I can’t believe this is how people think

[Tigerlily31]

My MIL told me she’d rather die of “anything else over Covid”

My own mother is convinced she’ll end up in ICU on a ventilator if she gets it, despite having no health concerns.

I fully blame the media. It’s becoming frightening how big it is in people’s minds.

Death certificates are quite complex aren’t they? My late father aged 89, had terminal liver cancer, given 6 monthsbut was “ well” until the last 12 hours when he developed sepsis.
Sepsis is given top of the list cause of death, but it wasn’t really was it, it was the terminal liver cancer.

There are many many grim causes of death. A close relation of ours died in 8 weeks of a GBM brain tumour ....it was horrific and left us all traumatised.

What it says on the death certificate is not the same as the reason going on the PHE stats though.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/07/17/public-health-englands-exaggerated-death-statistics-scandal/

@Silvercatowner

I think I’d rather covid than Ebola.

Well quite. I'd add cholera to that list. Personally I live in fear of catching noro.

Same here with Noro, Silver. I'm just hoping that the hysteria about Covid will reduce noro transmission.

@Sunshiney1981

Another thread with this ever increasing polarised opinion of Covid....

Why now in any important issue do we always have people taking one view or the polar opposite?! It was the same with Brexit.
Black or white. No grey areas.

As it happens I’m more in the camp of ‘the media have blown it out of proportion’ and I say that as the parent of a child with a transplant. However I still think we need to exercise caution and do our ‘bit’. I don’t think it’s a conspiracy theory and I do think it’s sad that so many lives have been lost.

What I do see though as someone who has had to face the prospect of losing a child to a terminal illness is that a lot of those who are overly fearful of Covid see it as the first thing that has come along in their life to threaten their life. When in fact we are surrounded by life threatening situations and viruses day in day out. Since the day we were born we live with viruses bombarding our bodies. We are mostly well equipped to deal with them.

Excellent post, and the best of health and long life to your dc.

People (in general) have learned to overlook and 'other' existing threats to health. This new one, at the focus of intense media reporting, has caused some to respond by going into anxiety overdrive and others to go into denial.

Fact: it’s a new virus and we don’t know of any long term effects.

I was scared of it..In first week of lockdown had a severe sore throat and felt out of breath {eased by getting on all fours} but no cough {due to painkillers which suppress cough reflex, but tickly cough appeared when painkillers were wearing off..

I was sh*t scared.. but it could just have been a ''cold''. I stayed indoors for 7 days, garden apart.

However a HCP ''not in any perceived risk group'' mother of son's friend was in ICU for ages and ''It was touch and go''.

Her family in same household all tested positive, but some showed barely any symptoms at all, and none needed hospitalisation.

It appears that people have eased back a lot in their fears...I used to wash my groceries, but don't any more..Maybe I should.

Masks definitely help stop fine ''spit'' droplets from people talking, and are a good idea I think.

It’s not as simple as ‘refusing to see the seriousness of it’!!!!

It’s about the all encompassing catastrophising of one single virus which in factual terms is mild for most people and has a very low mortality rate in the general population.

It’s about the utter fear that has been generated to the exclusivity of all other threats to life. By the media mainly. Making people feel that Covid = ICU/ventilator when for the vast majority of people it doesn’t.

Yes we need to take precautions, be sensible, make our own risk assessments based on our person situations but we need to keep it in perspective.

@Knittingnanny

Death certificates are quite complex aren’t they? My late father aged 89, had terminal liver cancer, given 6 monthsbut was “ well” until the last 12 hours when he developed sepsis. Sepsis is given top of the list cause of death, but it wasn’t really was it, it was the terminal liver cancer.

But the sepsis is what killed him. If he hadn't got sepsis he may have lived days/ weeks/ possibly months longer if he hadn't got sepsis. Yes, the liver cancer would have killed him, but sepsis got him first. Possibly wouldn't have died of sepsis had he not had the liver cancer, but you can't say that as sepsis is the biggest killer of otherwise healthy people.

notalwaysalondoner, that generation has lived through much worse diseases and even dental problems had more chance of death. Statistically childbirth was more risking than Covid. I've got friends from Nigeria and the global death toll for Covid is similar to the death rate for Malaria, in Nigeria alone. They don't stop living because of Malaria. Since Covid has happened one of my friends has had five younger relatives die from, malaria, building collapse, complications of childbirth, possible heart condition and fire. She knows of three people who have been murdered (they are Christian) .

People who've lived outside of todays protected developed society, aren't going to view this in the same way. Those who are aware of the dangers of car travel and violence on a night out, are going to be less wary.

We've got to take into account us leaving people to die at home. If we were doing the same with other things, we'd have a high death rate.

It's time to admit while this is another new nasty flu, it isn't what we thought it was. It hasn't ripped through refugee camps, it hasn't wiped out the protesters.

Re Norovirus... Agree, it is vile.
''Turd to tongue'' transmission.

Caught it early this year horribly, and it is extremely catching.
I wash my hands, the minute I get home, before preparing food &c&c {before Covid} but suspect I caught it ''eating a vegetarian sausage roll'' in Town before washing hands.

The virus we ingest has to have come from the alimentary canal/bowels of an infected person, which is gross.

No vaccines for it, and immunity doesn't last long.

