I can’t see an end to this.. 😔

[Mummypig2020]

God I’m really struggling the past few days.

I just want to see some light at the end of the tunnel. It just feels like constant negative news and nothing about the near future.

It makes me so sad. How are other countries starting to go “back to normal”? But we aren’t?

I get where Phil is coming from. There’s a limit to the sacrifices people will be prepared to make for the benefit of people to whom they are not connected. That’s human nature. We are programmed to look after our own. The economy, society and education can’t remain paused for any significant length of time. It’s just not feasible.

The virus isn’t going anywhere and we need to find a way of living with it. A vaccine is by no means guaranteed.

What’s been brought to light is the huge number of people who have poor general health. It highlights the inequality of health. I think the best we can hope for is a reduced transmission rate. Those who have poor health and are at greatest risk will have to take precautions for longer. I think it needs to be handled really carefully, I have no solutions, but I don’t think it would be good for society to end up with two tiers based on health.

@Deux

Thanks, you are completely correct in the way I am thinking.

There’s a limit to the sacrifices people will be prepared to make for the benefit of people to whom they are not connected. That’s human nature.

You mean some people.

It is also human nature for people to make sacrifices for the benefit of people to whom they are not connected. That is also human nature.

People are not as rigid as you think they are. People will make sacrifices but there has to be something in it for them to do so, even though that may be quite small.

I agree with Phil actually. Being locked in for years isnt feasible. We are selfish people and thats ok

Why the fuck should I put mental health,routine,finances and recovery at risk to save someone I dont know? At some point the government have to make a sensible economic decision using their heads not their hearts. No one wants more death. No one wants the economy fucked. I know which is worse for the country.
And I wish all the scaremongering would stop. Yes people are dying and yes it's sad and awful. Most people who get it will be fine. The reason were so shocked when 26yr old die is because it doesn't happen often. Thankfully. All the hysteria is not helpful.

I think it's up to businesses and schools to start to put plans in place for a socially distanced life.

Supermarkets are doing queues and in my local ones it's working superbly - a long (fast moving) queue outside, everyone 2 metres apart, staff on the door.

Every shop and coffee shop can do the same - some business is better than none for a lot of them?

And with schools Dh (SLT) and I were talking yesterday - he's in a school of 1300 students - using their largest rooms - assembly hall/gym hall/drama room - he reckons they can do 2, possibly 3 years at a time - so they could be in 2 days a week on an ongoing basis.

We must find a way to cope with this new life until there's a vaccine.

Avalanche, I did say there’s a limit to what people will sacrifice. I think this is a more commonly held view than is expressed on mumsnet currently.

I think what will be interesting as well this month is the April payroll and whether the furlough rebates will come in in time for staff to be paid.

Economic necessity will be a driver for millions of people.

@phil
Agree.
I've read this entire thread.
Some very interesting points.
Coming from a place of kindness and compassion I said this from the start - if the economy suffers we all do.

Sheild the vulnerable and the over 70 and let everyone else carry on - including hand washing, social distancing etc.

There is no much confusion and hysteria.

Kindness and common sense

And when that's managed we can sort out the homeless.

Because criticising the government, your neighbors, the nhs and anything else to make YOU feel better helps no one.

We need to stay strong , and focused and supportive of each other so we can get through this , come out the other side.

Robin “ We need to stay strong , and focused and supportive of each other so we can get through this , come out the other side.”

Do you mean in the current situation? Because as things stand, we literally can’t do what you’re describing.

Que?

gin are you asking me, Manuel?

"if the economy suffers we all do"

Well some will suffer considerably more than others. And if you think that those at the top will be as kind and compassionate as you're proposing, you're living in a dreamworld.

Yes,@LilacTree1, not necessarily disagreeing, but just wondering why you feel the current situation precludes us from trying to be supportive of each other? It's a fairly general aspiration.

@lilactree
After

But being strong and supportive - at a distance is helping me.

And in turn that makes me stronger abs able to help others.

I've just sent the following email to Dominic Raab:

-------
Why are we continuing to apply lock down restrictions on a whole population level? Its unwarranted and unjustified – and extremely harmful.

Over 70’s and those with underlying health conditions should continue with lock down with arms length support financially and practically from the rest of us. We should not be subjecting young people in particular to these privations. Yes, if the under 70’s with no known underlying health conditions resume normal life then a few of us (predominantly over 40’s) will cop it – and I say that as an overweight, unfit 52 year old – but so be it. We none of us are immortal and the relatively few cases would be well within NHS capacity constraints. If this is truly about what is best for society overall we would have selective lock down for the vulnerable, not lock down for all.

We also should be providing palliative care only to the over 80’s with covid (again I have parents who are over 80 and I love them dearly). In normal times I would baulk at rationing health care for the very elderly, but these are not normal times and seriously why are we ventilating the very elderly?

Many people feel this way – they are currently too fearful to articulate it because of potential censure from others...but they are likely to find their voices soon as frustration mounts

I don’t expect you to listen to me. I am under no delusion about how insignificant I am and how little power I have – but I email in the hope that others are doing likewise in growing numbers so that it gets to a point where you cannot ignore this

Yours sincerely
------

It will no doubt achieve nothing at all (apart from temporary catharsis for getting it off my chest) but I'd just like government to be aware that not everyone is happy with this state of affairs

Signed @LimitIsUp

@LimitIsUp Done

Signed.

Manuel - I typed a full reply and the computer ate it!

Get through what? A dictatorship? I don’t know how I’m meant to get through that, free speech is silenced.

If you mean Covid, I’m not worried about getting through that.

Limit I sort of agree, but vulnerable people should be free to live as well. We can all sign a Do Not Treat.

@LimitIsUp Why do you think your PERSONAL views on who should have treatment be applied to the whole population? What right have you got to tell others people/families how to act? Imagine if you said "BAME or Women" rather than over 80s?

@Rosehip

Personal views are informing government policy right now.

Rosehip10 What right have others to tell me how to act?

Please explain what greater benefit is derived from a whole population based lock down strategy rather than a targeted approach for the vulnerable?

And actually many clinicians are questioning the benefits of intubating the very frail and elderly

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/03/29/intensive-care-coronavirus-patients-now-limited-reasonably-certain/

And that is based on outcome, quality of life and expected morbidity in the near future of other causes

My 86 year old mother had heart failure, dementia and diabetes. I would want her to be made comfortable and pain free