Terrorist leader speaks out

[Peggysoonerthanlater]

Now you have it for the horse's mouth -

Yahya Sinwar: Hamas leader in Gaza didn't expect consequences of 7 October attack to be 'this dangerous', says friend

Updated Wed, 14 February 2024 at 10:02 pm GMT

The top Hamas leader in Gaza, Yahya Sinwar, was one of the main planners of the 7 October attack on Israel but did not expect the consequences to become "this dangerous", a friend has told Sky News.
Esmat Mansour (who has been in prison with Sinwar) said last year's cross-border raid was supposed to be a strategic operation designed to lift the Israeli siege on the territory, release Sinwar's friends from prison, and make him a "leader of the Palestinian people".
But the calculations "didn't go as planned", the reaction of the Israelis was "uncontrolled, without any justification", and "now we have this result", he explained.
"He [Sinwar] didn't expect the operation to make things this complicated and to go as far as it did and become this dangerous. And [it] gave Israel all the reasons and excuses to break all the rules."
Speaking from Ramallah in the West Bank, Mansour said: "I think he was one of the main people behind this operation."
He claimed that if Sinwar knew what the consequences of the assault would be, he "would never have planned an operation this way".
Mansour, who has been in prison with Sinwar, said the Hamas leader had "wanted to make a change".
According to his ex-fellow inmate, Sinwar "tried several times to negotiate with the Palestinian Authority, to make a good relationship with Egypt, and he tried to provoke Israel to lift the siege on Gaza".
"After all these efforts, he didn't succeed. After that, he had to make a strategic change to [do] a huge operation like this. A big part of it was thought up by Sinwar."
Hamas killed 1,200 people, mostly civilians, in its raid on Israel last October and took around 250 others hostage.
The attack led to retaliatory Israeli strikes on Gaza that have killed at least 28,576 Palestinians, including mostly women and children, according to the Hamas-run health ministry.
The Israeli military claims it has killed or captured 8,000-9,000 Hamas fighters since 7 October.

From Sky News

Seriously? What Hamas did was so horrific - the rape, mutilation, and murder of women and children in utterly barbaric ways that read like something from the middle ages. And they didn't expect a brutal response? I don't believe that for a minute.

I don't think anyone saw wholesale genocide as a response. I certainly didn't.

And those saying "don't fuck with Israel". Yes it takes really hard men to murder 12000 children. You must be proud.

The IDF routinely sexually assault children in Israeli prisons, but I never hear any of the pro-israel crowd denounce that. But hey they're just human animals right?

Neither the Hamas attack nor Israel's response to it can be justified

What Hamas did was so horrific - the rape, mutilation, and murder of women and children in utterly barbaric ways that read like something from the middle ages.

Exactly this. So horrific so barbaric

You couldn’t have seen interviews in Gaza before Israel responded!
Israel started bombing Gaza at 9:15am local time on October 7th.
You must be imagining this.

I mean Israel is starving millions of people and bombing hospitals and schools and refugee camps. If you want to talk about barbarians. And this has been going on for 4 months. Not a day or two. And is going on right now.

No, I'm not imagining having seen interviews with people in Gaza shortly after the pogrom on the 7th of October. They were furious with Hamas for putting them in danger.

Extremist criminal response? The right to defend yourself in war is enshrined in law - when it's over the international courts will decide - that's how war works.

I'm also curious as to how this version of events from Sinwar's dear, dear friend works with the whole "we will repeat the 7th of October again and again and again" thing? I tend not to want to repeat major cock-ups but maybe that's just me?!

Yes, they expected a war like response but to say everyone knew that Israel would methodically destroy Gaza and turn it into rubble from north to south with reckless disregard for all international laws and the safety of civilians to the point that the ICJ ruled it is plausible that Israel is conducting genocide in Gaza….no one could have known that, not Hamas, not anyone.

General observation:
I think it’s a bit funny that some of the posters who are saying today they knew all this would happen from the 7th of October are the same posters who for months now have denied that this many civilians would be killed (or have been killed) , denied that Israel would target and destroy hospitals, schools, mosques/churches, sewage/water plants, entire residential neighbourhoods. These posters have said only Hamas infrastructure would be destroyed, that it was all precision targeting. That hardly any civilians would be killed. That there would be no humanitarian crisis or famine.

But you are definitely imagining that it was before Israel started their assault on Gaza.

It's because we thought we'd have the hostages back by now, so there wouldn't have been anywhere near as much death and destruction. They're currently in a hospital in Khan Younis looking for dead hostages because they know hostages were taken there. If Hamas hadn't taken hostages to hospitals / mosques / schools / refugee camps none of this would be happening

Do you take that same stance for Hamas’ war crimes? That t is enshrined in international law that you have the right to resist an occupation and that the ICC will decide?

If not, let’s call a spade a spade. Hamas has done war crimes but so has Israel’s IDF.

Yes, maybe it was an hour or so after Israel started their retaliation. Well done, you! 0-1 to you!

Everyone still saw it coming though.

Exactly, you thought something else might happen. You did not know what would happen. That is the reality for everyone. You not knowing doesnt mean that you are “poorly educated, not very intelligent,” as a pp has said of those who did not know.

I doubt it was an hour or so.

But you didn’t see it coming. You just said you thought something else would happen in Gaza- hostages released by now. But it didn’t.

I have seen the various scenarios you thought would happen over the months on these threads. You’ve been more wrong than right on seeing the future.

No, I knew it was going to lead to devastation for the people of Gaza, as did they. That's what I'm saying. I even said earlier that no one knew the specific details but we knew it would be bad.

That's not how war works. You have the right to defend yourself proportionately but there are laws of armed conflict which are about safeguarding civilian life. It's laughable to suggest everyone sits back gives countries free reign to do what they want and then decide after if it's legal or not.

I don't believe a word. They knew exactly what would happen.

It's more rubbish, just like when they said that "Palestinian civilians" were the ones who committed the worst atrocities on 7 October or now that civilians held some of the hostages. Maybe some of them are not official Hamas members but they're certainly not civilians.

midgetastic Not one country has been able to suggest what a 'proportionate response' would have been after an invasion by terrorists who hold Gaza in their power.

That's interesting 🤔

MercanDede Israel did not start the bombing of Gaza on the morning of October 7th! They weren't in any position to as they hadn't yet realised the strength of the invasion in Southern Israel.
FYI On the evening of 27 October 2023, Israel launched a large-scale invasion of the Gaza Strip, as part of the Israel–Hamas war, with the stated goals of destroying Hamas and freeing the hostages. The invasion came after a Hamas-led attack on Israel on 7 October 2023. HTH

Maybe some of them are not official Hamas members but they're certainly not civilians. The two elderly male hostages rescued by the IDF recently were held in a second floor flat. One assumes it was a civilian home whether it was owned by Hamas or a civilian supporter of Hamas.

maybe it was an hour or so after Israel started their retaliation. It wasn't.