With this virus England now needs to be treated separately to the rest of the UK

[annabel85]

When you look at the daily figures the death rate in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland is usually always now 0 or very low single digits with even infection rates in the single digits per day.

England on the other hand is recording 100+ death rates most days and a few hundred new cases. The fact Scotland, Wales and N Ireland are so low is giving England a false sense of security.

Therefore we're at the point where England's figures should be reported separately. The other home nations have took the virus seriously and not rushed to ease restrictions until the rates were low enough and more stringent rules.

It's not the 'UK' that is announcing more deaths every day than the rest of EU put together it's England announcing more deaths than the rest of Europe including the home nations.

The short answer is “yes”, but that answer is disingenuous.

Say goodbye to your tourism then, which in the absence of international visitors, is going to desperately need all those diseased Englanders. Also, enjoy pouring tons of Scottish taxpayers' money into policing a long border which has no checkpoints or barriers.

On the other hand, Scotland is on course for eradication by the end of summer. Ask yourself why england is not, and also ask yourself why we should sacrifice that progress.

England is presumbably not 'on course for eradication' for the same reason as Germany, France, Spain and virtually all major nations are not: because it's an entirely unrealistic idea.

However, if Scotland wants to hermetically seal itself, its economy and its people from the rest of the world, have at it.

@Artesia

Indeed. Globally it’s impossible.

However it’s doable on an international scale, if not a global one. Close ties exist between various groups of countries.

I strongly suspect that, if a vaccine fails to appear and if we face successive waves of virus and lockdown, more countries will come to this way of thinking.

I think most countries are still in the “bargaining” stage of dealing with this. They still think they can game the virus, opening up pubs and hoping they can chase the virus around while waiting for a vaccine.

They need to accept this reality, and decide if they want to live with it (herd immunity) or deal with it (eradication).

@IcedPurple

“ all those diseased Englanders”

Honestly not sure why I bothered to give a polite response.

However it’s doable on an international scale, if not a global one. Close ties exist between various groups of countries

So a sort-of global version of contact bubbles? That seems really over simplistic, and not all countries have the same links so, for example, the U.K. has strong ties to Europe but also with Commonwealth countries. Spain has closer links with Latin America etc. Also, it would basically mean wealthier countries with the resources to eradicate the virus quicker bubbling together and leaving everyone else to it. Plus how would international trade work? International aid and humanitarian projects? No cross-bubble international sport? Might not seem a big deal, but provides jobs for a vast number of people.

It seems like trying to put the lid back on Pandora’s box, and no way it could work in reality.

It's putting England to shame

Is it? In what way?

Or maybe it's because England doesn't have a devolved government and the other home nations do?

And this may be news to people in other home nations, but there are a lot of non-English people living in England. So it's not "the English", it's "people in England". To be fair to Nicola Sturgeon, she always talks about the "people of Scotland" not "Scottish people" - you could all take a leaf out of her book.

Anyway OP you'll be glad to know that as a virus shedding (also jogging, the horror of it) English person, I cancelled my holiday to Scotland later in the year.

Aren't English posters pissed off at the waffle coming from Johnson and Gove? Either make masks mandatory in shops or don't. But don't waffle on, causing confusion. The Scottish government made them mandatory, I went shopping today, everyone bar a couple of folk wore them.
No hassles no dramas. People not wearing them, I presume on medical grounds, went about with no hassle either.
Everyone respecting each other and getting on with it. And we've had 4 or 5 days now with no deaths from covid. And low newly positive numbers. I think our government aren't perfect, but they've handled it well. NS is up at the podium nearly every day, telling us the numbers and what she wants us to do. And most folks I know are doing it. And it seems to be working.

Aren't English posters pissed off at the waffle coming from Johnson and Gove?
No. I started wearing a mask a few weeks ago. I don't need a politician telling me what to do, a suggestion works fine.

@ssd

Well there you go no deaths in scotland for 4 days or so because all wearing masks...whereas @ssd says in Egland still waffling on about wearing masks... there you go all sorted.....

But wait ....masks have only been mandatory in Scotland since 10th ... only 3 days ago... so the reduced death rate not down to wearing masks then is it....

I've been wearing a mask for a lot longer than that, mandatory wearing has obviously increased the number but it's not as if no one had already started.

Aren't English posters pissed off at the waffle coming from Johnson and Gove?
No. I started wearing a mask a few weeks ago. I don't need a politician telling me what to do, a suggestion works fine.

This. We use common sense and don't need spoon-feeding or individual letters to explain the mask situation. I've been wearing mine and using sanitiser and will continue to do so until I decide it's safe not to.

Aren't English posters pissed off at the waffle coming from Johnson and Gove?

Not really. There is no consensus on the neccessity of mask wearing in places like shops, where you're unlikely to be close to others for more than a few seconds.

And it seems to be working.

Masks have only been mandatory in Scotland for under a week, so any effects that has had won't be known for some time. Other than that, guidelines and adherence to them haven't been all that different in the 4 nations of the UK. So to say that Scotland's relatively lower numbers - though really not very impressive compared to many similar sized European nations - are all due to the Scottish govt's policies, and not say, to different population densities, different proportions of BAME groups and the presence of major international airports, seems a bit presumptive.

Doesn't really fit into the politial point scoring game, I know.

There are many more people in England......

@KayEngel

There are many more people in England......

No but they have a special formula. You just times their cases by ten and hey presto. Winner winner.

We use common sense and don't need spoon-feeding or individual letters to explain the mask situation

Which is fine but relying on the common sense of the public is not a winning strategy, certainly not dealing with a pandemic.

It requires leadership and strategy.

'There were thousands of people crammed onto the beaches'

Everyone saw the pics of Dorset. Everyone said there'd be a big rise in deaths in the area.

Not a single death from CV in Dorset hospitals for 4 weeks.

Do those in Scotland want to stay at home forever while England subsidises them?

Do those in Scotland want to stay home forever risking peoples mental health?

My uncle died of cancer on 4th March, my aunt couldn't cope with 8 weeks of isolation and took her own life 3 weeks ago.

This is what you're risking by going for elimination rather than control

Do those in Scotland want to stay at home forever while England subsidises them?

In fairness, they'll venture out to the supermarket every now and then.

Wearing masks, of course. Because Nicola told them and they're so respecful and obidient.

@HairyFloppins

Yes. It’s called disease prevalence. It’s a rather standard and useful medical technique for measuring disease in a population. Your point is?

The point of masks is to reduce risk of spreading the virus when not at home. Certainly not much sign of people staying home where I am in Scotland! But the masks will have an impact on the risk of being out and about.

The sneery, anti Scottish sentiment here is pretty poor.

@ssd I agree - much more anti - Scottish than anti- English sentiment. And the old chestnut about us being subsidised. It’s very unpleasant

I wholeheartedly agree OP. I think they should be reported separately.

Its clear the Tories are happy to have the virus circulate to some degree. Herd immunity and they don't give a shit about the minions. Let those that are poor, old or have an underlying health condition catch it. They clearly don't care.

I typed out a long response but you just need to watch Janey Godley's videos to understand the policy.
www.bing.com/videos/search?q=janey+godley+nicola+sturgeon+youtube&docid=608022400982518683&mid=1EE2A7D2C9C39DA36F981EE2A7D2C9C39DA36F98&view=detail&FORM=VIRE

Population of England 55 million
Population of Scotland 5.5 million

Of course there are more cases in England. Plus there's more area of population density in England.