Time to get real people

[cookingmywaythroughlockdown]

Ok I think it's time to get a grip on reality!

Coronavirus is pretty nasty but it isn't apocalypse now time. Most of us are going to get it at some point and we will be just fine. So will our families and friends.
The UK cannot stay locked down for much longer without producing a national disaster that will reverberate for decades. So - you will be going back to work, your kids will be going back to school. Wash your hands well and enjoy your lives.
I'm just so sick of the posts prophesying carnage and really enjoying competitive isolation. For most people living like this is borderline harmful. For some it is already actively harmful.

We have to come out from under the bed. Wear a mask, wear gloves if you like but be prepared to live a normal if socially distanced life.

All epidemics burn themselves out eventually. We are much better placed to treat and protect the vulnerable then ever before. At some point soon we have to just get on with it.

Every person on here who offers sarcasm in response to a reasonable point of view should hand their head in shame and should, frankly, stop posting on a forum which involves mutual discussion.

The response is probably nothing to do with the views that the OP is expressing but more to do with the fact that this is one more in a very long line of threads that have been started saying exactly the same thing.

The advice from poster after poster to 'get a grip' or in the OP's case 'get real' because it isn't as bad as people think it is is starting to wear thin.

We all know that a great many people will get it and probably not be terribly ill. We all know that only a small percentage of people who get it will die. We really don't need yet another thread advising us of the fact; I suspect that is what the sarcasm is about.

My husband is furloughed but hasn't yet had any money. I am working but as I have to submit an invoice and my workplace is closed, I haven't been paid since January. We rent.
But I would still prefer to be in lockdown to help protect other human beings. Call me a big softy. My aunt has died from Covid and I learned today that one of my students currently has a father aged 52 in intensive care, a grandmother who they are literally waiting to die, and a 22 year old positive tested sister. And that is in a town with only 27 confirmed cases.

I also find these threads interesting from a psychological point of view, the people telling MNers they were liars a month ago for worrying that the UK was going to be as bad, if not worse than Italy are now calling people names for not wanting people to die.
It takes a special kind of dirty soul to do and think both of those things tbh.

I also agree with pp (sorry, can't remember the name)- I've seen many posts from people discussing facts and figures rationally. I've seen lots of posts saying "lockdown needs to end NOW! We're all DOOMED OTHERWISE"

I know which ones I find most outlandish.

Worse economy = less good quality accessible healthcare. Doesn't take a genius to figure out that might lead to some deaths. Or worse outcomes.

That NHS you all wanna save... Needs money. From taxpayers. People need to work.

There will be no NHS if we lockdown indefinitely.

Poor form by notmrpootles inboxing people. Also their stance is tin eared as plenty of people on here have explained the reasons why lockdown imminently is not a good idea - and that it doesn’t look like the govt and experts in this field are planning to lockdown for months but a few more weeks so things are in place to slowly ease the current level of lockdown with hopefully not causing an immediate surge again and being right back where we started.

@Ormally

It is very interesting. As a general rule those who went into social distancing late had a much bigger peak, but then smaller second peak, or no second peak.
Those who went into social distancing earlier had a much smaller first peak, but the second peak was often similar, especially if they released measures. However overall they were less.

The one ours currently looks most similar to is St Louis, because of the slow decline after the peak. Then you can see the potential effect of releasing the social distancing for only two weeks.

Then you get ones like Oakland, which must have thought it was over and safe when they released because it's right down on the x-axis, but got a substantial (but smaller) second peak.

It's not totally comparable to now though, as people will travel more. So when they release it, people will be going round the country, even abroad if allowed, which will spread it to areas that thought they were safe.

SpyApp

And here for public consumption is your initial comment

Wow! A saviour cometh! Thank goodness for you and your insight.

Sarcasm, because you had no intelligent riposte to the point being made.

Not the nudge unit

Not a PBP

Not somebody starting the same thread again and again

The personal attacks are quite funny really. Do some of you actually find it so hard to believe somebody could think differently about an issue?

Thank you so much for posting that.
Because no one else will have seen it on a public thread.
I'm not going to engage with you further.
I'm going to milk my goats.

The government hasn't proposed either continuous lockdown or removing all restrictions. They have proposed opening the economy in a managed way that keeps the UK healthcare system functioning.

It really doesn't matter whether people on MN 'get a grip' because the the government isn't getting isn't basing it's decisions on threads on MN.

Ah, I do love a COVID denier/ minimiser, it’s all the same. I presume from your post OP that you or any of your loved ones are not affected by this virus?

