.

Fly, many educational settings managed with minimal training, in some cases 2 weeks, some 45 mins to get on line. They kept exactly to their time table with calls going out to those not present.

It kept the teachers busy, the students occupied, they could see their friends or at least talk to them and in some cases they actually got ahead, with the syllabus.

Sadly, it's taken other schools months to get on line, work out zoom, Google meet, so yes in those settings it's been extremely detrimental to their learning and will be again.

Puzzled, you are right. The number of UK people without an existing condition who died of covid up the the end of August is 1,390. And for this we have hampered education, destroyed businesses, compromised healthcare. I am not suggesting that covid victims with existing conditions did not matter, but surely this changes what the virus response should be from fit and well people. Wow.

Splendid, well done, and I know many of my former colleagues did heroic work in keeping their students going. My particular sadness is for children for whom school is a safety need rather than an educational one. Children who will have had no one to notice bruises, to feed them, to be aware of a deteriorating home. You know the sort of thing.

We are sacrificing the lives of the young for the sake of the sick and elderly.

Do you have anyone sick or elderly at home?

you ask me it's the elderly who are being selfish - they can stay at home to protect themselves if they don't want to risk catching it. I'd rather take my chances with the virus.

All those selfish older people. Are 'sick' people. and BAME people selfish too?
You read it hear first. You couldn't make it up.

The number of UK people without an existing condition WHICH WASN'T KILLING THEM who died of covid up the the end of August is 1,390

Fixed that for you

@Flyonawalk - death is not the only negative impact though? In a way, from a resource point of view death is "cheaper". We have a long term burden now with a much bigger cohort of survivors. Some of whom remain very unwell and need intensive therapy - physical and mental.

*The number of UK people without an existing condition WHICH WASN'T KILLING THEM who died of covid up the the end of August is 1,390

Fixed that for you. *

Thanks @DameFanny

Esmejane, I think most posters are accepting of current safety measures. It’s the threat of further educational disruption and even greater economic harm which is harder to swallow. I think this thread has been an attempt to find perspective while the country’s policy seems to be driven by panic.

I'm with you OP. Face masks just been made law in Wales and I can't believe we are letting them do these things to us. I will be avoiding indoor spaces because I don't want to wear one. If we carry on like this, we will die out anyway. Hooks ups and unplanned pregnancies must be way down. How are people going to get together? I desperately hope we can get our social lives back (without the face coverings) very soon! It all gives me very dark thoughts because I literally do not want to live like that.

@endoftheworldaoife I’m so with you and glad you posted this. I’ve just been worrying about why people are going along with this.

It's not me who was right, Flyonawalk - I deserve no credit for simply linking the NHS's own figures

Nor do I know the exact health status of all those who had pre-existing conditions, but we DO know that Covid being a notifiable disease means that it's "importance" has been allowed to eclipse all else when numbers are collated

And for this, as you correctly say, so very much has been trashed

Hey @Croleeen

So you think ALL the sick in great ormond st hospital ( other children’s hospitals are available) should just die.....die because enough is enough and you want to get back to normal ? And take all the elderly down with them

You are a delight

. If we carry on like this, we will die out anyway. Hooks ups and unplanned pregnancies must be way down. How are people going to get together? I

This thread just keeps giving.

Puzzled, this figure needs more media attention surely. There is genuine fear about covid from people who have little reason to worry and who can keep working, learning, keeping the economy functional.

It's a bit of fabric @Firstimer703 - for the sake of that you'll stop going into shops etc?

And Puzzled, your username sums up so much for me when it comes to this topic!

@DameFanny I've already stopped pretty much and yes, I will avoid anywhere I have to wear a face covering.