Just because you are allowed to doesn't mean it's safe to

[DomDoesWotHeWants]

Talking to a friend last night who has booked a week abroad for herself and family.

I admired her courage and said I hoped they had a lovely time and to make sure they had enough masks. She said she won't need that apart from on the plane because the government wouldn't allow travel if it wasn't safe.

I didn't rain on her parade but I do wonder how many people feel the same way. If you're allowed to it must mean it's safe.

Supermarkets are lightening up on social distancing and one way systems and people assume it's now safe.

It isn't the virus is still with us and we need to take sensible precautions not send ourselves back into lockdown.

I don't think herd immunity was ever off the table.

It would take about 50 years at the current infection rate to get herd immunity... if such thing were possible. If that was the Government’s strategy, they wouldn’t have locked down Leicester would they.... Leicester would be a target for us to aspire to!

Health services are why I want things to open. Millions of us are suffering because of lack of treatments etc. My health is declining as it others who are also shielded. Until we start finding our own ways to live with this, things aren't going to open up any quicker.

Yes I know but corona. Millions of us simply cannot wait for people to start living their lives so we can live. Suicide rates, depression rates etc will continue to rise. When do any of these people lives start to count?

Remember isolation was about 2 things - Protect the NHS and the Shielding/Vulnerable. We protected the NHS by SD, hand washing etc. The Shielding/Vulnerable are still waiting for their protection because well people have this sudden fear of viruses, at least from where I'm sitting anyway it seems like this.

Various strains of corona were around last Summer. How many people hid at home? What about Avian flu, gastro, and all the rest? Last summer did you think about the corona viruses and other viruses and germ around us? Well for the majority no. Even those who legit have to be mindful of these things go out and have a life.

Without quality there is no life. For the majority that quality is missing so what is the purpose of living? When we've had serious illnesses, near death experiences ets. When you've spent weeks/months in hospital we realise, staying at home isn't a life. Work, home, dinner, tv, bed for all your life you might as well be a robot as far as I'm concerned.

But that's not what I'm saying at all. I'm saying that people risk assess most of the time but some have a blind spot with Covid because "the government say it's safe"

And equally some poeple have a blind spot 'because the govt says it's dangerous'. Covid related restrictions vary widely around the world. The Spanish govt thought it 'wasnt' safe' for children play outside their homes and locked them up in small apartments for weeks on end. By contrast some other governments have imposed very few restrictions.

Should Spanish people also have made their own risk assessments or should they have agreed that it was 'dangerous' for a kid to go for a walk with his parents simply because their government said so?

I will be furious if their stupidity leads to a second wave and another lockdown. Some people are just stupid, I suppose

I think it's stupid to say people shouldn't do things which are permitted under current govt guidelines.

There maybe a second wave but we can’t all stay home and wait for a vaccine. I’m not sure who said they’ be furious if there is a 2nd wave, who will you be furious with?

I think it's stupid to say people shouldn't do things which are permitted under current govt guidelines.

Like smoking and getting drunk? Both legal.

I live in Ireland, our Government has a mandatory 2 week self isolation for all people coming into our countrt

Advisory, not mandatory.

@DomDoesWotHeWants

I think it's stupid to say people shouldn't do things which are permitted under current govt guidelines.

Like smoking and getting drunk? Both legal.

Yes, both legal. Happily people can make their own assessments about the risks of these and other behaviours without having to run it by you.

@DomDoesWotHeWants just like smoking and drinking, it is bad for people’s health but you are not going to stop them. The government have opened up the restrictions, getting angry about people carrying on with their lives, is not going to stop them, it’s their choice. You just have to accept it.

The word "safe" should be banned. Nothing is safe. Stepping outside your front door isn't entirely risk free, ever. Getting behind the wheel of a car isn't safe. Paddling in the sea isn't safe. Eating isn't safe - 350 people a year die of choking because of something they've eaten and we're not banning food.

in a sense @crosseyedMary is correct about the governments own financial interests. Look at the Track and trace and a few other things where Mp's have vested interests.

What was said about Cumming was also correct. At that time when the nation had been told to stay the fuck at home, don't visit anyone he decided for whatever reason to well, go see his family. Legally nothing wrong with this. Had he sped then yes a crime would have been committed.

And this highlights that some people see guidance and think it's law when it's not.

