Palestine Action demo 9 August

[Beachtastic]

To my amazement, last night I discovered that some posters on MN think that "radical Islam" means simply "Muslim" 😬

I wonder if this explains why so many are unconcerned about who might be pulling the strings behind the "peace" rallies that were first organised on 7 October? Do they know what radical Islam is, how powerful it is, that it is widely acknowledged as the greatest threat to UK national security, that its intentions are clearly stated, that it is 10000000% different than simply observing Muslim faith?

Palestine Action are planning a rally in central London on Saturday and hope to overwhelm the police presence. Is anyone concerned about this? I'm worried that the seeds of civil unrest are being sown, without it being entirely clear who is sowing them.

www.standard.co.uk/news/london/met-police-palestine-action-protest-b1241347.html

Sorry in advance, not read the responses, I just read your first post. Europe has always been Christian. Islam is not originally from here. I am no historian, but Christianity was preached in the Middle East long before Islam. The Christian bible refers to foreigners who will overtake your land, you will work for them and your land will not be your own. Deuteronomy. You don’t need to be radical, Islam is a well documented threat on Christianity.

According to my beliefs (others will most surely differ!) Jewish people will (unfortunately) undergo more persecution (but so will Christians). There will be 144,000 Jewish witnesses all around the world who will preach the gospel. The Jewish people will rebuild the temple and will recommence the sacrificial system but the person known as the Antichrist will defile the temple with some kind of profane image halfway through the Tribulation. At this point, a terrible earthquake will occur and kill 7,000 people in and around Jerusalem, others will flee to safety in 'the wilderness' where they will be safe and protected by God. They will then understand Jesus is in fact their Messiah and will be saved. All this is in addition to the cataclysmic events that take place worldwide.

The Muslim foreigners are taking over the Christian European land and making the Christians work for them? Is that what you are saying?

Yes, those passages refered to the exile of nation of Israel when they were disobedient to God and went into exile of captors (e.g. Babylon). This is pre-Christ and pre-Islam. However there were many other episodes and the Jewish people have dispersed all over the world, only they will return in the end times, the fact that they are still a distinct nation is quite a miracle in itself.

Is this why many Christians (is it only evangelical Christians?) support the state of Israel? Because it all ties in with the beliefs about the second coming of Jesus?

I don't want to be disrespectful towards anyone's beliefs but if that is the case then it does seem a little bit selfish for want of a better word. Unless i suppose the ultimate belief is that it will still be a happy ending for both the Christians and Jews who will accept Jesus as their saviour.

From my own understanding, the Jewish people did not see Jesus as a more special individual other than themselves. He was noted but was not a prophet or a leader as the Christian people thought.

Presbyterianism and Catholicism then differs a lot. Catholics do not tend to acknowledge the second testament but Presbyterian followers do. I always thought Jesus was New Testament?

I was brought up to believe Jesus was a Jew and that is why Christian countries will standby each other.

Not sure whether it's only evangelicals, but really all Christians should support the state of Israel because we believe that God gave Israel that land, it's all related in the Old Testament. Jerusalem is going to be God's holy city in the eternal kingdom.

Well it can be a 'happy ending' for anyone! All you need is to accept Jesus as your saviour and you too will be part of God's eternal kingdom. Not everyone will do so, but it's freely offered to you.

I do appreciate you answering these questions, last one before I get told off for going off topic.

What happens to those Jewish Israelis who don't want to accept Jesus as their saviour? Or oppose him as a prophet? Do they have a choice in the matter? It seems unfair that after everything they fought for to have their own land to practice their religion, they have to become Christian in the end.

Or should I say, oppose him as their saviour.

The same thing that happens to all who reject the Messiah (nothing good). Yes of course they have a choice, we all do. Well, you see it as 'becoming Christian' but really they would be accepting the Jewish messiah that was sent to them 2,000 years ago. They're just a bit late doing so! They aren't throwing away their religion by following Jesus, I see it as completing it.

But yeah, we are going off topic! I have to go too! :) Nice chatting!

I just did a quick Google on it and 'nothing good' is quite the understatement.

Thank you for answering. Again, I don't want to be disrespectful to your beliefs but the reason for supporting Israel still does seem selfish. Jewish people in this scenario only have one option, accept Christ or face eternal damnation.

Support for Palestinians, on the other hand (even by those who are described incorrectly as 'useful idiots' by some on here) is still a selfless support. They aren't doing it for any personal gain. They are simply supporting and should i say standing up for Palestinians, because of the persecution and suffering they are being subjected to.

It was very interesting, good night 😴

Couldn't sleep and came back, had to answer this: Jewish people in this scenario only have one option, accept Christ or face eternal damnation.

We ALL face eternal damnation without Christ. Everyone. We must all make that choice. As for supporting Israel, I should make it clear that, as a Zionist, I support the Jewish people having their own nation and lands. However it doesn't mean their government is always right and doesn't do the wrong things. That's important to state.

No Europe has not always been christian! Europe was pagan like everywhere else for a long time. Christianity originated in the Middle East and reached the Med side of Europe quickly (1st century) but it took till at least the 3rd century to start to get established, alongside other religions, more widely. Yes, Islam is later, early 7th century, and by the 8th century had reached Spain which remained muslim controlled till the 15th century.

I was also brought up to believe Jesus was a Jew.

Which is strange on reflection because I was also brought up an atheist.

But if Jesus did exist, he would be a Jew (in my religious education, such as it was). But now I think if he existed at all he was just a normal person (maybe a preacher?) and we don't know his ethnicity.

I think you're getting mixed up here. Not everyone who supports Israel is Jewish or Christian (and not all Jews or Christians support what the Israel government are doing, not by any means).

In the same way, not all supporters for Palestine are Muslim, just because most Palestinians are Muslim. But for those who are, the religion of Islam also have their own version which is accept God (or Allah) or face Hell.

The majority of Palestinians are Muslim. But you wouldn't say Muslims around the world are "quite selfish" for supporting Palestine would you?

Good for you. Looks like the weather is going to be fab x

No, i am not getting mixed up as I wasn't talking about all Christians. I was talking about those people who support Israel and hold the beliefs that were explained above. That's my opinion which i am entitled to and I did put it forward respectfully.

Out of interest, do you watch Revelation TV? You don't have to answer, but I find it a fantastic source with their Middle East report.

I see what you mean. I still think Jewish people have the short stick in this situation - but that does explain it better.

You did put it forward respectfully but I disagree that support for Palestinians is necessarily selfless - some people will also be driven by religious considerations or cultural considerations which ultimately determines which "side" they support.

Yes, some people may do. But i found it strange that the people in the article discussed above were referred to as 'useful idiots' and 'white saviours' even though they didn't seem to be protesting for any personal gain. Quite ironically a short while later I was very seriously told how Jesus the 'saviour' was going to take over Israel at the end of times and convert all Jews.

Aside from not knowing what a useful idiot is, you are are only concentrating on Jewish and Christian religious philosophy. Maybe if you did more than a quick research on the philosophy of Islam, you will see that taken to its extreme, its "selfishness" declares anyone, who doesn't follow their beliefs, as being infidels - that includes you and me. Do you know what happens next? If you find out, you will find the meaning of a useful idiot, in the context of this war.

Which nobody really objected to either.

I don't think that's strange at all. Jesus was a historical figure who definitely existed and was definitely a Jew. I too am an atheist, but this is historic fact. What's debateable is whether he was the son of God!