Our human rights have been taken away

[Soph7777]

I know it's for a good cause.

I know it's to save lives.

But our basic human rights have been taken from under us, in the short space of a week.

I find this part most of all the scariest.

I'm really struggling mentally with government control to this extent.

How long can this last before people lose their minds and rebel?

I would like to protect my right to live, and that of others. If this means a few weeks/months of staying at home as much as possible, it will be fine.

Amy. Do you know how many icu beds we have in Ireland?

Jst to point out the obvious... Amy doesnt speak for all of us Irish. I, for one, am proud to play my part. Even though that means losing my much loved job. Even though that means not seeing my much loved 70 yr old mother. And i assure you, my mental health is suffering.

But I am proud to play my part. I hope not to have to take up one of those beds. I know how scarce they are - 500, up from less than 250 jst wks ago. I know that others will need those beds. And i know that some of them wont get to use them and will die instead.

You should be ashamed of yourselves - spouting your self serving fake dis informative nonsense.

My hope is when this is all over, we ll be able to address the reasons why we now have to stay indoors. We have a health service that is not fit for purpose and that buckles most years because of the flu. Thats not right. Politicians and the populance is responsible. But that argument is for peacetime. If you understood exponential growth, you d understand the real need for the policies we are seeing, given the number of icu beds we have.

@beardybutton I agree, I don't speak for anyone but myself.

And I don't really agree with the terms, "Irish, English, Scottish, French" etc

It doesn't matter where we are born. I don't think that any one country owns us.

I just happen to live in Ireland at the moment. I haven't in the past and I won't in the future. We all move around.

please share exactly what human right has been removed?

The right to freedom.
The right to work.
The right to gather for community activities.
Freedom from interference with privacy.
The right to free movement.
Right to participate in the cultural life of the community.
The right to gather for peaceful protests.

• Universal Declaration of Human Rights

Just came on to post that exact quote @LimitIsUp - a very succinct summary of the potential problem of the situation we are in.

@LittleDragonGirl yes these are some good points and questions, I’m not advocating that we simply return to normal and let the virus run rampant. I think an approach that protects our vulnerable and elderly while building up the NHS resource as much as possible would be the ideal scenario in terms of maintaining our freedoms. I’m not sure which is the preferable option myself at this time. Time will tell I’m sure and I’m hopeful that testing will be the thing that changes things here (and maybe proves the Oxford study right which would be a relief for many although maybe not for Boris!)

Thank you @hatrack!

Yes!

They have not been removed. They have been temporarily curtailed or suspended.

If they are not reinstated in a timely fashion, that's the time to holler about that.

But right now, quite a few people would prefer not to snuff it or suffer agonies in an already overloaded NHS system (or have to nurse them in an already overloaded NHS system), and that's the focus. Rather than making sure we can buy our tat, and have a pint at the pub.

@mbosnz why do they have the right to temporarily curtail or suspend them indefinitely?

They don't under the Universal declaration of human rights

We are being asked to stay at home so that the vast majority get to live, so you can carry on living.

Amy.... You may not agree with nationalism. But disagreeing with terms? This makes zero sense. As it happens my politics is of the cosmopolitan bent. But whether or not I am a nationalist or a cosmopolitan has absolutely zero relevance here. The fact is, the country you currently reside in has one of the worst standings in terms of icu capacity per head of population. That fact, plus exponential growth of a currently untreatable disease necessitates action. Either its employ the army and police to cart away the dead, or it is employ them to deal with delinquent population who refuse to adhere to isolation.

Agreed, I am also definitely not advocating that we should let the virus run rampant, and I am pretty sure that Lord Sumption isn't either

But the government and police need constant scrutiny and as citizens we should be vigilant. But saying that out loud seems to provoke all sorts of censure and anger

@mbosnz it is not about people buying tat or going to the pub, it is about people losing jobs and freedom

@eeyore228 but what they are doing is against the universal declaration of human rights.

So why should it be allowed

OMG people are really getting themselves in a 2 and 8 with all this, I understand and empathise with both arguments, I too have a real problem with being controlled, when you have been through some of the hell in my life at my age you don't want control again. But having said that I also understand the need to keep people safe, at times i think we are going a bit too far in some instances. for example there are many people like me, disabled, elderly and alone. I get no visitors as most of my family do not drive and those that do I have no desire to see. The point here is I am alone totally but i have the ability to get to family members who like me are following the advice, we are all at high risk and we thankfully are all unaffected, but I am not allowed to go and see them even though I would not come into contact with anyone else in doing so, this is where not allowing me to do that is a bit to "big brother is watching you" I and they would be causing no one harm nor could we pass on a virus we don't have. so instead I sit in my home going stir crazy with no physical contact with anyone, yes i can chat on phone or via skype but it is not quite the same a being in the same room, sharing a dinner and getting a hug or peck hello or goodbye. but for the good of everyone i do it, people will always complain at anything they are commanded to do, but then they would also complain if they disobeyed the rules and got the virus, so as long as you stay in and complain at least you are safe, the whole point is stay safe, stay well, stay alive.

@LimitIsUp it provokes censor and anger because people are afraid to stand up themselves.

They have done what the government has told them to do for so long, that they see it as a "crazy" notion to remember that they can in fact speak up for themselves.

The Government are just humans like you and I

They have not been removed. They have been temporarily curtailed or suspended.

True and it's very likely that this is all that there is to it.

Doesn't mean that people can't worry that maybe it won't be so temporary for some measures, or abuses of power,or that it could be a slippery slope, or question it . Especially since they are following the rules anyways.

A lot of people don't seem to understand that questioning something doesn't equate to refusing to follow the rules or accepting and and understanding why it's happening.

People must be imagining OP arranging rave parties in her basement or something.

Yes, I agree Amymayapple

"please share exactly what human right has been removed?

The right to freedom.
The right to work.
The right to gather for community activities.
Freedom from interference with privacy.
The right to free movement.
Right to participate in the cultural life of the community.
The right to gather for peaceful protests."

• all of 'em.

Sovereignty of Parliament, for one thing.

They haven't declared a state of National Emergency, have they? But they could, and then do so under that.

People can lose lives, or they can lose jobs. Or loved ones. They can lose freedoms, or they can lose lives. Or loved ones.

The Government (and I'm no bloody fan) have done quite a bit to try and help businesses minimise job losses. But that's why the Government will be wanting to return to life as normal as fast as possible as we want to also, because they want to minimise the impact on the economy. This is an extremely career limiting time to be a Minister of Parliament, as people hurt during this time of crisis, and wish to return the pain at the next election.

Sorry misunderstood hatrack's post. Ignore me.

Great post @oldqueen1969 but especially...

To the OP - thank you for giving me an opportunity to communicate, to explore my fears, and gauge the opinions of others. I hope, in time, things become clearer for us all, and that there will be some hopeful outcomes - I wish you well.

it is employ them to deal with delinquent population

Jesus, do you hear yourself? And I say this as someone who thinks this period of quarantine needs to happen.

compliance does not have to mean the cessation of critical thinking, of debate, of wondering WTAF is going on, and how, in such a short space of time, millions of people around the world are suddenly being told they are the problem just as much as the virus is, and that the authorities should be blindly followed regardless of sometimes conflicting science, and should not be held accountable now in any way, and possibly never , at all.

Exactly! Thank you @OldQueen1969

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.spectator.co.uk/article/The-evidence-on-Covid-19-is-not-as-clear-as-we-think/amp

My friend has sent me this from the Spectator which ties into some of Lord Sumption's comments

Written by a recently retired professor of pathology - so he has the scientific credentials