Terrible but not surprised - Jewish community under threat

[mids2019]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx0331xxd7xo

It appears Jews are not safe in the UK at all.

Can we seriously look at the impact of anti semitism now?

Why so you speak like I have an agenda, and I'm not just a normal person with opinions?

Normal people don’t have those opinions.

I'm starting to think we'll never get an answer to why they were knowingly spreading misinformation. So I guess it's safe to assume it was, as previously mentioned, in order to minimise antisemitism but also to put the blame squarely at the feet of Jewish people or those who do their best to support Jewish people, like Keir Starmer.

Most people when seeing that they are facing mortal danger don’t bother with the fact they don’t have anywhere to go. They just go anywhere but where the danger is.

I think those that stayed were probably too busy celebrating and obviously didn’t think that there would be consequences

My question was how many saw that there would be consequences and left

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13440533/Michael-Gove-warn-surge-anti-Semitism-Britain-canary-coal-countries-descending-darkness-dangerous-Jews.html

Your post is just offensive. Considering how many Palestinians in Gaza have lost their lives and you are suggesting they are at fault because they didn't flee!

They just go anywhere but where the danger is.
Yeah try doing that on a 41km strip of land with border closed, not as simple as you appear to make out

Are you serious? Obviously I didn't agree with that either. Did that really need to be said? I replied to someone saying the Palestinians should have left.

Assume what you like... because you will anyway

Assume what you like... because you will anyway

Do you have any idea how offensive that is? Victim Blaming at its best

Well said @Yalta

While there were people celebrating, there were also lots that weren't and who knew exactly what was coming as a direct result of Hamas' actions. They wouldn't have been able to leave though as people can't just leave Gaza as and when because of the strict border controls. It can take a very long time to get permission to leave. It's a whole process, you can't just get in the car and drive to Israel or Egypt. Unless you're Hamas, of course, in which case you just use a tunnel to get out. Innocent civilians don't have that luxury.

(I have family who didn't manage to flee Europe, so only one member of my family survived the Holocaust after years in a ghetto and then concentration camps, and other family who did manage to flee Iraq. But they only managed that because of help from Kurdish and Iranians who helped smuggle them out. That level of help hasn't been available to people in Gaza)

The victim blaming is absolutely appalling. If you are pro Israel just come out and say that you think what is happening is justified, but please stop making the starvation, homelessness and genocide out to be the fault of the people. Please just have the balls to take off the blinkers and acknowledge the carnage the Israeli government are purposely creating. But Hamas, human shields, stupid people not moving somewhere safe...it has got so tiring.

Loads of people are pro-Israel and simultaneously appalled at the situation in Gaza, yet understand the need to go after Hamas. The point is that the situation is complex (and has been for a very long time, long before the current crisis). I don't have the answers and neither does anyone here.

Those who shout loudly and can only see things through a lens of good/ bad really do not help. In my view they deepen the rifts with their insistence on understanding things with so little nuance.

I agree the situation is complex but certain elements of it are not. It isn't because the situation is complex that access to humanitarian aid is blocked it is wrong and unnecessary and has no bearing on the conflict, it is done with the sole purpose of causing pain. The recent revelation that the IDF were informing protesters of aid truck logistics demonstrates that.

Those who shout loudly and can only see things through a lens of good/ bad really do not help.
I don't think it's through a lens of good/ bad it's more through a lens of wrong/ right.

What is interesting about these stats is that they understate the impact of antisemitic crime.

6.5% of the population identify as muslim (approx 4.4m) and 3400 experienced an attack 2022-23; compared to 1510 individuals from only 338, 500/0.5% of the population identifying as Jewish…

this means that a muslim person has 0.007% chance of being the victim of racially based hate crime, whereas a Jewish person has 0.04% ….

In simple terms a Jewish person is nearly 6x more likely to be a victim of hate crime.

This thread has gone to rubbish. It’s been derailed by some (in my opinion) weird ideas about Keir Starmer, followed by comments which are insulting to Jewish people and comments which show a lack of empathy for people in Gaza. It’s as if people showed up on here to wind everyone up.

💯 agree

Absolutely. It is completely unfair to judge all Palestinians by the actions of a few. Those who celebrated after October 7th would no doubt have been the aggressive Hamas supporters. I imagine there were many Palestinian citizens sheltering in their houses , horrified by events and terrified of what they must have known would happen next. They probably wouldn’t have had any chance of escape (unless they were well connected with Hamas. )

I agree!

“I don't think it's through a lens of good/ bad it's more through a lens of wrong/ right.”
I don’t think either lens is helpful because there are wrongs and rights / good and bad on BOTH sides.

I agree it's perfectly possible to simultaneously be both, I'm sure many are. It's the ones who clearly aren't appalled I'm referring to.
@PeasfullPerson I've only just seen the thread title now, I started reading only a few pages ago and whilst threads do naturally drift onto other areas, I agree it should not have been derailed in this way.

On a thread about a planned, deadly antisemitic attack in the UK, any discussion of Israel brings with it a suggestion that UK Jews only have themselves to blame. The derailing on this thread has been awful and says a lot about some posters' intentions. It doesn't matter how supportive any one individual might be of Israel's actions - this shouldn't even be part of a discussion on this thread. This thread should have been a space to express concerns about the dangers facing the Jewish community in the UK but it seems we're not even allowed that.

I don’t think either lens is helpful because there are wrongs and rights / good and bad on BOTH sides.

I meant more in relation to a right and wrong approach for Israel to defend themselves. As opposed to whose good or bad. I assumed we all agreed what Hamas did was wrong.