School re-opening may not go well.

[jomartin281271]

Here's an article from the New York Times documenting what happened when the Israeli government decided to re-open their schools. They thought they had beaten the virus (which this country certainly hasn't) and within days it was spreading again like wildfire. One section of the article is particularly interesting. It reads:

'Public health experts worldwide have coalesced around a set of guidelines for reopening schools.

A major recommendation is to create groups of 10 to 15 students who stay together in classrooms, at recess and lunchtime, with teachers assigned to only one group. Each group has minimal contact with other groups, limiting any spread of infection. And if a case of Covid-19 emerges, one group can be quarantined at home while others can continue at school.

Other key recommendations include staggering schedules or teaching older students online, keeping desks several feet apart, sanitizing classrooms more frequently, providing ventilation and opening windows if possible, and requiring masks for staff and students old enough to wear them properly.'

Our government are going to be cramming the kids into the same old classrooms, students won't be wearing masks, and the older students won't be able to study remotely. And this in a country with one of the highest mortality rates from Covid in the world.

You can read the full article here.

www.nytimes.com/2020/08/04/world/middleeast/coronavirus-israel-schools-reopen.html

Pet peeve. Someone on fb is sharing endless photos of her and her kids having half price meals twice, sometimes three times a day.

Meanwhile we aren’t to be given any money to cover even extra cleaning in schools.

I don’t blame her but it’s definitely irritating me. She doesn’t believe in masks and is in and out of multiple restaurants and pubs with her kids who’ll be back in school in a few weeks taking advantage of the governments bogof scheme that was deemed more valuable than funding schools

We know Japan only had about 1,000 deaths in total, which is only 8 deaths / million population

Cases may or may not be low. The death rate per confirmed cases is rather high in the Japanese case because they don’t have a lot of confirmed cases by design. Suggests a huge underestimate but they didn’t seem terribly concerned with asymptomatic spread. They could be right here.

Whereas some countries like the USA go totally overboard with testing people that don’t even have symptoms. Two extremes imo.

Not all 8% of those workers will be reliant on school for childcare (and it includes couples so households would be an even lower %). Some will have sahp or be on benefits or have children in private schools etc.

What percentage of people are going to be made redundant or have already been made redundant. Of course schools being open full time will be The priority for those depending on it but for the economy as a whole it isn’t.

Let’s face it low income families and single mums are hardly a concern for tories at the best of times and certainly not their voter demographic.

Wish the government would wake up on this. We are in the middle of a pandemic with a highly contagious pathogen with unknown effects. Social distancing is recommended in all public settings but somehow not schools. The bubbles are a joke frankly as they would consist of hundreds of people even in primary schools when you factor in siblings etc The kids absolutely need to go back but this should be using a safer blended approach ensuring smaller numbers. The kids would benefit from smaller group sizes. Better and safer for the children. The issue is of course the economy and parents working from home. As a society we need to think outside the box of 30 kids crushed into a class. It's not so conducive to learning as it is, and I'm a primary teacher. Many people have adapted to working from home and I know this isn't possible for everyone but now is the time for flexibility and change (the govt need to support this) The kids need to go part time for now. Unfortunately you can't wish away this virus..

@BigChocFrenzy

Quite apart from the damage to kids' education, especially those with important exams in the next couple of years, about 8% of workers have kids too young to be left at home alone

So priority #1 is schools need to be ft and to stay ft if at all possible,even if that sometimes means - with staff off sick - just childcare supervision in a hall from a young adult with a DBS

However, I don't understand why some of those who claim to want ft schools are so against all measures like masks, SD, extra cleaning and handwashing etc that would actually enable this
and also why they are mostly not agitating for extra money for such measures;

Fingers in ears and going la-la-la is not an effective measure to keep schools open

They are mostly just whingeing about vulnerable teachers and how they should be forced in or sacked
Germany is managing to reopen ft schools while allowng the most vulnerable teachers - looks about 3% so far - to WFH

Where will the young adult with a dbs come from? Have they ever worked in a school? Have they ever worked with someone with sn?

Vulnerable pupils and staff will back back in September.

Germany has guidelines that involve things like masks. The UK doesn't. Germany has given schools extra money, UK government not a single penny.

Germany primary class is 21. UK average 27
Germany secondary is around 14. UK average 30.

I haven't seen anyone against the measures, well apart from the government who have said masks and sd isn't needed in schools.

However, the practicalities of a teaching wearing a mask is dodgy especially for the language lessons and of course pupils with hearing impairments. But shouldn't be a blanket no from government and put into the hands of the school like the guidelines do.

