Has anyone changed their mind from what they have read on here?

[mollyfolk]

we’ve argued a lot. We’ve backed up our arguments with lots of proof. Has anyone changed their mind or viewpoint - I’m just interested?

it would be lovely if we didn’t argue here and just let everyone state their views.

I’ve spent most of my life in Ireland, where you’d be hard pressed, in the present day, to meet someone who doesn’t agree that the Israeli authorities treat Palestinian’s terribly. It wouldn’t be controversial here to say - isn’t it awful what’s happening in Gaza - in any situation whether when I lived in the UK it was a lot more controversial and wouldn’t be a suitable thing to mention in work for example.

I haven’t changed my mind but I’m a lot more educated about anti semitism and have more understanding of the viewpoint of people who support the Israeli government.

Why should Israelis be held to account?
Is anyone actually saying they should?

I have taken screenshot of all the posts that remain standing. MN won't let me have a voice. It is shocking how they repeatedly delete my accounts

Have they said why they keep deleting your accounts?

I don't think you can judge a population by the actions of a government. It's why civilians are supposed to be protected in war, I suppose. Civilians have a range of views, little power and voting systems don't always capture majority views. They are not responsible for their governments.

Oh and it's not that Israelis should be held to account. It's that Israelis should hold their elected representatives into account. That's what usually happens in a democracy where the majority of people don't agree with the governments actions.

No I haven't changed my mind at all but my eyes have been opened to the Israeli government's obvious disregard for any human lives.
I knew the history of the birth of Israel and that 700,000 Palestinians Arabs fled from their homes or were expelled by Zionist militias during the 1948 Palestinian war, following the Palestine Partition Plan.
I also knew that during the decades that followed its creation, Israel fought several wars and ended up occupying the West Bank and Gaza - contrary to a 1947 UN designation.
I was also aware that Israel severely restricted the movement of Palestinians and goods from Gaza after 2005.
When the horrors of 07/10/23 happened, the first thing I said to my husband was that the Israeli government will exact revenge. I didn't know how far they would go. I believe that this has gone beyond revenge now or getting rid of Hamas. Netanyahu wants Gaza raised to the ground. Then he will turn to the West Bank. This man is a monster as bad as Hamas.

There is nowhere else on earth where people from differing faiths and races don’t live side by side with equal rights except Israel, why is this ? Why do you think you deserve that right, but no other people do ?

Only someone who is worryingly fixated on their hatred of Israel and its people
to the exclusion of all other countries in the world could possibly say this with a straight face.

Jewish people all around the world seem to happily live in many other communities, and co-exist with their friends and neighbours, if they are happy, why can’t you ?

If you honestly don’t know or understand why the Jewish diasporic community is so wide and varied and what has led to this, I don’t think you actually want to.

Can you not read ? Why are you trying to change my words and mis-interpret them ?

Just because you don’t like what I am factually pointing out doesn’t mean they are not allowed to be said, who made you the ruler of all speech.
There is nowhere in my post where I said Oct 07 didn’t happen, your comprehension is very lacking. I have quite rightly pointed out the lies and propaganda which Israeli had to retract and also information from Haaretz’s reporting. So much has been confirmed to be inaccurate. This is not my opinion, this is fact so stop with your bullying rhetoric.

How on Earth does tens of thousands of people rallying constitute a small protest? You are making out that the average Israeli citizen is a blood-thirsty, land-grabbing monster with no care for their neighbours. Which minority religious group has been tarred with those stereotypes before...

I’ve heard this so many times from pro-Israelis, “it is our land because we won it in a war” …. what garbage. If someone “won” Israel would that be ok then ? Of course it wouldn’t, so stop with the propaganda.

I didn't make up the polls, if you think that the results of the polls make Israelis look like 'blood thirsty monsters' those are your words and your judgements, not mine. I didn't pass any judgement on them, just stated that it seems from the polls that Netanyahu and the IDF represent the 'average Israeli' in this conflict. Elected governments usually do represent the 'average person'.

I forgot to quote the post I was replying to a few posts above, but it was in reply to these absolutely moronic ramblings.

