Surely schools have to be first to open?

[Riddlediddle]

I know lockdown is for at least another 3 weeks (and likely longer!) however when we do start to come out of lockdown surely schools have to be the first thing to reopen? Parents of children of primary school age (me included) will not be able to return to their jobs unless the schools are open or childcare options are available? I just don't see how this will all work as surely schools will not be at full staffing levels due to some having to self isolate/be in higher risk categories. I just wish the government would give us some indication of what the exit plan is.

Scotland deaths 40
NI 10

That’s not quite right. Confinement is to continue as it is now until 11 May. Then after that, schools may begin to reopen - but it will be progressive, part-time and not for all pupils.

And there will be a test for ANYONE showing Symons.

Symptoms!

Schools going back first makes overwhelming logical sense

It would seem that the ‘science disagrees’

www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/health-52183295

France are having a phased reopening of schools if the data on covid infections falls as they expect it to. It will be interesting to see both how that works out and how the uk data compares to France in a few weeks.
At the moment nobody knows anything really. If they do open in May and we track a few weeks behind them then I'd expect us to open in June. Which would be fantastic. I'm not convinced we'll open schools before September though. It's got to depend a lot on ramping up testing and how well this app works. Either that or they crack the antibodies tests.

We really do need to see a positive change in the UK’s ability to test. The delays there are frustrating and will end up holding up any attempt to release the lockdown.

@refraction where are you getting your figures from? Do you mean the last daily death count I assume?

Yep sorry wrong thread.

The logic is surely that most children live in families where most people are under 50. And if you are, then you are unlikely to get it especially badly. And unless you’re going to wait indoors until there is a hypothetical vaccine (could be September, probably not though), at some point, people need to get back out there. I don’t really understand how schools can have half the teachers off shielding. It’s not that big a group and teachers certainly shouldn’t be over-represented in it, statistically.

And staggering the ages of children attending will be tricky too. Many teachers have children so do those children stay home because they aren't part of the year that should be coming in? For example, my DS, is a year 8 child. Does he come into school with the year 9 and 10 (if that's what is going to happen) because I work in a school as a support worker? Or does he stay home alone. Because the latter won't be happening - so that'll be a worker down in the school.

And on the subject of social distancing, kids not washing hands etc., we had kids daring each other to lick our school library books in the final two weeks before lockdown...we only found out when a member of staff caught them and they admitted it'd been going on for a fortnight (and that was just one group). These were year 10s. You'd think they'd know better.

I think “shielding” and “vulnerable” are often interchanged when they are two distinct groups. I can understand schools potentially having 50% of their staff in a more vulnerable group but I agree it seems unlikely 50% would be in the shielding group.

I think there was some confusion about who would fall into which group prior to the schools shutting down. The government released a list of those they considered vulnerable before they released details of those who were extremely vulnerable and should be shielding. I think everyone would be more clear about their level of vulnerability moving out of the lockdown.

I don’t really understand how schools can have half the teachers off shielding. It’s not that big a group and teachers certainly shouldn’t be over-represented in it, statistically.

Teaching is not a very physical job, and although it’s hard work, the rhythm of the year with holidays mean people with chronic illnesses at least get a chance to rest throughout the year, so it’s a very suitable job for people with long term but manageable conditions such as asthma, rheumatic arthritis or who are recovering from cancer etc.

I think libraries need to be the first to go back, because of digital exclusion. Schools next, then a relaxation of distancing, but not until mid May.

What about dentists and chiropodists?

My daughters brace has broken and my toes nail is so painful.

My guess would be chiropodists when social distancing can be relaxed for important (but not essential) personal care

Dentists only when PPE can be properly supplied, until then it will be assess then advise or refer (to hub with PPE) for the foreseeable. But as more hub practices are arranged and equipped, then the wait for treatment should shorten. A bit. Perhaps.

France are going to look at it in May and IF scientists agree there will be a progressive return to school. Remember though the testing rate in France is much better than ours and schools closed before ours.

I hope we don't hurry back to school as the risks are too great. Let's not use our children as a political score.

Also wrt teachers shielding, schools are run with the expectation that almost all staff are in every day, in other sectors a certain amount of people will be on holiday at any one time, but in schools everyone's in every day. This means if only a small proportion of staff are shielding it has a big impact. Particularly on small schools.

Staggering shouldn't be an issue because teachers are key workers and so their children are entitled to a school place if they need it to work.

There would obviously be some logistical challenges to overcome but I don’t think they are insurmountable. Children could come in every other day for example so only half the staff were utilised providing some cover.

It would be a slow process to bring things back to “normal” but I can’t see there will be a perfect, completely rush free for every individual who ever comes into contact with a school moment to do it unless we wait years.

The peak needs to have passed obviously and we need to be operating some sort of containment but then we will need to start taking some tentative steps.

You don’t use half the staff if half the children are in. Kitchen, admin and support staff would need to be in at almost the same rate as well as senior staff, and unless all staff were in you couldn’t maintain any sort of social distancing.

Ok, one third or a quarter are available for cover. I think there are some who are 100% determined that schools etc won’t go back for years.

@Pieceofpurplesky according to worldometer France aren’t much better than testing than us have a look

Or 50% of teaching staff, either way it creates a bit of capacity.

@wonderstuff Unless their children are under school age and their nursery is closed - settling a baby or young toddler into a new nursery, if you find a suitable one that’s open, is a lengthy process.

Or, as in our case, grandparents over the age of 70 normally provide childcare because we can’t afford the mortgage and a nursery bill.

I really wouldn’t like to be the government right now, trying to organise this.