No space at school

[PinkDiamond1]

This is outing so have NC.

Our school is a large primary 3 form per year.

They've offered alternate weeks starting from the 8th June for year groups.

We were undecided on sending our DC back.

However we got an email yesterday saying they were at full capacity for key worker and Nursery R, Y1 and Y6 and can't accept anymore children!

Is this allowed?

@MintyMabel the teachers who have been covering keyworker children have been in on rotas do in school once a week/fortnight leaving the rest of the time to sort out home learning. You are on cloud cuckoo land if you think a teacher in school full time can manage it all. It's either/or

then it will be interesting to see what that poor NQT's work load is like.

She’s tweeting lots of lovely pictures of her long walks she’s taking so she can’t be too overloaded.

teachers who have been covering keyworker children have been in on rotas do in school once a week/fortnight leaving the rest of the time to sort out home learning. You are on cloud cuckoo land if you think a teacher in school full time can manage it all. It's either/or

Not all the teachers will be in full time. Not all the teachers doing online learning are finding it a full time job either.

But of course, we’re not allowed to suggest teachers aren’t up to their eyes working 20 hours a day, are we. The vast majority of teachers I’ve spoken to have said they aren’t as busy as when they are full time classroom based. It makes a difference that they aren’t the “I’M A POOR HARD DONE BY TEACHER” types.

@ineedaholidaynow, it did have one gate but they have made another one at the back of the school. The approach to the main gate is going to be challenging, one way it is a narrow footpath between the school and garden fences, it is difficult to pass people without touching them you sort of have to both go right up to the fences and if you are passing a big/twin buggy you have to stop and stand with your back up against the fence. If the tried to make that one way it would be a nightmare as it is a long walk if you leave the school the other way I would think it is probably over half a mile to get back to the other end of the footpath, now I look at it I realise the way the estate and school were planned is ridiculous. Having the new gate at the back is very useful.

Once you are through the gate the preschool, KS1 and KS2 have separate entrances to the school.

the teachers who have been covering keyworker children have been in on rotas do in school once a week/fortnight leaving the rest of the time to sort out home learning My DD is a teacher, she is in 2 days a week normally, she's had the odd week with 3 days and one week with no days.

Most of the teachers looking after keyworker children were mainly doing childcare rather than teaching per se. The ones who will be looking after the Year Group bubbles will be doing more teaching although to start with it will probably be more looking after their welfare but the teaching element will increase as time goes on.

I don't know if it's 'allowed' but my immediate thoughts are that your child is entitled to a full time education.
My DD said no in the first instance. On discussing it with family and looking at what the school ( only then ) told parents they were going to put in place , she decided that she would allow her yr 1 child to return to school. This has been accepted by the school.
YANBU.
I have continued to work with the most vulnerable in society throughout lockdown. Not one member of staff has contracted covid.
Wtf do teachers think they are so very special?

The school have said they will cover the same curriculum they send home so not the full national curriculum

Wtf do teachers think they are so very special?

I'm sorry - do you believe that a group of teachers have written the advice about re-opening schools?

myrtleWilson
No obviously not.
However individual HT's are sending their own emails to parents and many are making it very clear that they do not want the children to return.
They continue to be paid a full time salary and their job is to provide an education for our children.
The Government are saying it is safe for children to return in three school years.
Many, many people have continued to work in environments that are far more scary than in a classroom
So again: Wtf do teachers think they are so very special?
They need to return to the job they are being paid to do and make the transition for the children as comfortable as is possible without attempting to terrify parents. If a child is in R. 1 or 6 they have a right to attend school, no matter if a parent has changed their minds

@Itoldyouiwasill

I don't know if you are just misinformed or deliberately obtuse.

The schools are not making the rules, the Government are. The schools are just following the rules.

The government has said classes must have 15 or less children
The government have said that desks should be situated 2m apart
The government have said that bubbles should not mix
The government have said that the priority is Reception, then year 1 the. Year 6
The government has that 1 teacher needs to be in each group. If there are not enough teachers then a TA can lead a group under the lead of a teacher.

If a class has 30 children, a classroom can hold 10 with the distancing, that means that 1 class now needs 3 classrooms, and 3 teachers.

It's not a matter of teachers not wanting to work or thinking they are above other people and shouldnt be at risk, it's a simple matter of there not being enough classrooms or teachers to suddenly double or triple the number of groups.

In my DDs school, taking back just 3 years worth of children would require 3 more classrooms then they have in the whole school and that's without having years 2-5 or any keyworker groups.

They don't have a right though under pandemic situations - if a school deems it impossible to safely re-open, or if a LA deems it unsafe for a school to re-open then what? Plus if a school is full after accounting for requests from N,R, Y1 then actually a Y6 parent changing their mind has no room to complain - the school is following the guidance.

