Are we a couple of weeks behind Spain and France?

[BKCRMP]

If Spain is v.likely in a second wave and France not far behind them does that mean we are also heading straight in to one again?

Will schools open regardless this September?

Everyone talking about mental health issues of kids. Is this not indicative of our society? Hong Kong schools have been shut since late Jan (opened briefly recently likely to no open again due to spike). I have a friend in HK. There’s no talk of mental illness/lost education as the kids will catch up, probably with a lot of parental guidance. When did educating children (and their mental health) in the U.K. become the sole responsibility of school? We have to look at how our society is set up surely?

No I think considering the impact on children is very important. I’d expect schools / government to consider it too even if individual teachers don’t think it’s important.

When did educating children (and their mental health) in the U.K. become the sole responsibility of school? We have to look at how our society is set up surely?

No one said its the sole responsibility of school? But when you have two working parents both trying to hold down jobs, can't see your friends or teachers, and your whole normal life routine has been turned upside down for something that isn't even dangerous to you specifically, then yes, I can see how this would affect kids. Not even necessarily on a 'mental health' level, but just generally.

Kids should be in school getting an education.

@MarshaBradyo

No I think considering the impact on children is very important. I’d expect schools / government to consider it too even if individual teachers don’t think it’s important.

Of course it’s important but why do a significant proportion of parents in the U.K. delegate all responsibility to schools? Education and mental health begin at home. Yes I appreciate there’s a proportion of society that are disadvantaged in this respect but that should be a small proportion.

@ThatsHowWeRowl

When did educating children (and their mental health) in the U.K. become the sole responsibility of school? We have to look at how our society is set up surely?

No one said its the sole responsibility of school? But when you have two working parents both trying to hold down jobs, can't see your friends or teachers, and your whole normal life routine has been turned upside down for something that isn't even dangerous to you specifically, then yes, I can see how this would affect kids. Not even necessarily on a 'mental health' level, but just generally.

Kids should be in school getting an education.

Unfortunately I think this is very much a western take on the situation. Other countries have had school closures far longer than us. Children can see friends even if schools are shut. Yes I agree exam years are problematic but it’s possible with some adaptations for younger kids to catch up on lost time. Unfortunately it involves parental effort which most don’t seem willing to offer.

Kids should be in school getting an education.

Of course. So the questions become 'How do you achieve this for children without unacceptable risks for adults working in schools or vulnerable people in the community connected to each school?' and 'What levels of death and illness for children and adults constitutes an acceptable risk?'

It's not an absolute either/or, it's balancing the risks and benefits for different groups.

As none of us have a crystal ball why are you even asking re: schools?

Of course we will get a 2nd wave, it's just a question of when.

I don’t think parents do delegate it all to schools, but I can see that schools closed for some children for so long does impact on them and that should be considered. It’s quite wide ranging, not just the really bad situations which are bad enough, but general well-being and yes mh.

When they do go back the switch back is immediate thankfully (for most) but school is still integral to children’s lives. I wouldn’t underestimate it. And still wouldn’t agree that it is all being delegated, no where near.

What @baroqueandblue said

I do think there is a societal issue as British parents work very hard, often both parents are full time which has made this lockdown very very hard. Plus so much extra pressure has fallen into women.

If you already had two parents working fewer hours (as in some Scandinavian countries) or one parent working (a higher percentage like this in Spain) then it would have been different.

Also Britain has really poor child mental health, and very poor mental health services. And we have highly pressured education system, with very unequal social/economic outcomes across our society.

All of this combined has made it very tough for a lot of families and children.

I don't think being at school will actually be very nice, school will be a different place in September, unfortunately, as there'll be loads of complex and varied fallout from the time off and the ongoing pandemic .

I also think people overestimate how not very nice school will be. Yr10 went back and thought it great even with restrictions. Great to not be learning from a screen, with friends.

@mac12

Schools need to reopen but they don’t need to reopen without masks, good ventilation & increased distancing (perhaps part-time, perhaps giving parents choice whether to home school). Learn from Israel’s mistakes so we can get kids back to school safely.

Sadly this seems inevitable with the idiot we have at the helm /supposedly leading our country.

@Mummypig2020 I agree.

Absolutely agree and that’s my point there’s wider societal issues at play here than schools open vs schools shut. I’m hoping that this Pandemic will lead to lots of changes in the long run that are a positive improvement on work, life, education. It requires change though which is always resisted by most.

And they’re a bit down on British children. Generally they’re happy at school with fine mh. I think it just fits with a narrative of keeping schools closed to seek out otherwise.

@MarshaBradyo

I also think people overestimate how not very nice school will be. Yr10 went back and thought it great even with restrictions. Great to not be learning from a screen, with friends.

They were in v small groups and for limited hours, plus anyone with mh issues didn't have to return.

UK has v high rates of mh issues in children/yp. They are going to be stressed out in September.

Adults have found it hard to go back to work. It won't be easy for some - and that'll impact the rest.

We have virtually no mh support for young people.

Labyrinth it’s not what I’ve seen, the opposite. Much higher mood. All friends included. Also on threads here many handwringing before June 1 groups went back, saying they’d keep them off, then thread on thread with delighted dc. I think people overestimate it yes, mostly children see their friends first and signs / changes etc second, if much at all. The mood lift was evident on here too.

We’ll see though. Bigger classes, I doubt much will change from above.

Of course it’s important but why do a significant proportion of parents in the U.K. delegate all responsibility to schools? Education and mental health begin at home. Yes I appreciate there’s a proportion of society that are disadvantaged in this respect but that should be a small proportion

Yes it should begin at home and ultimately be the responsibility of the parents. Just like providing food, heat and shelter and yet still many believe children shouldn’t cost them anything etc.

If schools can’t reopen safely they need to stay closed and parents will have to educate their own children just like other countries are doing.

If we do get a second spike, it's generally got nothing to do with the government, it's about the people who have decided that they can no longer be bothered to socially distance themselves, it continue with sanitising, I have seen a lot of it recently. When questioned or asked to move away, the response had often been something like ' well, the numbers are going down so it's OK now' or ' the chances of me getting it are minimal'

That's the kind of mentality that will result in a second spike.

You can't extrapolate from one group to wider society. My own children have no issues and also enjoyed the school return.

UK has high rates of mh issues. 75% of those with mh conditions get no support. None. This is not an opinion of mine, it is how it is in the UK.

Do you expect their MH to have improved during lockdown?

Don't forget - teachers were very worried about the kids they didn't see so clearly they weren't enjoying being back as they weren't there.

Our head has been open about this concern.

Do you expect their MH to have improved during lockdown?

No that’s the issue. It’s worsened and will get worse the longer it goes on.

Our borders are open we are still letting people in so why would there be a second spike. Come one come all bring your virus with you

with very unequal social/economic outcomes across our society.

And another issue is this. The longer state schools cannot fully open the wider the gap between the top and bottom. Drivers for private and state are different and keep one sector leaping ahead.

Then you add that closing schools cost jobs which decreases opportunity for some.

The issue is, if the goal is to keep schools open as much as possible, then the way to do this may well not be to open them fully.

@EmbarrassingAdmissions

what do you suggest a student who is hard of hearing and needs to lip read do if masks are made mandatory in schools?

Live Transcribe (needs android phone) and the teacher uses a microphone that goes to a live display. For one on one conversations, the phone and the app work well, even better with an external microphone rather than the internal one.

It's not a fabulous workaround but it does work. It does, however, also rely upon people wearing masks through which they can speak.

You’re not wrong, but with what money? As sure as hell Johnson and co are not going to fund it.