There is a very good article on it here :

www.nationalgeographic.com/science/phenomena/2013/01/02/the-norovirus-a-study-in-puked-perfection/

@amymel2016, do you live in fear of pneumonia? I was hospitalised with it, nearly died, was left with health issues and Chronic Fatigue. I was in my 30's. People on my lung ward were all under 55.

Since the day we were born we live with viruses bombarding our bodies. We are mostly well equipped to deal with them.

That's true. I don't see the connection between that and this situation though. Any ICU doctor would be happy to explain the difference. Which is why transplant HCP ( I have one right here) are keen to get rid of this new, particularly virulent virus so they can work on.

They don't stop living because of Malaria.

not comparable as malaria is not passed in the community, only by mosquitoes. Changing the way they live, beyond using a mosquito net, would make no difference to their risk of catching it.

How many death certificates say heart attack, stroke, or pneumonia when these conditions were actually triggered by Covid. It's now known that Covid can lead to heart attacks or strokes.

Why don't we stop playing the numbers game? It won't help anyone and can worry people, no two countries are counting in the same way so comparisons are odious. The bottom line is that we will never know because we are in a unique situation, a pandemic tempered with instant data to exacerbate the situation.

To say that there are 'long-term' effects can't be known for certain, the pandemic is less than a year old and the areas that have had it the longest sre not known for their honesty. Any serious illness can have knock on problems for one's body.

Thank you @CatteStreet

She’s doing very well thank you:)

Health is everything in life but it’s nothing if you don’t live your life.

When she was first transplanted and we were told she’d be immune-suppressed we were tempted to wrap her up in cotton wool and put her in a sterile bubble. But her doctors said she had to live her life, go to school, go to activities/groups, have play dates with snotty children, dig in the mud, climb trees, go to germy soft play centres, enjoy life. That was the point of transplant.

And happiness and joy have a lot to do with immunity. Fear and negativity suppress it - that’s studied and proven by science.

@Jihhery
But we’re not getting rid of it are we?
Unless I’ve misunderstood.
It’s been said from the start that it’s not going anywhere. That we must learn to live with it.

I think its more frightening how it doesn't even register with some people and some people deny it even exists...

My thought too. Just because YOU don't think it's so bad, doesn't mean it isn't or that other people are not mortally afraid. Many of us DO know people who've died, or had a pretty nasty time of it. Many of us DO worry about potential death. I'm so sorry that this is such an inconvenience for you!

@Sunshiney1981

Thank you *@CatteStreet*

She’s doing very well thank you:)

Health is everything in life but it’s nothing if you don’t live your life.

When she was first transplanted and we were told she’d be immune-suppressed we were tempted to wrap her up in cotton wool and put her in a sterile bubble. But her doctors said she had to live her life, go to school, go to activities/groups, have play dates with snotty children, dig in the mud, climb trees, go to germy soft play centres, enjoy life. That was the point of transplant.

And happiness and joy have a lot to do with immunity. Fear and negativity suppress it - that’s studied and proven by science.

Yes, this is it. Life. :) I'm so glad she's doing well.

It's the inability to look at context or to be able to contextualise individual risk that's frustrating.

Nearly 50% of deaths are in care homes so there is every reason to be frightened if you or a loved one is in a care home.

If you are over 75 then there is a 14% of dying with Covid.

Under 44 yo there is less than 1% of dying with Covid, a figure which includes underlying health conditions.

If you are elderly, male, BAME, obese and diabetic you should be v concerned.

If you are under 44 with no health conditions you should not worry any more than you would worry about catching any other virus.
You are certainly more at risk driving your car.

TrashTara, yes agreed but if I’m telling anyone what my dad died of I say liver cancer not sepsis if you see what I mean. If he’d got covid in the last days of his life I prob would say the same.

[quote Pizzapromotion]The thing about all deaths of people who have ever had Covid being recorded as Covid deaths is true, or at least Matt Hancock thinks it is www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/matt-hancock-review-coronavirus-deaths-miscounted-a4501466.html[/quote]
That is his story today, but not a few months ago. At first they wanted a lockdown, now they are more concerned about the economy and want people back out there. They manipulate the data to suit them at the time. I'm also a bit cynical and wonder if things would be a bit different if he and Boris and co hadn't already had the virus.

No staples. That’s a good clear reminder of the figures. My son , 28, has just done a test as he’s got a cough but no temp and recently restarted work ( hospitality) so if he has covid I will remember that.

"It's the inability to look at context or to be able to contextualise individual risk that's frustrating"

"Under 44 yo there is less than 1% of dying with Covid, a figure which includes underlying health conditions."

"If you are under 44 with no health conditions you should not worry any more than you would worry about catching any other virus.
You are certainly more at risk driving your car."

Ironic that you talk about contextualising risk but then get your figures wrong and claim driving is riskier.

At age 44, the chances of you dying from cancer, Road accidents, heart attacks,flu, rabies (insert other random disease people claim is like covid) , murdered, suicide etc. Hit by lightning and whatever else is around 0.3%.

So a 1% chance of death from covid increases your probability of death increases this risk to approximately 1.3 % which is about 4 times higher than normal, albeit much better odds than my 60 year old colleagues.

But of course there is a risk of being ill for week and months, the odds of which are unclear.

There is also the risk of long term convictions the odds are severity of which are unclear.

So based on these figures you certainly should worry a little more about it than driving your car or other diseases, and the fact that some of the people doing their own risk assessments so frustrated with others are getting it wrong.

Complications not convictions sorry