University students rising up against ties with Israel (title edited by MNHQ at request of OP)

[EasterIssland]

Many university students are raising up against the ties their universities have with Israel. Students are asking for this agreements to stop
I can see this is happening in USA which has been in the news quite a lot but I can also read news about Paris as well as UK.

I really doubt much will change but I’m glad people are against these agreements. We can’t change what Israel / Hamas do. But we should be able to change what our governments / universities do.

More reasons to support these protests being shut down. Denver will shut them down soon enough.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13383359/University-Michigan-graduation-ceremony-protestors-video.html

Come on Sunak- sort it out - we cannot have this kind of anti-Semitism towards British Jews on campus. We are a democracy who welcomes and purports to protect everybody - let's extend this to all faiths.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13383543/Rishi-Sunak-vows-tackle-alarming-uptick-anti-Semitism-demonstrations-sweep-British-campuses.html

From your article No arrests have yet been reported and the protest - comprising of about 50 people, many wearing traditional Arabic keffiyeh along with their graduation caps - did not cause serious problems at the nearly two-hour event.

There is no comment about whether or not the 'mob' of Pro Israel or perhaps 'anti Palestinian' protesters at the same event caused serious problems, so who knows.

It's funny how that article refers to Pro-Palestinian protesters as an 'anti Israel mob' but the Pro Israel protesters are 'Graduates sporting Israeli flags and pins'. A very balanced article indeed.

Dont believe anything you read in the Daily Fail.

“The elite freakout over campus Gaza solidarity protests isn't just about their slavish devotion to Israel. It's also about the fear of young people putting themselves on the line for a moral cause. In prioritizing humanity over wealth and status, these brave students represent everything our political and media class does not.”

Aaron Mate, The Greyzone

It says a lot to your sense of your moral superiority that you thought you offered an olive branch to someone you unapologetically accused of supporting a genocide. "Where is the humanity? Where is the care for your fellow human beings?" You said.

You could have tried googling purity spiral before dismissing it as nonsense?

"A purity spiral is a sociological theory which argues for the existence of a form of groupthink in which it becomes more beneficial to hold certain views than to not hold them, and more extreme views are rewarded while expressing doubt, nuance, or moderation is punished (a process sometimes called "moral outbidding").[1] It is argued that this feedback loop leads to members competing to demonstrate the zealotry or purity of their views"

You said "I don’t remember seeing posts in which you clearly spoke against what the Israeli government and IDF have done in Gaza." And "Perhaps you have seen me be louder about Gaza"

I haven't sufficiently 'loudly' or 'clearly' demonstrated the zealotry of my views for you and therefore am 'punished' by moral judgement comments like 'Where is the humanity? Where is the care for your fellow human beings?'

The 'correct' response to your moral judgement would be for me to performatively and dutifully join in with the chants of genocide. But I'm not going to, because I don't do cults.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purity_spiral

We could flip this around:
An extreme view could be that the IDF is not committing war crimes, and a more moderate and nuanced view be that in its pursuit of eliminating Hamas, it has at best been reckless with tens of thousands innocent lives.

An extreme view could be to suggest limiting food supply and cutting off water to a population was an acceptable response knowing impact on young children.

The moral outbidding could be seen as the policing of thought by the right wing press eg Daily Wail, the banning of speakers at conferences (Dr Ghassan) and brutal policing at universities. It could be seem as clamping down of any criticism of the actions of the IDF as antisemitic.

How can concerns about potential genocide be a cult view when the majority of countries called for a ceasefire and only US vetoed. Surely those in the cult are those who are prepared to turn a blind eye to obvious concerns about potential genocide. Even Germany has banned sale of military weapons to Israel.

How can concerns about potential genocide be a cult view

You have entirely misunderstood my post. I have expressed disgust and condemnation for what is going on in Gaza quite regularly, but not 'loudly' or 'clearly' enough for me to avoid the moral judgement of the purity spiral police.

This, by the way, is not a one-off incident and it has not just been the PP doing this.

