Posters who want lockdown lifted

[DianaT1969]

I'm seeing an increase in threads where the poster is impatient for exact details of an exit strategy (even though we can all imagine what it will involve - phased re-opening of some stores and businesses etc,,). Plus we're hearing the usual cries of lockdown is hurting society more than it's helping.
Spain saw a spike in new infections today - the highest since their peak 3 weeks ago. To these posters I'd like to ask what your thread titles will be during our spikes in infections and deaths after this lockdown?
What I'm really getting at is that you don't seem to understand that we're in this for the long haul. There is no quick fix, back to normal.

Catory. There wont be any benefits to give out! No one knows how many people would have died. Someone please correct me but if someone passes away and they have CV19 - that is the cause of death? Even if they are very old, underlying health conditions. We also dont seem to know why this affects men more than women and ethnic minorities.

@MarieG10
Far more people being killed as a result of the lockdown compared with those dying of Covid.

That’s a fair point, however if the volume of Coronavirus cases goes up even higher, I would imagine resources will still be diverted away from cancer patients.

There won’t be as many jobs as there were, there will be a lot of redundancies, a lot of people won’t have jobs to go back to, there will be millions of people claiming UC

@sunglasses Yes if someone dies of something that will be on their death certificate. Just as if someone has a heart attack at age 99 that goes on their death certificate. There is also a space for underlying contributory conditions. So if someone at 99 has a heart attack but already has high blood pressure, high blood pressure will be recorded as a secondary contributory condition.
And children have underlying health conditions. Many many people have common illnesses like asthma. Are you suggesting that if they die of something that is a reason not to record the cause as they had an underlying health condition?
So a child dies of cancer, but because they had asthma we ignore the death from cancer and don't count it?

You also can't apply for help with a mortgage for a fair few months, and no way will benefits cover the cost of living and a mortgage. It's not really as easy as saying everyone be moved onto benefits.

I'm one of those wanting to know more. In my opinion, not wanting to know what's coming is a bit odd.

Lockdown can't last forever and it was never intended to. You claim we already know there'll be a phased return but why can't we be told more about who will he going back to work, whether childcare will reopen at the same time. There are for most people logistics that need to be worked out ahead of time too.

The NHS is currently under capacity. That was the point of suppression. Restrictions have to be eased at some point. I'd like to know when and what the plan is. That isn't an unreasonable ask - as can be seen on the basis that Scotland and Wales have laid out very vague plans today.

I find it weird that some people want to stay in lockdown regardless.

People are being killed from other causes because we do not have enough medics to treat everyone and treat covid 19 patients. That will be the case whether we are under lock down or not.
We also have no idea what those excess number of deaths have been caused by that were recorded as not covid 19. So were they already ill people who have died as a result of catching a mild undetected case of covid 19? Perhaps, we don't know. It needs a proper analysis.

@Bounceyflouncey Who has said everyone should be moved to benefits? Because I did not see anyone saying that.

Even with the rent/mortgage holiday that all still has to be paid back doesnt it?

So even when we come out of this and return to work any family who has every penny from their wages accounted for will somehow have to find the money to pay back the rent/mortgage. If people are going to have to make the choice between their health and feeding their family wouldn't it be better for them to make it before they end up thousands if pounds and hungry only to effectively have to make exactly the same decision a few weeks later but whilst absolutely fucked..

I am saying that if they are logged as dying of CV19 and they are say 95 years old its misleading reporting.

Sadly my Father is in his final years at late 80's. He has had a stroke and various other issues but if he catches CV19 I honestly dont believe that NOT having it would have saved him. In fact we will never know.

I dont know anyone who has had it bar the Health Secretary and the PM. I know lots of the worried well who think they have had it, about to have it. I also have asthma but I was undertaking a front line role and there was no option to do this job at home. Previously I did work at home for a major FTSE company. Home working is not easy, there are an awful lot of shirkers. Women who thought that they could work at home and save on childcare, people who were never around when needed. Its not for everyone.

So it's not the lock down that bothers you as such just how people on mumsnet are talking about it? OK then?

@cantory what is your long term solution then for the people who work in pubs, restaurants, gyms, cinemas, and all the other places that have had to close?