Most teachers I know are absolutely desperate to get back to teaching their classes - but they want to do it safely - for the sake of children and their colleagues. I fail to see how this is unreasonable

Plus teachers are not 'returning' to a job - they're moving location to continue the job they've been doing under lockdown (and yes, I know different schools have had different approaches and probably different challenges, and, no I'm not a teacher )

Itoldyouiwasill The same government is saying to only have a gathering of a MAXIMUM of six people at 2m apart outdoors and not to use the household loo, yet up to 15 in a classroom for extended periods of time seems fine. Do you not think when the guidelines are so contradictory that in the name of safety Head Teachers are not doing their best? The only letters from HTs i've seen have set out honest reflections of what schools will be like for returning children, but please feel free to show me one that says don't send your children.
Finally they are being paid because they are still working, how hard is that to grasp?

I don't know if you are just misinformed or deliberately obtuse
Neither I hope
I have many family a few friends who are teachers
The majority have been having absolute jolly in the past ten weeks
It is now time they were back working at what they are paid to do and that is teaching our children
Many schools have provided the absolute minimum education for the children with patronising and bizarre advise to parents about making the most of this precious time, to know they can bake with their children and ( Gosh) they can read with their children...
If a primary school, eg, has around 200 children usually and the government are asking for 90 children to return how on earth can that not be possible?

FFS... READ the GUIDELINES.

... all 46 versions.

As if.

You said no, what part of no do you not understand?

Stupid.

But carry on everyone, MN loves a good teacher bashing thread

I don’t know how many times it has been explained but here we go again...

For example 1 form entry school 7 x teachers maybe 4 TA ( if they are lucky)

Each bubble really needs two adults ( especially younger ones)
4x adults reception
4x adults year ones
Key worker group x2 adults ( I’d there are less than 15 quietly likely to need 2 groups So extra 2 adults)
Year 6 - maybe can manage one adults per group, less likely to need help toileting etc but adults still need a break no mixing of bubble )

Potentially 16 adults Before you think about any needed for SEND needs. Schools do not have enough adults of space, the Guidance was clearly not written by someone actually needed to put it into place in a school.

FFS... READ the GUIDELINES
FFS know that if the Government are asking for 90 children to return to a school used to teaching over 200 with exactly the same number of teachers and exactly the same amount of room there is no big deal.
Social distancing can be observed, there will be 3 school years in a school designed for 7 school years. There are staff employed for 7 school years. So a minimum of 7 qualified teachers, 7 LSA's and 7 rooms for 90 children. What on earth is so hard?

@TorysSuckRevokeArticle50

There are 3 classes in each year at our primary. Due to the need to put desks 2m apart, each class has to split into 3 so 1 year group that would usually use 3 classrooms will now need 9.

reception, year 1 and year 6 would usually be 9 classrooms. Now if everyone returns it would be 27 classrooms.

They don't have that many classrooms in the whole school, as usually R- yr6 is 24 classes.

The only way they can do it is to ask who isnt returning, set that as the number and then allocate the rooms accordingly.

Here you go @Itoldyouiwasill here’s my earlier post.

Normal full school, reception - year 6 is 21 classes, 3 per year. Because of classroom size and social distancing, they will need 63 to support all children with social distancing in place. Instead of 21 teachers, they will need 63 or to accept that some classes will not have a teacher, they will be lead by a Ta. Most TAs in the school are part time, due to cost savings, and with all TAs and all teachers in separate groups, they will still have one third of the classes completely unsupported as there are not enough of them.

What about the key worker children and the vulnerable children @Itoldyouiwasill

Indeed @ineedaholidaynow and preparing work/marking for the years that are not back yet, and supporting those children who need 1:1.....

Finally they are being paid because they are still working, how hard is that to grasp
My NDN is a HT, she has been to her school for around 2 hours each morning since lockdown. The rest of the day she has mooched in her garden and walked her dog. She did make loud video calls for the first week but that soon stopped
Family members have never been happier. They feel they've been on a long paid holiday.
But, sorry, forgot this was MN for a moment where no one can criticise teachers

Itoldyouiwasill Does your calculation include KW children who need their own bubbles. When we did our classrooms the other day the biggest could fit 12 the smallest 5 (after we'd taken every bit of furniture not nailed down out) We lost 3 classrooms to storage for all the redundant tables, chairs, book cases etc. The point people are making is not all schools are the same, some have space some don't, some have high levels of KW children some don't. I'm not sure why some people cannot grasp simple facts like this maybe they just like feeling angry.

That might be your NDN but the HT I know has been working flat out

Does your calculation include KW children who need their own bubbles
No i admit it didn't