Anti-Palestinian and anti-Israeli rhetoric

[WibbleWobbleFlop]

From what I have seen, both pro-Palestinian and pro-Israeli media have been sharing false rhetoric. Many threads are derailed due to whataboutery and it takes away from the intent of each thread.

There have been posters claiming that people who support Palestine are pro-Hamas. Posters have claimed that all Palestinians not only support Hamas as their leaders, but actively want the events of October 7th to continue. There have been posters who have accused all Israeli of being guilty of the onslaught of Gazan civilians. There have been posters who claim that all Israelis think Palestine should be wiped out. There have been posters who suggest that Jewish people all over the globe are at fault for the current bombings of innocent Palestinians. There have been posters who suggest that Muslim people are radicalized terrorists.

All of these things are simply ridiculous.

I wanted to create a thread where people can see without bias that Palestinian and Israeli citizens (and in extension, Jewish and Muslim people) are victims and deserve peace.

The mandatory conscription really bothers me. If the UK or my home country demanded that I be involved in combat that I didn't fully agree with, I would feel such guilt. It can't be good for mental health.

I think it's important to remember that being pro something doesn't automatically mean you're anti something else. Being pro-Israel doesn't by default make you anti-Palestine or vice versa. They're not two opposite things. I'm pro-Israel in the sense that I want Israel to exist, but I'm also pro a two state solution and illegal settlers being kicked out of the West Bank. I'm reluctant to say I'm pro-Palestinian because I don't want people to feel like I'm trying to misappropriate 'their' word but I very much am all for there being a state of Palestine and peace in the region. I am not alone in thinking like this. The difference is more about what we feel is the right approach to achieve this, which is where people start putting words in other peoples' mouths and the mud slinging really kicks off.

With regards to mandatory conscription, it's not as unusual as you might think. Even Sweden has it.

Good post and I totally agree with you about everything

Yes mandatory conscription is not unusual in a lot of other countries. My friend that is Barcelonian had to do his bit in Spain years ago. I think they have ended that in 2001. However many other places still have it.

This is pretty much where I'm coming from too. I think it's quite hard on here to have more nuanced or moderate views on Israel/Palestine, both in the current conflict and more generally, because like you say people put words in your mouth and a lot of posters demand some kind of binary 'take a side' approach. So I tend to not comment on the conflict and focus more on antisemitism.

I think it's important to remember that being pro something doesn't automatically mean you're anti something else. Being pro-Israel doesn't by default make you anti-Palestine or vice versa

I think this entire board and most of its posts are based on that assumption tbh. That and assuming everyone who disagrees with you must be bigoted/thick/evil/racist/a terrorist/supporting genocide (delete as applicable).

exactly this! it's ridiculous.

I think it's important to remember that being pro something doesn't automatically mean you're anti something else. Being pro-Israel doesn't by default make you anti-Palestine or vice versa
I'd agree with this and also think the same works when it comes to be critical too.
Being critical of the actions of a government or group and having concerns about the lasting harm of their actions or policy on civilians does not equal wishing harm on civilians.
Agreeing with a group/government on one topic does not equal agreeing with them on all topics, just like criticising a group/government on one topic does not mean hating them or disagreeing on all other topics.

When people get wedded to a set position and their 'side' being right, all other views are immediately viewed as a threat.

Yes, I have definitely felt that when I make posts, I need to be very explicit that I support civilians on both sides and do not support the IDF or Hamas. It seems as though a disclaimer is necessary, or people assume you are a racist, unfeeling bigot.

Thank you for starting this thread OP. Much needed. I stopped posting on this board some time ago, as I found the entrenched, often prejudiced, arguments from both sides so depressing. I think the majority of people really do feel sorry for the innocents in both Israel and Gaza, but the loudest voices are the partisan ones, and ours are less easily heard. When October 7th happened I really felt for all the innocent Israeli and other victims (still do) then when the right-wing Israeli government went crazy in Gaza, I felt and still feel so upset about the plight of Palestinians there. If I voice either thing to a biased person (sometimes understandable bias based on background) it can be tricky. So I've started keeping a lot of it to myself, as I'm terrified of saying the wrong thing to the wrong person. So your thread is a breath of fresh air x