Why Can't Gazans Leave?

[miniaturepixieonacid]

There is probably a very simple answer to this that I missed in early news reports.

It's so awful watching News Feeds that essentially seem to say that Gazans are having to move around in a cat and mouse game with the IDF to avoid bombs but have nowhere left to go.

I am very aware that war has casualties and other countries are at war. I am not necessarily saying that IDF should stop fighting.

But this war is different in that all civilians seem to be trapped. Normally war creates refugees. Ukrainians, Afghans, Syrians - they were able to get out. Not all, I know, but movement was an option and it kept civilian casualties down. Why can't Gazans leave Gaza?

Continuing airstrikes in Rafah including near the Kuwaiti hospital - one of the few remaining semi-functioning hospitals causing great anxiety amongst the trapped residents

Population of Rafah is now 300K [original residents] plus 1.3 million [displaced people] so 1.6 million as more people arrive and the IDF ground invasion grows ever closer

Oh dear. Such a shame the Gazan government won’t surrender and hand over the rest of the Israeli hostages isn’t it? This could all have been avoided.

Strangely I don’t think I’ve ever seen such detailed war reports on MN @Efacsen. Have you ever posted about other wars too or is it just this one?

Have you ever cared to post about other countries in the world or just this one

@FrozenWindscreen

Oh dear. Such a shame...............

Not answerable to the likes of you, sunshine

@FrozenWindscreen funnily enough I have often thought that. Hemingway would be proud.

@Efacsen thanks for the update

@FrozenWindscreen Can't see the relevance of your post. Can't seem to find any humanity in it either - thousands of dead children is more then a shame;, it's a horror. I appreciate all @efacsen 's intelligent posts, and they are always informative, rather than your own sarcastic dismissal of human life which serves no purpose whatsoever.

Lovepeaceunderstanding · 04/12/2023 13:46

“Israel” and “Palestine.” One land, two names. Both Jews and Arabs have claimed it as theirs alone. From a purely historical perspective, “Israel” predates “Palestine” by more than a millennium.

Sorry, but that's complete rubbish. The Philistines were a Canaanite people, who, as you probably know, inhabited the Levant before the arrival of the Hebrews. "Palestine" comes from Philistine.

Hmmmmm

A screen shot rather than a link because the map is from the iron age, the Canaanites pre-date the iron age.

The page you have taken that map from is very interesting.

Today’s Palestinians are not descendants of the Philistines or Phoenicians.

Today’s Palestinians are descendants of the Canaanites and Israelites (Jesus was a Jew as were most early Christians in the area). Then when Islam was founded, another round of Jewish/Christian people still living in the region converted to become Muslims.

Ethnically and genetically, Palestinians and Israelis are more similar to each other than any other Semitic group, including Arabs (the resident Bedouins).

It is a horror and also a fucking shame on Hamas, and all those that support them and supported the invasion of Israel, that they deliberately started this war by committing atrocities on civilian men, women and children so barbaric they knew the action Israel would take, and which they left them with no option but to take, and were prepared to sacrifice their own citizens by hiding them among them. Hence the very high civilian casualty rate not usually seen in a normal conflict which is what Hamas and their supporters wanted and planned for.

The amount of threads on MN on this conflict and the daily detailed updates by certain posters is unusual compared to other conflicts in recent times and current ones still ongoing. I don’t see what purpose that serves either. I doubt the Israeli government is reading MN.

Both Hamas and the Israeli government/IDS are guilty. My sympathies lies with the Palestinians currently living through hell and being murdered in large numbers

@FrozenWindscreen "Hence the very high civilian casualty rate not usually seen in a normal conflict which is what Hamas and their supporters wanted and planned for." and so you are saying that the Israel Govt is doing exactly what Hamas want. Which means they are one in the same and the Israeli Govt and IDf are stupid and weak.

It take a lot more strength to seek peace, to stop obliterating civilians and maiming children by dropping unguided bombs from your very expensive jets and talk. Cue... "but Hamas" ,yes but Hamas pull our strings. Weak.

The amount of threads on MN on this conflict and the daily detailed updates by certain posters is unusual compared to other conflicts in recent times and current ones still ongoing. I don’t see what purpose that serves either. I doubt the Israeli government is reading MN.
——

Yet you’re in this thread and many others. Guess their purpose it’s the same one as yours be heard by others that take part in MN.

I've been trying to find a good link that explains reports that Israel intends to re-occupy the Philadelphia Corridor a 14km (8.7-mile) long strip of land that represents the entire border area between Gaza and Egypt. The corridor has been under the control of Egypt since the 1967 peace negotiations - Egypt has allegedly sent envoys to Israel disagreeing with this plan,

Israel re-deploying forces there would cut Gaza off from Egypt [ all the back-logged humanitarian aid*] and therefore the rest of the world so that Gaza would be surrounded on 3 sides by Israel and the blockaded coast on the 4th side

Presumably this would involve displacing 2 million people into Egypt beforehand as Israel’s finance minister, Bezalel Smotrich, suggested yesterday

*plans to supply EU humanitarian aid via maritime pathway from Cyprus

Should perhaps add that Israel doing the above would cross one of the US 'red-lines'

But as someone said the 'US has hitched it's waggon to a horse it can't control'

I suspect those red lines might fade and disappear. The US has gone too far along this path to turn back now with an election looming. The fallout from the destruction of Palestine may feel like a small price for them to pay (especially considering what the US would gain) in the battle between two senior citizens over who gets to sit in the fancy chair.

If the campaign continues for 6 months or more, as Israeli spokespeople suggest. the US might think everyone will get used to it. Tired of objecting, desensitised to mass suffering, media moves on and other things need attention.

Biden hasn't addressed this yet

Last night a US spokesperson said they didn't agree with this proposal

There’s growing friction between the US government and far-right ministers in Israel who have called for the rebuilding of Israeli settlements in Gaza, and for Palestinians in the Gaza Strip to relocate to southern Lebanon. Such proposals, voiced by Israel’s national security minister Itamar Ben-Gvir and finance minister Bezalel Smotrich, two senior members of prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s cabinet, are abhorrent, the US state department said in a statement on Tuesday.

Pages and pages ago al-Mawasi the specific 'safe' evacuation zone indicated by the IDF. It's the small area on the coast with lots of sand-dunes not far from Rafah

Last night a house there was bombed and all the rubble and debris fell on people inside their tents, injuring dozens. This all happened without warning.

More leave or die

There’s a good call in on the James O’Brien show on LBC on this topic right now. Worth listening in to/listening back

14 people which include 9 children died from the air strike of the designated safe zone mawasi.

Mawasi was the barren land with little to no infrastructure that civilians were outrageously asked to locate to. If Mawasi is being bombed then there is nowhere left for people to shelter

Mahmoud Saleh, one of the uncles of the killed children:
Where is international law? There is no law. They killed children. Children, they are getting shelled as they are sleeping, they are bombing them, killing them."

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/qatar-and-kuwait-join-condemnations-of-ben-gvir-and-smotrich-for-advocating-displacement-of-gazans/

Israel’s National Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gvir on Monday called for promoting “a solution to encourage the emigration of Gaza’s residents” and the re-establishment of Israeli settlements in the Gaza Strip.

His comments came the day after far-right Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich also called for the return of settlers to Gaza, adding that Israel should “encourage” the territory’s approximately 2.4 million Palestinians to leave.