New outbreak in New Zealand

[CKBJ]

Breaking news outbreak in a retirement village in Auckland. Residents developed respiratory type illness. Auckland have gone into level 3 while the outbreak is assessed. After over 100 days of being virus free and their strict measures, what has broken down to allow this?

I have never understood why some posters, based in many different countries have wanted the virus to spread elsewhere. People are dying.

As for NZ, there are definitely interesting times ahead and I whilst I hope this outbreak is quickly controlled, it does seem some measures may have to be implemented in the long term e.g. mask wearing, socially distancing etc.

I still don't agree with quarantining households who have a positive case in special facilities.

And i hope that the PM now manages to communicate clearly that there should be no stigma about a positive test.

Confirmed spread to the North Shore and, containment wise, that's a discrete community (geographically and socio economically) from South Auckland and also more of a gateway to Northland (another region) - so this is terrible news.

www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12356436

It isn't clear why the student from Torbay and their family haven't been detained to quarantine like the first family were?

Oh - that is a shame. Let’s hope NZ remains world beating

Exactly, moreso now that those who test positive (and their household) will be removed from their homes and detained in a quarantine facility. You didn't have to read far between the lines to see that "family zero" very much didn't want to go and were compelled.

I think this is a mistake and will cause people to avoid being tested.

I don't remember if it was on here, but back in March before there was widespread consensus that our government had shat the bed, I read some discussion about their proposed strategy. Someone said the 'behaviour experts' who helped draw it up had been involved in a big way in the Ebola epidemic response, and had learned from that that imposing enforced quarantine tended to backfire, as it led to people not getting tested/seeking treatment. While the situation of people in West Africa is totally different to that of the average New Zealander, if people avoid getting treated for Ebola because of mandatory quarantine, I think you can be pretty sure they'll ignore mild cold symptoms if they're disincentivised from reporting them.

psychomath

Yes, I think that's it exactly.
It's depressing enough contemplating the prospect of doing 14 day stretch in your own house, surrounded by your own familiar things ... but managing baby bottles and poopy nappies in a tiny hotel room with a spouse and 2 tantrummy kids? Whilst unwell yourself? Yeah, a lot of people will be claiming allergies and deluding themselves that it's true.

To those who are saying that anyone who is ill won't be willing to take a test - you might like to know that the testing stations are working overtime, and people are having to wait in lines (in their cars) for several hours to reach the head of the queues. So obviously there are a lot of people who are prepared to be tested and take the risk of being positive.

Even throughout the 102 days my NZ friends were getting themselves and their kids tested when they came down with colds. This was voluntary testing and with no links to travel or high risk conditions. Although these are people who have relatively secure jobs, sick leave and holiday pay to draw on and secure housing situations. Lots of people won't fit that description.
I do think the circumstances of a lot of people would push them to ignore it, likewise with self imposed quarantine while waiting for test results or after receiving positive results but feeling mostly fine.
At the moment NZ has the capacity to isolate those who test positive but that wouldn't be the case if the numbers keep going up. It looks like they are throwing everything they have at the current situation to prevent it getting out of hand rather than reacting after the fact.
I'm sure it would be incredibly uncomfortable being isolated in a hotel when sick. I'm sure that it would be more uncomfortable spreading it to close family, friends and coworkers and feeling responsible for their illness and potential financial hardship or on going medical complications that may result.
Like in other countries many of those who are in a more precarious life position are also potentially more vulnerable to the virus/effects of the virus as a result of their ethnicity and pre-existing conditions.
This pandemic is not a fun ride for anyone and appreciate that they are doing as much as they can to limit the spread so kiwis can keep as much normality as possible.

I know of people who have been getting tested who didn't have secure jobs and the associated buffers. Most people, in this part of the country anyway, are wanting to keep the virus contained and so will do their bit. The test results do come through quickly.

@eaglejulesk i think fast turnaround tests makes such a difference. Faster tracing and notification, less time waiting where people could break isolation etc.
I really hope this is all contained ASAP for the sake of all NZ and selfishly so that we can get home in the not too distant future for a visit with family and friends.

"I wonder if it came from the frozen chips the UK was planning to offload into our markets because demand was down in the pubs there."

Ha, that's a light bulb moment for me! I've seen them in our local supermarket - huge bags of waffle fries going cheap - and never made the connection.

It's in Tokoroa - so now outside Auckland - in a medical centre.

i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300082167/coronavirus-one-confirmed-and-one-probable-case-of-covid19-in-tokoroa-stuff-understands

Why are some patients being detained to quarantine and other confirmed cases permitted to self isolate at home? Though it's very sensible and pragmatic if they've actually reverted to self isolation.

To those who are saying that anyone who is ill won't be willing to take a test - you might like to know that the testing stations are working overtime, and people are having to wait in lines (in their cars) for several hours to reach the head of the queues. So obviously there are a lot of people who are prepared to be tested and take the risk of being positive.

