Shocked by the racist signs at marches

[Pigeotto]

Maybe I’m just severely naive but I’m honestly just shocked at the levels of racism of some of the signs at these marches. It’s just caught me really, really off guard.

@Humdingerydoo as one of the people who has been posting with some scepticism about some of the IDF's statements, I'm so sorry that security is neccessary for your school trip. It is 100% wrong. Your child - and every child - should be able to go on a trip without even thinking about security. I'm so sorry we live in a world where that is not the case.

I have been reaching out to my Jewish friends where I can because I'm aware that this is a really shitty time. Is there anything else I can or should be doing?

This thread is the height of anti semitism. The posters are falling over themselves to say how awful Israel is and totally dismissing the evidence that the hospital is a Hamas command centre and held hostages there.

www.mumsnet.com/talk/conflict-in-the-middle-east/4943076-israel-has-bombed-the-front-of-a-hospital-2?reply=130857038&utm_source=brevo&utm_campaign=Mumsnet_Watched_Thread_Notification_New_Talk&utm_medium=email

Isn't it named after a thread that was proven wrong. I mean the missile was proven to be yet another misfired by Hamas wasn't it. In that case if they stated another thread and continued to used the same name or didn't get mumsnet to change it, what do you expect.

I can't even be bothered with those threads to look if I am honest. Just let them talk to themselves. Most people will just look at the title like I did and think well that was proven wrong. Then ignore the thread. If you post you only bump it up and encourage dodgy users.

"All 80 cars were given notices under Section 59 of the Police Reform Act ordering them to disperse and cease their participation in the convoy or face being seized," a spokesperson said.

"One vehicle was ultimately seized, with fixed penalty notices for various road traffic offences issued to 18 drivers.

"A further nine vehicles were served with prohibition notices after defects were found making them unfit for use."

At least the police handled the convoy weĺl this time. Plus 9 cars that were not safe off the road, 1 more taken because the owner didn't comply with disperse instructions and 18 drivers got penalties on their licences for dangerous driving

The police still tracking down 15 people as well. So more penalties or some arrests to come.

The posters are falling over themselves to say how awful Israel is and totally dismissing the evidence that the hospital is a Hamas command centre

What evidence?

Thank you, I appreciate it.

I can only speak for myself but honestly, acknowledgment that our fears aren't paranoia and that there are people who genuinely do want us all gone would help. The amount of gaslighting is phenomenal- people denying that a lot of the demonstrations have been problematic. Every single major demonstration has displayed anti-Semitism, some more obviously than others. Being told that it's nothing to worry about because it's just a handful of people per demonstration isn't helpful. Even if it is just a handful of people - it's not ok. Stop trying to justify it and start calling it out instead. Say that these people don't speak for you. Also acknowledge that if someone is feeling the need to cover their face to attend a demonstration, that's probably not someone you want to be demonstrating alongside with. They are there to intimidate those who disagree with them. That's just not ok.

It's a really scary world out there. A world where bin Laden is being praised for his brave words. It's absolutely bonkers.

Being told that it's nothing to worry about because it's just a handful of people per demonstration isn't helpful. Even if it is just a handful of people - it's not ok. Stop trying to justify it and start calling it out instead

To be fair it’s usually in response to the protests being called hate crimes and antisemetic. The presence of a minority of people (who activities are acknowledged as criminal) does not really suggest that but some folk on here really hate the protests and are convinced everyone who goes on one is backing Hamas.
Then you get the weird comments about a “fun day out” and how some of them are smiling in photos as if that’s somehow sinister.

I don’t think the people we’ve seen in photos waving offensive placards should escape punishment and not do most people I expect.

But it's not just those whose activities are acknowledged to be criminal that are problematic. It's the ones who are there to intimidate. Like the ones shouting "shame on you" at people outside McDonald's. Like the ones a couple of years ago who slowly drove past my child's primary school waving their Palestinian flags and honking their horns. They didn't do anything illegal, but it's still intimidating as hell. Admittedly that was a couple of years ago and not now, but that's why the police are taking these convoys seriously.

