Detainees, Truce and Agreements *title altered at OP's request*

[stormy4319trevor]

Continuing broad discussion of the release of detainees, hostages and prisoners and the agreements around this.

@Stomacharmeleon I did also see that one possibility is that it's just psychological warfare. It's to get those hiding in the tunnels to come out in the fear that they will be killed otherwise

@Humdingerydoo just saw your message now, anybody who knows anything about Gaza should know there are tunnels there, not just a few but it's a whole underground network and its not something that's kept a secret

@Parkingt111 then you have to value life.... so I think it's a no win.

Yeah but plenty of people on here were still denying their existence a month ago.

I hope that they don't flood any tunnels, but that if they do it's only the ones that can be safely flooded (like I assume the ones Egypt flooded were). Although if they're all connected... 🥴

I hope people are starting to realise Israel's predicament though. They can't bomb, they can't flood and they can't invade without being heavily criticised and accused of genocide. So what should they do? I am very grateful not to be a part of any of this decision making. I hope you know by now that I don't want any more deaths, there have already been far too many. I also hope, though, that you can see how impossible it all is. I know people always reply to these kind of posts with "well what they shouldn't do is carpet bomb" etc, but I want to know what Israel should have done. They're clearly not as mighty an army as people say or else none of this would have happened to begin with, and if it did somehow still happen Hamas would've been gone from Gaza within hours.

Anyway, sorry, that's detracted from the topic at hand so I apologise. Feel free to ignore if it's considered derailing.

@Humdingerydoo I do think there was plenty they could have done differently and they still can.
And if they did do it differently they might not have recieved the international outcry and condemnation that is happening right now. I'm not alone in this and I'm aware there are even people within Israel who disagree with the choices the government have made in this war.
To me it looks like a series of multiple bad and poorly thought out decisions and I blame the US for it too, for not challenging it at the time but now criticising the death toll when the decisions they supported would inevitably lead to this.
I could go on but it would definitely derail the thread
I appreciate that you also don't want to see further deaths

I have just seen sky news report that Hamas is saying there will be no further hostage negotiations until there is a full ceasefire

The timing seems significant to me. They may be aware that there will be a meeting with the families of the hostages and Netanyahu tonight

I hope so @Parkingt111 I am afraid there are hostages in the tunnels and they are being sealed up in there with no way to escape, as well as the terrible destruction above ground.

I mean I hope there can be a ceasefire and return to getting hostages out.

Me too. And those held in prison without trial or charge

I am seeing online that the in the meeting Netanyahu has said that currently there isn't a way to get all the hostages out

Can anyone verify if that was actually said

@Parkingt111 This is the only thing I've seen from AJ

‘Ugly, insulting, messy’: Israeli captives’ families express anger after Netanyahu meeting

A meeting today between Israel’s war cabinet and released Israeli captives and their families at times boiled over into anger towards PM Benjamin Netanyahu, according to those in attendance.

Several attendees said they felt disrespected by the officials as families of those still held captive in Gaza pushed for more to be done to secure their release.

Dani Miran, whose son Omri was taken captive on October 7, told Israel’s Channel 13 that he walked out in the middle of the meeting.

“I won’t go into the details of what was discussed at the meeting but this entire performance was ugly, insulting, messy,” he said, while accusing the government of making a “farce” out of the issue.

“It was a very turbulent meeting, many people yelling,” Jennifer Master, whose partner Andrey is among the captives, told Israel’s Channel 12. “We are all trying to make sure our loved ones get home.”

Just to add the meeting was held in camera so don't think the released hostages and hostage families are supposed to say what was discussed or report Netanhayus words

Doesn't sound like a positive or satisfying outcome for the remaining hostages from the limited amount of information

Mind you the last one not long before the hostage release/ceasefire wasn't great either

@efacsen thank you for that
It is disheartening to read as I was hoping for a more positive outcome

It's good to see the families of the hostages are not giving up and I think despite the meeting not going well, they won't give up

I have been trying to look to see if there are any updates from Qatar but I haven't come across any
The last I saw about a truce or similar was Hamas saying no more hostages will be released until a full ceasefire

Two other downsides to flooding tunnels - contamination of water supply with faecal matter and salinisation of agricultural land

Photos online of the 5 pumps and 'tubes' to carry the seawater, at a coastal refugee camp in the mostly northerly part of gaza ?where there are possibly no/less hostages as IDF is largely in control of the north

When Egypt flooded smuggling tunnels along the border they were doing it in Egypt and likely more careful of subsidence and environmental hazards than an invading army intent on destroying enemy infra-structure, Or alternatively maybe this was how the negative effects were discovered

The Israeli army said Wednesday that the International Committee of the Red Cross “must have access to the hostages” still being held by inside the Gaza Strip.

“As the IDF expands its operations to dismantle Hamas in Gaza, we have not lost sight … of our critical mission to rescue our hostages,” army spokesperson Daniel Hagari said, AFP reports.

“The international community must take action. The Red Cross must have access to the hostages that are in the hands of Hamas.”

@Efacsen I adamantly want that but I don't think it will happen (happy to be proved wrong) Do you? Especially in light of what America said about the women hostages?

Have they been granted access before? Gilad Shalit was not I Believe?

@Efacsen since yesterday I haven't seen the flooding the tunnels mentioned again so I'm hoping that this idea has been discarded is too dangerous and with unacceptable repercussions

No I don't think it will happen either - and likewise happy to be proved wrong

Hamas don't want it and the logistics seem impossible with even lorries of aid unable to travel to the places they need to be and the on-going comms blackout

Don't think it's right or reasonable to blame the ICRC for it not happening which was the sub-text of the IDF announcement and a element of deflection from their role in putting the hostages in harms way

So much blame-game going on

Promise not to mention flooding tunnels again

@efacsen Oh no don't worry about me.
Please do mention it again If you see anything or anything else you wish to
It's good to hear different views

I agree it's not a big issue atm and potentially de-railing too!

@Efacsen I agree with that. The Red Cross can only apply pressure and ask. If Hamas say no that's it. Don't really see what else they can do....

The red cross have released a response to people calling them a uber service

She told the BBC's Newshour: "[The hostages are] at the very top of our priority list - but under current circumstances access is difficult and very dangerous for the hostages themselves.
"It requires an agreement between both the parties and that agreement is lacking at the moment. We speak to both sides all the time and we are demanding that Hamas gives us access - from day one I have always clearly said that taking hostages is against international humanitarian law."
A phrase that has gained some traction on social media in Israel is that the ICRC is a mere "uber service" for the hostages.
She responded: "This is profoundly unjust, unfair, and wrong - these operations are extremely complex and have to be planned - we are working around the clock with the authorities on the Israeli side and Israel knows that we use all our available resources whenever we can facilitate a release or access to hostages."

I think the situation seems to be what was mentioned earlier that it's currently out of their hands

If Hamas are not allowing the Red Cross access to the hostages then no aid should be allowed in.

@Queucumber the international community and most notably the US would not allow such a thing to happen as that would be considered collective punishment of a people and contravenes international humanitarian law

I know. You can’t let people starve and it’s quite obvious that Hamas would choose to let the population of Gaza starve rather than allow the Red Cross to see what they’ve done.