Had government put this into the guidelines, then schools/leas could have taken whatever action against parents. Things like the fines in place for not wearing on public transport unless exempt could have been implemented in schools. Schools would know from their records which pupils are exempt. Although if most of your pupils are exempt, would those who can bother to wear one?

So priority #1 is schools need to be ft and to stay ft if at all possible,even if that sometimes means - with staff off sick - just childcare supervision in a hall from a young adult with a DBS

clearly spoken by someone who has no idea of hall supervision with more than two classes worth of kids and mixed year groups - that would be like throwing a sheep into a lions cage.

@TheHoneyBadger

Pet peeve. Someone on fb is sharing endless photos of her and her kids having half price meals twice, sometimes three times a day.

Meanwhile we aren’t to be given any money to cover even extra cleaning in schools.

I don’t blame her but it’s definitely irritating me. She doesn’t believe in masks and is in and out of multiple restaurants and pubs with her kids who’ll be back in school in a few weeks taking advantage of the governments bogof scheme that was deemed more valuable than funding schools

Something like 3 billion spent on this iirc. All to be clawed back through taxes, just like the other however many billion spent so far.

A few weeks ago, the government eat healthy people, obesity is one of those groups more at risk etc.

Now we have this bogof thing. We all know eating out is more calorific!!

Yea I know, the industry needs a cash injection because they have been closed. How many could have adapted to take-away and stayed open just like the independent take-aways did during lockdown? Those big chains and the drive-thrus could have stayed open just by locking the main doors.

Meanwhile, how many other businesses had to close because they didn't sell food? Hairdressers, barbers, cloth shops, gyms, a lot of therapy businesses and more. Where's the boost to help these for the economy?

It's an experiment for secondary schools. The offer is to encourage people to eat in, albeit, unlike schools, they can SD. With the family favourite chains onboard, they know it will attract those same families who have kids.

By the end of August, we will have Scottish schools to get some idea, and of course, if the figures sky rocket from this eat out thing.

Your friend technically isn't doing anything wrong. Masks aren't needed in pubs, restaurants and outside. This could be why government have said no, first break, masks will be off. Lunch time masks off and bubbles burst.

Anyone who thinks there children will be going back into school and doing practical work in September maybe in for a surprise. Those schools doing year group bubbles, students won't have access to rooms such as science classes rooms (This does depend on how each school has set up each grouping). But with this in mind Ofqual has removed the requirement for children to do practical work for the science GCSE's next year and limited the amount they need for A level science. They only need to watch video's or demo's, this could if had to be done remotely.

This has been done for a number of reasons, if we get more disruption and children aren't in school again. Also due to the rearranging classes rooms you can't do Chemistry practical in a History class room. Another problem would be sharing equipment between year groups, although I do think we could we could get round that by cleaning.

Until we have governmental officials who are experts in that field they are head or whatever of, I very much doubt the government will ever get anything.

I think it's crazy people making decisions like health and education have no experience at all in these areas. With their cv's they'd be at entry level in those areas they stand for. To be a head of school experience is needed, to be head of education, well I went to school so I know everything. Instead they spend more money of fucking advisors and giving themselves pay rises!

This year an above inflation rise of 3.1% was given to Mp's. Someone remind me how much the rest of the public sector was given?

That's a lot of money that could have been used elsewhere instead of more borrowing.

@MigGril

Anyone who thinks there children will be going back into school and doing practical work in September maybe in for a surprise. Those schools doing year group bubbles, students won't have access to rooms such as science classes rooms (This does depend on how each school has set up each grouping). But with this in mind Ofqual has removed the requirement for children to do practical work for the science GCSE's next year and limited the amount they need for A level science. They only need to watch video's or demo's, this could if had to be done remotely.

This has been done for a number of reasons, if we get more disruption and children aren't in school again. Also due to the rearranging classes rooms you can't do Chemistry practical in a History class room. Another problem would be sharing equipment between year groups, although I do think we could we could get round that by cleaning.

So if students are staying in a class and the teacher is coming to them, how does this work for sets?

Differentiating work in a class at secondary is a lot harder than in primary where it's usually just math and english that get this. Whereas secondary it's almost every subject, and a couple of different sets.

The material is roughly the same taught in that lesson and when the set lessons cannot happen, work can still be done.

Secondary level even working at the average, you have a lot of bored kids who aren't learning because its too easy/hard. And when bored teens don't all sit in silence day dreaming.

The material is roughly the same taught in that lesson and when the set lessons cannot happen, work can still be done. --- forgot to add primary

So if students are staying in a class and the teacher is coming to them, how does this work for sets?