I'm sure most people will still get tested because most people are decent and want to keep others safe. It's the few who won't or can't that are the problem. Do you think the sort of person who needs to be kept in enforced isolation because they wouldn't comply willingly, even knowing they were covid positive, is going to get a test voluntarily when there's a risk of great inconvenience and no personal benefit?

I still don't agree with quarantining households who have a positive case in special facilities.

This. I would be reluctant to take a test for that reason. I would however isolate in my own home before anyone thinks I'm happy to spread the disease!

Apparently the man went to his GP who advised getting tested asap and isolating for results. The man did not get tested straight away. Another person in the household also showing symptoms travelled to Taupo (tourist spot), went on boat cruises etc.
This is why Jacinda is going with stronger measures and hotel isolation.

Do you think the sort of person who needs to be kept in enforced isolation because they wouldn't comply willingly, even knowing they were covid positive, is going to get a test voluntarily when there's a risk of great inconvenience and no personal benefit?

Well probably not, but if they become ill enough they are going to be found. I didn't say the whole country was lining up for a test, just pointing out that the majority of people are willing to do what they can - so much so that the Director General of Health had to ask only people with symptoms turn up at the testing station, not those who didn't have them! You seem to be trying to prove that people who are ill won't want to be tested, but in actual fact it is only a very small minority. Most people in NZ are taking this seriously - unlike some other nationalities.

NZ had done 26,000 tests in 48 hours which I think works out to be about 0.5 percent of the population. That's phenomenal. People have waited hours.

Here in Auckland it feels like businesses have flipped back to level 3 very quickly and smoothly. 12 days should be okay.

You seem to be trying to prove that people who are ill won't want to be tested, but in actual fact it is only a very small minority. Most people in NZ are taking this seriously - unlike some other nationalities.

And you seem to be taking this as me having a dig at New Zealand specifically, which I'm not. I already said i think your government have done the right thing otherwise. I just think that taking people away for enforced quarantine is likely to backfire, wherever it happens. For people who are already happy to comply it's a waste of resources, and for the minority who aren't it will put them off even more.

There are people everywhere taking this seriously or otherwise. At the moment, people in NZ are probably taking it much more seriously than in most European countries because you haven't already been subject to restrictions for the last five months. Not sure how much nationality comes into it.

At the moment, people in NZ are probably taking it much more seriously than in most European countries because you haven't already been subject to restrictions for the last five months.

And why is that I wonder - could it be because our govt acted hard and fast, and didn't let our citizens wander all around the world to bring the virus back with them? Yet a bunch of people on MN feel they must point out everything wrong with the NZ approach. I would worry about your own govt's response - wherever you may be (this is aimed everyone) rather than deciding what is best for another country. I've never heard anyone in this part of the world get so heavily involved in debating what the govt of another country should, or shouldn't, do in dealing with this pandemic.

Absolutely, @eaglejulesk!

Agreed @eaglejulesk

I think people are so interested in NZ (including me) as it is one end of the responses spectrum (hard borders, strict quarantine) compared with say Sweden (soft borders, light quarantine) and internationally everyone is looking to see what approach is best (with all the caveats about pop density/ geography etc).
It is literally live experiment in pandemic planning that has never happened before and it is playing out in front of the worlds eyes - so international comment / scrutiny is inevitable for both countries.

A single case in NZ makes the worldwide news and the poor individuals get online abuse - but no one cares about a single case in Sweden and I bet no one gets abuse for having COVID there as there are still lots of cases everyday (same as the UK for that matter).

Reactions are opposite extremes precisely due to the two different strategies involved - elimination v suppression.
UK is probably mid way between the two points so softish borders in that we can leave and come back but have to quarantine from some countries and a lightish lockdown that was observed well by the population April/ May but now not so well observed by some and most things almost back to normal but local lockdowns in some areas.

It's fascinating really - but must annoy both the Swedes and Kiwis that the world has opinions about the good and bad aspects.

My own view is that the Swedes will be judged to have been the best strategy in 12 - 18 months time but others may disagree.

Yet no one seems to go on about Vietnam’s successful - until recently - zero Covid strategy! Guess a 3rd works country smashing Covid doesn’t fit the first world narrative focus

My own view is that the Swedes will be judged to have been the best strategy in 12 - 18 months time but others may disagree.

Including the Swedish prime minister (judging by his recent pronouncements)

@Aridane

Yet no one seems to go on about Vietnam’s successful - until recently - zero Covid strategy! Guess a 3rd works country smashing Covid doesn’t fit the first world narrative focus

I think western media concentrate on western countries (Europe, North America, Aus/ NZ) as they are more comparable with Gov systems, healthcare and culture. But Vietnam is definately a country to look at too as they have done a good job and it would be useful for western countries to explore why and what we can learn

funnily enough, here in the UK we have our own mini NZ - Isle of Man!

also locked down early and no one can leave/ return without a compulsory 2 week quarantine - high pop compliance so far they have been covid free for ages now but face the same issues as NZ going forward

Also Isle of Wight also I believe covid free BUT soft borders in that islanders can leave to UK mainline without quarantine and it is likely full of UK tourists right now - so it will be interesting to see if they import covid after the summer season.