Remember only go out when you have to? It brought the country to a halt because well people assumed that meant stay at home. Some even went as far as to call the police because someone went outside which was perfectly legal.

How many offices automatically went furlough when they could have made adjustments to stay open and SD? Instead they let fear take over rather than looking at the logistical side of things they closed fully.

Workload was one of the issues iirc, well those workloads are not only still going to be there but so will a lot more shit that has grown since. At best for planning and implementation etc they should have closed temporary instead of moaning about the useless teachers. Workplaces could have furloughed the staff that needed it, and the rest suck it up like the NHS, police etc also do.

I am going on holiday abroad at the end of next week too. DD is going on Sunday for a week with her boyfriend, before she meets us for the fortnight after.

I am clinically vulnerable and have been careful throughout.

We have weighed up the risks and have made the decision to go.

Where we are mainly going to has lower transmission rates than England, less active cases and no deaths in the last month or so.

We are travelling by train and staying in smallish hotels where additional cleaning and other precautions are in place. We will wear masks on public transport and in the other indoor areas where they are expected.

I haven't been out and about lots before. I haven't been to a crowded bar, etc - though did go to our local pub for tea last night which was very well spaces out, masks and screens for staff, all felt very space and not risky. I only went in a proper supermarket for the first time today, since March.

I have been working for home but will be back FT in September - where the Government deems it fine for e to be, in a crowded room with no masks, etc.

I truly believe that my fortnight away is no more risky, and in many ways less risky, than going on holiday in England right now and to some extent just being out and about and at work right now.

In laws have just booked Croatia in September. Both 60 and have some underlying health issues but they seem pretty confident about it. I have a friend who came over from the US at the beginning of lockdown, stayed in 3 different house whilst here, took 2 flights to get back home and has now planned a trip away somewhere in America that involves flying again. I know people
Who have seen people throughout lockdown, no distancing, most people I know have started booking holidays in the U.K now going to the pub, shopping, socialising more and more.

I still don’t have the confidence to meet in the garden 👀🤦‍♀️

@Cusano34 why are you extremely vulnerable?

There was that case in Singapore where someone had contracted covid by sitting in the same seat as someone else who was contagious earlier in the day

Unless that person was in complete isolation apart from that one time he/she was "sitting in the same seat as someone else who was contagious" then there's absolutely no way you can definitely prove that this is how he/she caught the virus.

And even if you could, that would be one single proven case of a person catching Covid though sitting on a seat, out of all the billions of people who have been potentially exposed to the virus. Is this enough to make you change your lifestyle? Certainly wouldn't be for me, but risk assessment is notoriously subjective.

I will be furious if their stupidity leads to a second wave and another lockdown. Some people are just stupid, I suppose

Like what ?

@Alex50 no just stupidly anxious! Worrying about passing it on etc etc I know I need to start though, and I will! Probably this weekend

@Cusano34 poor you, that must be awful Take little steps, good luck xx

Alex50 That's great, it sounded tough where the people on the radio were! Maybe it was a different part or something? I don't know, it was just a discussion on the radio where they were warning that holidays weren't really going to be holidays that other countries had to guard against coronavirus too

Maybe he’s the other side of the island and not in a hotel, i’ll find out more when he comes home

I suppose we should be grateful that some people are prepared to be guinea pigs but I don't fancy it😕
going on holiday abroad would involve spending extended periods of time in indoor spaces with multiple people and air conditioning
It's got super spreader written all over it ...i'mma wait till next year thank you 😳

We are booked to go abroad in 3 weeks time, booked back in January. I’d sort of assumed either flights or accommodation would be cancelled but so far neither have been. I’m ok with the plane journey as actual risk seems low at the moment. My main worry is some kind of lockdown or being told we have to isolate while there. I don’t think we can cancel now without losing money and if all goes well it would still be a nice holiday.

@CharBart
If a country goes into lockdown you will be given a number of days to go home.

no just stupidly anxious!

The sooner you start living again the better. Anxiety is a fucker which needs to be fed.

@SebandAlice thanks, I didn’t realise that. Hopefully a worst case scenario!

no just stupidly anxious! not stupid at all, still being uber cautious here, people who come by or you bump into to Socially distance generally end up getting to close, trying to hand you something etc. But I agree there is a middle ground.