@sunglasses123 I don't agree it is misleading reporting.
And if it was mainly very elderly people dying of this I don't believe we would have ever went on lock down.

Please tell me how many young healthy people die of coronvirus in the UK?

If the op or anyone else feels they wish to lock down for the next twelve to eighteen months then they can crack on and do so.
What they can’t dictate is the rest of us should too

I'm certainly happy to repeat this, @BamboozledandBefuddled

So much sense on this thread.

My gut reaction on this is I feel we have gone too far. The government is too slow to react if something needs changing i.e who is eligble for tests. For a few weeks the take up v capaicty was not the same.

Testing essential workers is a real step forward but why did it take so long. I have a friend who works as a nurse in ACU. She says they are errily quiet as have been for sometime. Why doesnt someone move those valuable nurses, bring back some operations whilst it is quiet.

Or is it all too difficult?? I worked as a major supplier for government for many many years and honestly the waste/lack of decision making was shocking. I suspect they are still lax and slow in making decisions with endless meetings and no one wanting to make a decision.

@Waxonwaxoff0 I think we test, contact trace and isolate. We try and contain it as much as we can while we find better treatment options and develop a vaccine.
Even better treatment options may be enough to get back to normal.
As I understand it the vaccine being developed was already a lot of the way there to respond to SARS. It has been tweaked and is now being tested on humans.
But scientists are saying they are learning more every day. For example BME people are more likely to die. Lots of ideas why this might be the case including vitamin d deficiency. If the issue is vitamin d, then simply making sure everyone takes a supplement may significantly reduce deaths.
There is a lot of black and white thinking on this thread. These posters are putting the choice either as lock down for 2 years, or back to normal. I think there are a lot more options than that, Life is complex and is normally grey, not black and white.

I agree we need to gradually get back to whatever normal will be but we do needs to start plans for children to go back to school and adults go back to work

You cannot track 66 million people . The proposed app is optional. Not everyone has smart phones. It only works of your blue tooth is on which for many is a security risk they arent willing to take and you are relying on a test that is basically invalid the second after you take is as you cant control what happens between the hospital and the car park.

@cantata I honestly think it is a stupid statement. Only the well off can decide to self isolate without government backing. Because if you choose to do that you won't be entitled to any benefits at all. Absolutely zero. Given most people are only 3 pay packets away from homelessness then that is not feasible.

@sunglasses123 I agree that if some areas really are under capacity then other services should restart. That is obvious. It is really hard to know though how common this is or if it literally is a tiny number of staff. Or even if most of the reports are true? People lie all the time on social media. So yes if true it needs to be sorted.

The issue I see with 'lifting lockdown' is that it gives unscrupulous employers the right to demand that all their staff come back to work when that may put some staff at risk

On the other hand if the job still exists and the work can’t be done from home what’s the solution? You could get signed off by your GP if you feel you shouldn’t go to work due to your own health, but that may mean only SSP.

Employers who have seen their revenue slashed don’t have the money to pay staff who shouldn’t be at work for health reasons to stay at home. They should offer solutions such as unpaid leave, or furlough (if eligible) and not force people to work if they feel it’s risky, or pay SSP, but what’s the solution otherwise? And why is asking staff to come back to the role they are contracted to do “unscrupulous”?

God the conference is just so depressing.
No signs of lifting anything.
Just dire warnings not to lift lockdown.
Just what are they planning? There's capacity apparently, NHS isn't over run. What's the difference today versus six weeks?

No vaccine, no cure - are they just hoping to eke this out for 18months or so?

@SarahTancredi Testing and contact tracing is used all the time to contain infectious diseases and it was used a 100 years ago. It is more challenging at this stage of infection though, but easier if a smaller percentage of the population have been infected so far.

Basically all I've understood is we stay in, cancel all non immediately urgent hospital treatment, don't go out etc so that we stop everyone getting it at once and needing a hospital bed.

Surely they have an idea by now of how many people are likely to need a bed.

I have zero faith in any of them

I would urge you all to stop thinking in black and white, look at the complexity and consider that the solution to lock down is more likely to be a shade of grey.