Can someone explain Islamophobia to me?

[BaMamma]

I don't think I have an irrational fear of Muslims, but I think I have a reasonable concern about radical Islam, does that make me Islamophobic?

Apologies I was under the genuine misapprehension that face covering was cultural rather than religious. Happy to stand corrected.

Islam is very diverse and there are multiple schools within it. People can have very different ways of practising their faith and still all be Muslim.

Of course.
But I think people who cover their faces should understand that it is unlikely they will be part of the local community in the same way that hijab wearers are .
Most of our communication with people we don’t know is via body language and facial expression- smiles / smirks/ eye rolls etc . It’s nice when you can smile and share a joke with a hijab wearing waitress/ doctor/ shop assistant.
I can’t see myself wanting to connect with someone if I can’t see their face . That has nothing to do with religious prejudice.

I'm just explaining that it's not a purely cultural thing for some women to want to cover their faces. It's an example of how diverse 'being Muslim' can be - some Muslim women don't cover their faces or their hair, some cover their hair, some cover their faces either partially or fully - and different schools can have very different viewpoints (and some people who are Muslim won't necessarily follow a school of thought at all).

However, time and again, discussions about prejudice, discrimination and hate speech/acts against Muslims return to a disproportionate focus on face coverings, in which the stereotypes of Muslims as threats to wider society, as 'backwards'/'medieval', and as oppressed or powerless victims in need of saving all get expressed...

It also shows a complete lack of trust in men being able to control themselves! But the whole idea of women being forced to cover up is just abhorrent and I hate to see it.

Yes I understand that some people might use the debate about face covering as a cover for their Islamophobia. But that should not mean we’re not allowed to discuss what we feel are the negative elements of religious practice.
As with Islam, there is a diversity of views amongst Christians. Some Christian groups feel strongly about abortion. For people to object to those specific views is not “anti Christian” .
( Though It would be anti Christian if they did not treat Christians with the respect they treat others and if they mocked Christians for their beliefs.)

I don’t see why it would bother anyone if someone chooses to cover their hair?
Up until recently all women covered their heads when they were outside. (From shawls, bonnets, scarfs to grand hats)
Hijabs are perfectly compatible with everyday life in modern society and don’t impact on communication in the workplace .

yes I don’t grasp at all about having a problem covering hair. Do you have an issue with nuns wearing their head coverings? What about a bride?

My Grandmother never went out with out a headscarf tied under her chin. Many women of that generation did. It’s fine to say I personally don’t want to wear a headscarf but when you start dictating to other women what they should wear under a faux concern over their oppression then you have a problem.

if you are worried about women being oppressed do something positive about it.

I think it’s up to women themselves to decide.
There are lots of examples of empowered women wearing hijabs so I don’t think it’s the wearing of hijabs that we should be concerned about .
I don’t agree with face covering ( but not for the reasons you have given )

Yeah I'm less concerned about hair coverings than then slaughter of Christians in Sudan, Nigeria and as is happening right now in Syria by 'moderates' who follow the religion of peace.

Yes. I’ve posted on the Syria thread about this.

these aren’t moderates, it’s Islamist terrorists. Call them what they are.Using the phrase moderate, particularly with quotation marks, is deliberately blurring the lines between terrorists, (who I believe actually desecrate Islam through their actions), and all other Muslims.
yours message reads with subtext of Islam is inherently extreme and its followers violent, and even those who you say aren’t extreme I.e. ‘moderate’ are still committing murders. This is Islamophobia and I hope it isn’t reported so people can see an actual example of what Islamophobia looks like.

the slaughter of Christians in Sudan is appalling and needs wider attention, but how it’s done matters too.

I used moderates because that is what people were calling them when they came in to power a few months ago.

That is what they are claiming. It also Alawites were also targeted in these revenge attacks in Syria. Why are you only concerned with Christians? It seems like both minorities in this region were targeted.

No one is “ only concerned about Christians” but it is noteworthy how little attention is given to the persecution of Christians in Nigeria/ Sudan/ Syria/ Pakistan etc

I think @InWalksBarberalla is focused on the Christians.

I do not think you are and I don’t think anything you have said is Islamophobic or racist in anyway. However there are other people on the thread who “concern” for christians is rooted in racism.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cx20p0pj931o

The BBC doesn’t seem to have much to say about Christian communities

This, and also the recent massacre in Congo.

I accept that This is the wrong thread to discuss what is happening to Christians in Syria and elsewhere and it could be seen as Islamophobic in this context so I will post on the Syria thread

I think you can dislike the central tenets of any religion without being afraid of them ( phobic)

But not the individual who follows them. You can definitely have your own standards about what you will and put up with in your own life.

I personally dislike Judaism, Christianity and Islam. That doesn't stop me from having friends and family that choose to follow any of those religions.

ok that makes more sense in context, and changes the meaning. Was a bit het up this morning, sorry!

There's been a lot of discussion about women's face and/or hair/body coverings. It's a bit of a distraction really.

Is it Islamophobic to question whether Islamic values are compatible with Western values? I'd say that in the west we strive for tolerance, how far does that extend?

I'm not only concerned with the slaughter of Christians. I'm incredibly concerned about the slaughter of all minority groups. It's horrendous.