This may be true to you, but so many Jewish communities are happy and live side by side with many people from many different races and religions, they work together, go to school together, socialise together, they teach each other about their rich and varied life’s tapestries. They are friends. Why can it not be this way for you ?
Many cultures are split all over the world, what is wrong with that ? Do you want all the Muslims in one place ? All the Christian’s in one place, never to mix and be friends ? This is one thing I’ll never understand, it’s kind of like reverse racism that is spouted by certain people on here.
There are streets in the West Bank and in East Jerusalem that Palestinian people are not allowed to walk down, how fucked up is that ? how can one society inflict that on another society ? That’s sick !

After a week-long pause in hostilities in November, more than three-quarters of Israelis said the offensive should resume without adjustments that would reduce either Palestinian civilian casualties or international pressure, according to a poll conducted by the Israel Democracy Institute.

^^ case in point. More than 75% of Israelis don't want adjustments to reduce Palestinian casualties.

Only 10% of Israelis thought the army was using too much firepower, according to a Tel Aviv University poll.

Again a very small number think Israel are using too much firepower.

I think that shows that the average Israeli is pretty supportive of the IDF and Netanyahu in this conflict as I stated.

But you didn’t even bother to answer the questions did you. I’ll ask again,
Why don’t the people of Gaza deserve their own state and human rights ?
Why do you think you deserve that right but others don’t !
Why are Israel already marketing brand new beach villas in Gaza to settlers ?
hidden agenda ?

Why don’t the people of Gaza deserve their own state and human rights ?
They do.

Why do you think you deserve that right but others don’t !
I don’t think that. Everybody deserves that right.

Why are Israel already marketing brand new beach villas in Gaza to settlers ?hidden agenda ?
This is so ludicrous I’m inclined to think it’s an incredibly poorly thought out joke made in bad taste. It’s extremely offensive and I’d have to look into it
more. Obviously, if it is real, it’s appalling, but it’s not “Israel” as a whole doing this, is it? Just like it’s not “the Palestinians” as a whole being responsible for the actions of Hamas. I can make this distinction so why can’t you?

Why can it not be this way for you ?

You keep saying “you” as if you know who I am and what I think - who do you think I am?

ETA: good on you though for having a go at lecturing a diasporic Jew on Jewish diasporic communities and assimilation.

The average Israeli is stuck between a rock and a hard place. If their government stops bombing, Hamas will wreak terror on Israel again as they have already clearly stated is their intent. I have yet to hear an alternative way to stop Hamas, as rockets are still being fired and attacks are being carried out daily. They are likely in fear that if they lessen Palestinian casualties, they will face further atrocities like that of October 7th. The poll does not give them an alternative method of stopping Hamas, it is essentially "fight back" or "roll over".

OK great. I'm not looking for a fight nor am I looking to be accused of saying things that I am not. I'm simply making the point that from polls it seems that unlike your assertions the average Israeli does seem to be represented in this conflict by the IDF and by the government that they elected last year. The polls basically say keep doing what you are doing which seems like support to me.

I'm not looking for a fight either. I'm trying to point out that Israeli citizens are human beings worthy of our support, just as Palestinian citizens are human beings worthy of our support. Polls do not include reasoning or depth, and they should not be used to taint an entire nation's worth of people.

MN deleted your post so they agreed with me.

Why are Israel already marketing brand new beach villas in Gaza to settlers ?hidden agenda ?
This is so ludicrous I’m inclined to think it’s an incredibly poorly thought out joke made in bad taste.

I found an obviously fake graphic on Reddit, supposedly "found on instagram". I just checked back twenty minutes after looking for it, and the moderator has already deleted it. Some posters here seem extremely susceptible to ludicrous conspiracy theories/misinformation. "Hidden agenda" indeed.

Again you are the one passing judgement if you feel that the polls 'taint an entire nations worth of people'. It doesn't seen like Israelis see this conflict as 'tainting' themselves. They see it as a not backing down and a show of strength in times of threat.

@kesstrel it's a company called Harey Zahav.
They are a real estate company that primarily focuses on building settlements

They have the pictures on their social media and they haven't taken them down