Let me tell you what really fucks with my mental health. Being on my knees on the driveway when my very fit, healthy, capable Father-in-Law is stretchered into an ambulance and I believe I’ll never see him again. Or praying (to a God I don’t really believe in) that my baby granddaughter will make it through the night and her temperature will stabilise and she’ll stop spiking, or take her Daddy, aged 25 Type 1 diabetic. Will he even make it? Or her Mummy, my 25 year old perfectly healthy daughter, who can’t climb the stairs for 2 days and 2 nights because she is so breathless. Or my husband who I dial 111, 4 weeks in, trying to avoid a 999 call or for or my strapping 6 foot 4, 19 year old son, who finds it hard to breathe out, given his chest is so tight.

I am fucked financially; my seasonal business doesn’t meet the criteria for me or my loyal staff to be furloughed and my elusive £10,000 grant is not forthcoming from our caring and compassionate government.

But let me not deter you from your intent to get back to normal and stop this hysteria now. To quote the Hunger games as it is so apt in these here, killer virus with no cure, circumstances, “may the odds be forever in your favour”, but you love "are going to get it...and you'll be just fine".

@cookingmywaythroughlockdown, have you any comments on the posts that explain the view by many experts and which the govt is following why calling for lockdown imminently is a bad idea - and the point there are no signs the govt plan to keep this level of lockdown for months but a few more weeks for the reasons outlined in posts?

They have proposed opening the economy

The government can't close or opening an economy - I mean loosening restrictions.

I agree with the op. Luffs you all though .

id rather do lock down than have more people die of this,we have already lost too many.

My understanding is that the vaccine trials have involved injecting some people with vaccine and some with placebo, and sending them out into the world to live their lives, and seeing what happens. So ironically, the stricter the lockdown, the less likely they are to be exposed to the virus, and the longer it’ll take to develop a vaccine.

Well it won't happen next Thursday no matter how many thread's people start.

It doesn't matter how pissed off you are OP with lockdown it will happen when the people at the top say not you.

A couple of things.

First - if we exit lockdown too soon - which means, before we have the capacity to do test, track and trace well enough to keep R below 1 - then cases will skyrocket again, and we’ll have to go into lockdown again, OR let it run riot. Either of those would be disastrous for the economy, as well as for the people who would die or be left with permanent health damage.

Second - I do hope that all those who are champing at the bit to leave lockdown (and I understand why) will do the decent thing, which means download the contact tracing app if you have a suitable smartphone, continue to limit your social contact (though not as much as currently), and have the vaccine when it arrives if medically able to do so.

Those high risk who can self isolate, continue to do so. Those not high risk but who are scared, isolate as much as possible. But its not reasonable to expect the whole country to lockdown because you are scared really. Those enjoying time off..great, but its not sustainable really, not in its current form

Yes, this. We can't stay living in this limbo or the consequences of the economy collapsing will make deaths from Coronavirus look like a drop in a vast ocean.

Staying in lockdown will not stop people dying. I know that's not what anyone wants to hear but it just won't. It was never meant to. I am so sorry for everyone who's lost family and friends. I too have elderly and vulnerable relative and of course I am worried for them. But, unless we lockdown completely (no supermarket trips no hospitals no nothing) until there's a vaccine and everyone's had it - people will still catch it and unfortunately a minority of those people will not recover.

We obviously cannot completely isolate 100% of the people 100% of the time or else we would all starve to death etc so what's the alternative?

Lockdown in its current till a vaccine and still watch people die? But add on a mental health and poverty crisis on top of that?

I am not calling for everything to be reopened tomorrow and all go back to normal.

A gradual ease of restrictions with a view to some kind of normal in the not too distant future is what I would like to see. I imagine we will be washing hands and staying 2m away for some time but we can work and educate and see family so that's ok imo. Again, a balance.

19:38notmrpootles
All you people proffering biscuits and sarcasm: do you have an alternative? You may lead such sheltered lives that you haven't heard of the economy, but it's not just suited businessmen who give a shit about it; nor is it only callous people who "put money before lives". If the economy tanks, expect to see millions of deaths through poverty and unemployment, only they will go unrecorded as a cost of lockdown.

Blimey I'm not that sheltered to understand that saying "to hell with it let's just lift lockdown this instant and just learn to live with it" will more than likely do more harm to the economy than a controlled easing at the right time and following scientific evidence. We'd soon be right back to square one and the markets freefalling due to further instability. Do you think there's a magic wand that can be saved at the virus to make it disappear so you can get back to your business?

Back to educational neglect - Some kids will never catch up - catch up to what OP? There will be a new norm.

My understanding is that the vaccine trials have involved injecting some people with vaccine and some with placebo, and sending them out into the world to live their lives, and seeing what happens. So ironically, the stricter the lockdown, the less likely they are to be exposed to the virus, and the longer it’ll take to develop a vaccine.

I think that many of the volunteers are healthcare workers so they probably will be exposed fairly quickly especially given the lack of PPE.