There won't be sets this term/year for our Secondary - precisely for this reason. The learning is not going to be great. Another reason why I'm not desperate for my kids to go back.

Last I heard year 7 are going to be taught entirely in form group ie. no sets and probably very low priority for any speciality classrooms so likely in the same room all day being regularly left unsupervised whilst teachers leg it to and from other areas of the school. Year8 may be the same or just a bit of splitting for maths.

Older years will move around within their zone into and out of sets. Lots of lessons can be done mixed ability. At one stage mixed ability was the gold standard-no idea why

Year 7 and 8 are only set for maths and English anyway at my school. Year 9 are loosely set for science too and then just in mixed ability options groups.

Year 7 and 8 is pretty awful in terms of teaching in core subjects due to shortages of quality specialists and prioritising exam level groups. If anyone is considering maths tuition I’d say don’t leave it till they’re in ks4 because ime ks3 is where regression and loss of prior learning takes place and can turn kids off for good.

Aware that won’t be the case everywhere.

At one stage mixed ability was the gold standard-no idea why

I think because there’s a fair amount of research that suggests setting is only really beneficial for the top set kids. For everyone else it can be a total disaster. 🤷🏻‍♀️

I don’t necessarily agree - and in these ridiculously content heavy, linear syllabus days, it’s actually pretty important to be able to deliver the knowledge in as efficient a way as possible, which is easier if students are set.

Again, I don’t necessarily agree this is “good teaching”.

🤷🏻‍♀️ Derail, soz.

That’s the advice I wish I’d been given when ds started secondary. Two years, and about 10 different short lived maths teachers with limited mastery of the English language or classroom management required to cope in English schools later, ds is totally disengaged in maths despite it being his favourite subject at primary.

Worth thinking about for those people telling maths teachers they should quit if they don’t like having no safety measures in place for them.

@SmileEachDay

At one stage mixed ability was the gold standard-no idea why

I think because there’s a fair amount of research that suggests setting is only really beneficial for the top set kids. For everyone else it can be a total disaster. 🤷🏻‍♀️

I don’t necessarily agree - and in these ridiculously content heavy, linear syllabus days, it’s actually pretty important to be able to deliver the knowledge in as efficient a way as possible, which is easier if students are set.

Again, I don’t necessarily agree this is “good teaching”.

🤷🏻‍♀️ Derail, soz.

I think the trouble is they don’t differentiate between low ability and shitty behaviour. I’ve done great work in low ability groups that aren’t totally overrun with perfectly able but shittily behaved kids.

being regularly left unsupervised whilst teachers leg it to and from other areas of the school
In my school safeguarding prohibits pupils being n a classroom unsupervised. When we have eg tutorial day where they are in the classroom for all periods they go out into the corridor and line up where they are visible to other staff- asking for trouble to leave them unsupervised in a room.

* 10 different short lived maths teachers with limited mastery of the English language or classroom management required to cope in English schools later, ds is totally disengaged in maths
And you are defending these substandard teachers by your reckoning) and want to retain them / completely illogical!

Also due to the rearranging classes rooms you can't do Chemistry practical in a History class room. Another problem would be sharing equipment between year groups, although I do think we could we could get round that by cleaning.

Equipment is supposed to be cleaned between each class and laid out in trays for each pair of students (if individual sets aren’t available). I’ve never taught with sufficient equipment for pairs, let alone individuals and there is no time between classes to clean and re-allocate equipment into the next lesson’s trays even with technician support (which is massively reduced in most schools anyway). Practicals will be rare.

@lifeafter50

* 10 different short lived maths teachers with limited mastery of the English language or classroom management required to cope in English schools later, ds is totally disengaged in maths And you are defending these substandard teachers by your reckoning) and want to retain them / completely illogical!

No, I think you've misunderstood her point. What she's saying is that if you encourage current teachers to resign (because they are unhappy with the plan for safer operation in school), then sub-standard temporary teachers may be what you're left with. So be careful what you wish for.

After all, lots of us have come across inadequate supply teachers, haven't we?

I think it’s pretty obvious I was saying we are already having to employ sub standard teachers (particularly in shortage subjects) so if you’re encouraging properly qualified experienced teachers to leave that will get even worse.

Not sure how working for a private school for a couple of years really qualifies you to comment on the situation in state schools 50?

@CallmeAngelina

After all, lots of us have come across inadequate supply teachers, haven't we?

I used to get offered a job in virtually every school I did day to day supply in. They seemed so shocked to see a supply teacher who could teach and manage behaviour

I expect they welcomed you with open arms!