Why Can't Gazans Leave?

[miniaturepixieonacid]

There is probably a very simple answer to this that I missed in early news reports.

It's so awful watching News Feeds that essentially seem to say that Gazans are having to move around in a cat and mouse game with the IDF to avoid bombs but have nowhere left to go.

I am very aware that war has casualties and other countries are at war. I am not necessarily saying that IDF should stop fighting.

But this war is different in that all civilians seem to be trapped. Normally war creates refugees. Ukrainians, Afghans, Syrians - they were able to get out. Not all, I know, but movement was an option and it kept civilian casualties down. Why can't Gazans leave Gaza?

More forced evacuations southwards in Khan Younis

And continuing bombardment of Rafah

That's what I was thinking, @MissyB1

From sky
Another example of why the Gazans don't trust the IDF.

Israel said it would be used to give clear and precise evacuation orders to try to keep civilians in the densely populated Gaza Strip away from active combat zones.
Using on-the-ground footage, satellite imagery and mapping software, a Sky News visual investigation found that Israel's evacuation orders have instead been chaotic and contradictory and that a neighbourhood in Deir al Balah was hit one day after the IDF said evacuees could flee to the city.

They told the residents to go to Deir al Balah.
And then once people did then bombed it the next day

Absolutely heinous. Hopefully these people will be convicted of war crimes. Not that that's any good to the people being terrorised and murdered as we speak. God help them.

apple.news/AjP_9ejkzRUq0xmWzy-Aeuw

What did Blinken say? The path this stopping has been put on the table and rejected by Hamas.

Horrific and surely a war crime?

@stomachameleon they don't want a pause. That's just taking a break from the killing. But a full ceasefire

@Parkingt111 but it's quite simple then. Release the hostages and start somewhere.

Do you honestly think Hamas wanting a full ceasefire has anything to do with the Gazan's? They will see it as a victory.

@stomachameleon I do understand what you mean and I wish more than anything that they would release the hostages.
I don't know what exactly they turned down but for me personally the cost of life is too much
On average 300 people a day are being killed. That's more than any other conflict in recent times
If you look at the way Ismail Haniyyeh and others are acting, they are not even close to being defeated yet every day the civilians are paying the price
So how many more Gazans have to die before they are defeated? Already 20 thousand are dead in less than three months.
They have said If there is a full ceasefire they will release all the hostages

They have said If there is a full ceasefire they will release all the hostages

Thing is though they Don't have all the Hostages do they?

Well they’ve released some already, the IDF have shot some, and who knows how many more have survived the bombing and food /water shortages . But there will hostages that can still go home, are they a priority to the Israeli government or not?

@MissyB1 they all would have survived if they hadn't taken hostage in the first place.

The priority will be ensuring it doesn't happen again and getting the remaining home.

So the priority is getting the remaining home? Well Israel knows what to do then.

There is no “winning” for anyone in this conflict. There will have to be negotiations at some point. Better to do it sooner than later.

BBC did something similar earlier in the war. Found as well that IDF would say evacuate to this spot and then bomb it 1-3days later.

@MercanDede yes it was at the time when people were saying well why don't the Gazans just listen and move south if they don't want to be killed.
They did a verify piece that showed bombing of a safe zone the day after IDF instructed civilians to move there
Which meant that the rest of the people in the north thought it was a trap resulting in many more avoidable deaths

Because none of the countries that surround Palestine will take them in , even on a temporary basis.

Because they know Israel would never let them back in.

@caringcarer they have all been burnt before.

It's also not their problem, as spokespeople for Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia and other countries in the region have repeatedly said to the incompetent Blinken over and over again. No ethnic cleansing, no displacement of Palestinians.

Do the Western countries really think that the region will accommodate 2.4 million refugees without being set on fire. And not because of terrorism, but because ordinary people are watching their Palestinians brothers and sisters being blown to pieces with Western wespons.

There's fighting on the Jordanian border right now between the army and civilians who want to go and help the Gazans fight. Yemen is mobilising it's army to fight. There’s a real risk of an actual "Arab Spring" because the people are so disappointed in their governments lack of action and seeming complicity with the West that they might rise up.

The Palestinian issue is a failure of Western (mostly America) diplomacy and it will be up to the West to solve it.

Ps. I find the repeated rhetoric that other Arab countries should take Palestinians ignorant at a minimum and somewhat racist in that presumes that Arab or Islamic countries are interchangeable and ignores that they're all unique with their own cultures and traditions.

great post, the idea Palestinians should even have to leave Palestine is in itself offensive. That is their land and home.

Yemen is mobilising it's army to

To fight who? www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-29319423

They are in the midst of an eight year civil war. They are being blown apart with Saudi weapons so they are somewhat busy. And we have seen what happens when they mess with the shipping lane. Other countries will step in.
Egypt is bankrupt and relies on America good will so it can say what it likes but in reality?
Jordan? The only article I can find out that ridicules that assertion and of course some residents of Jordan will be angry. They have 900,000 refugees. The article also refers to the 'Zionist army' so I won't be taking that seriously.... unless you have any mainstream sources.
The 'Arab spring' is a damp squib.

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/21/hamas-rejects-hostage-talks-as-un-declares-catastrophic-hunger-in-gaza

If you say so Storm better hope your assertions are correct.

Hopefully they're not coming from the same Western commentators who said Ukraine was winning for 18 months, happily writing article after article about Russia running out of weapons and men and how they will support Ukraine until the end. To today admitting that Ukraine is losing (after being destroyed with male casualties that will lead to a demographic collapse) and that there's no money or weapons left.

From listening to actual civilians in the region who are openly communicating all over social media. There is anger, hurt and betrayal being felt and expressed.

Remember a lot of the leaders in that region are puppets installed after the 2011 Western assisted "Arab Spring". aka Sisi in Egypt, yet even he is being careful not to be seen as being close to America (he openly told Blinken off).

All I was trying to express is that the Status quo is over. However this ends there will not be a return to any type of cordial relationship with Israel, for generations to come. The Abraham accords might as well be ripped up. Israel's actions have managed to unite disparate groups.

The Palestinians and more importantly the rest of the world (mostly the "Global South"), will not accept a return to subjugation and the West if it wants to salvage/retain any sort of Global influence will have to make a choice.

P.s Saudi Arabia sued for peace with the Yemeni rebels. There’s been detente for a few months now. Hence a few rockets fired by Yemen were able to hit Israel after passing through Saudi airspace (which is a message in and of itself).
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/nov/24/houthi-attacks-on-israel-jeopardise-saudi-peace-efforts-in-yemen

Drone strike by IDF killed 4 Palestinians at the Kerem Shalom gate yesterday - one of them was the Hamas official in charge of the Rafah crossing