You are taking my comments which were not aimed directly at you very personally.

Ah I see, when you referenced the idea of a purity spiral, you were telling me off for loudly saying how much I detest the death and destruction in Gaza, and implying it’s because I am suffering from group think.

I must be suffering from group think, I must be wrong, and I must be extreme.

I will not waste anymore time defending such a ridiculous idea.

You have zero evidence for this beyond your own imaginings and arm chair sociology.

You are perhaps genuinely offended or using it as a way to shut down these awful terrible people who keep talking about what’s happening in Gaza.

It is you who is coming across as believing they are superior and biased.

Once again I wonder where the care
for our fellow human beings in Gaza is?

And I don’t see it among many (note that word again) of the people moaning about these protests.

@noblegiraffe

Do you agree with this observation?

MANY people here who have expressed

1 - upset about the protests

Have not also expressed

2 - upset about the death and destruction in Gaza

You are taking my comments which were not aimed directly at you very personally.

In the post in which you tagged me...and when you then specifically mentioned that I don't talk loudly or clearly enough in condemnation of Israel?

Ah I see, when you referenced the idea of a purity spiral, you were telling me off for loudly saying how much I detest the death and destruction in Gaza, and implying it’s because I am suffering from group think.

No, it is your moral superiority and policing of others for not doing the same as you.

You are perhaps genuinely offended or using it as a way to shut down these awful terrible people who keep talking about what’s happening in Gaza.

I was talking, legitimately, about antisemitism on these pro-Palestinian protests when you waded in with your 'where's the care for other humans'? As always happens on any discussion about antisemitism.

Perhaps you are using it as a way to shut down these terrible people who want to discuss antisemitism?

I literally don't care whether they've expressed upset about the death and destruction in Gaza as a precondition for expressing any view about these protests. If they make legitimate points then those points are legitimate regardless. If their points are bigoted nonsense, then they're still bigoted nonsense even if they've said previously acceptable things.

Besides, people name change all the time on this topic so how would I know?

@noblegiraffe

I believe my observation to be correct.

May I ask what your thoughts were on people being asked qualify their comments, by condemning Hamas and the 7th October over and over again, for months after it happened?

I believe my observation to be correct.

And by this you are trying to create an 'in group' and an 'out group' of acceptable people instead of taking their posts on their own merit.

@noblegiraffe

May I ask what your thoughts were on people being asked qualify their comments, by condemning Hamas and the 7th October over and over again, for months after it happened?

This I agree with. However you immediately followed this up with another post simply linking to the The Grayzone and arch conspiracy theorist-rape apologist Aaron Maté. Absolutely brilliant, 10/10.

The Greyzone

😂people actually read and reproduce that stuff 😹💩

He has lots of 'followers', sadly reproducing his garbage.

Students probably like the rest of the population have differing opinions - it is unlikely that all students think the same. I don't believe that the university should be taking sides in this conflict other than wanting it to end and be on the side of peace.

If you go this far in your views- surely then there is little distance between what you think and what the students think?

Would I be right in thinking what upsets you is the students are protesting?

Then the argument becomes what extent of protest is acceptable by students. From my understanding the majority had/ has been peaceful.

For example would peaceful encampment be an issue? @noblegiraffe

@Finallyloggedin are you curious about what my takeaway is from you posting dog whistle quotes from The Grayzone?

Also, massive lol at the suggestion that students from Ivy League and other elitist institutions are prioritising humanity over the wealth and status they already have(and hoard). These "brave students" are the future political and media elite.

https://x.com/daughterofsahel/status/1786826939723874711?s=61&t=nilGqPeurpC5xVqZAZdZog

Absolutely superb speech by this student. A bit sweaty so obviously avoid if that offends you. Three videos.

Interesting opinion as to why in fact, the protests should NOT be shut down:

https://www.thejc.com/life-and-culture/why-we-shouldnt-shut-down-student-protests-for-palestine-yptt38d3