I just wish people would take these things more seriously. It feels serious to us.

It's a really scary world out there. A world where bin Laden is being praised for his brave words. It's absolutely bonkers

Are you referring to that TicTok video? At the risk of being overly optimistic I doubt many people base their world views on the content of TicTok.

They didn't do anything illegal, but it's still intimidating as hell

Would it not count as harassment?

I haven't seen the TikTok video. I'm not on TikTok or X. I've seen people praising the TikTok video on Instagram. People jubilant that people are finally starting to see the truth 🤯 And the amount of people who keep posting links to social media as proof of various atrocities is truly staggering.

No one was arrested or cautioned so I'm guessing no.

Show me the actual evidence from different reputable sources (as any critical thinker would do) that it was the command centre. I listened to an Israeli minister on radio 4 speaking about it and he stated that it would take weeks to find out. Do you know something he doesn't know?

No one was arrested or cautioned so I'm guessing no.

I’m assuming it was a Jewish school? I’m honestly surprised that low key aggressive behaviour directed at a primary school motivated by prejudice wasn’t considered criminal 😵‍💫 What did the police say?

Yes, a Jewish school. Not sure what the police said to be honest. The guards outside school will have reported it (yup, even when there's no major conflict we still need guards outside our Jewish schools 🙃 we just have a lot more now than we did then) but I obviously wasn't part of the conversation.

I mean, do you remember the convoy from Bradford that drove down to Golders Green and shouted absolutely horrific things about Jews? "F**k the Jews! Rape their daughters!" etc. I think it was a convoy of 10 cars yet only four people were arrested. The other cars were honking their horns and waving flags. So I guess it's perfectly legal to do.

Again, why are the Met asking for public help to identify those in the car convoy?
Cars are registered, and while they could have been driven by someone other than the owner, and those they claim to want to identify may not have been driving, wouldn't the ownership be a more obvious place to start?

Sorry, but given the infamous "light touch policing" I'm wondering again if this is a way to avoid dealing with it because "nobody came forward"

I suppose they may not have all the number plates if some people drove off the moment the police showed up. Traffic cameras possibly won't show all clearly if cars close together or maybe they covered their number plates because they were up to no good.

Even if they spoke to the drivers most may lie and say the don't know names or just refuse to give names

Just some guessing because I don't know any more than you.

The still images are ok. However it is annoying they don't show all the footage available from social media and traffic cameras etc. We tracked down from a security camera someone masked that smashed several windows on our local High Street because they had a very distinctive walk. The police went to their house and the clothes worn plus sledge hammer used were there.

Some of the cars may have something about them and some of the people may have recognisable gestures or shoes etc. You just never know, so why not show the public all footage.

All very valid points, Trulywonderful, but I'm still left wondering just how much they actively want to identify these offenders
I guess we'll see when it's discovered exactly how many have been charged, though doubtless the "lack of resources" will be trawled out once again

Odd how that only seems to apply when it suits ...

Just another in an unacceptable list of wrongful occurrences arising from the protests. Too many adverse splinter groups are forming now. Time to end the protests, for the police to grow a backbone and stop appeasing. The greater good/welfare and safety of the public had to take precedence now.

I see that more posters have popped up, mole like, from their anti-Semitic conflict threads to challenge the idea that Hamas has been using their hospitals as command centres and hiding hostages. Evidence has been demanded despite every reputable news source showing tunnel and weapons footage and evidence of hostages being held there in the past.

So let's ignore the trolling and gaslighting and focus on the racism .

Does anybody know if this has been reported by the dailies yet:

https://twitter.com/hurryupharry/status/1725938077741293593

I think we all know why there aren't multiple arrests, we just can't say it. It seems policing but condoning antisemitism is fine while being afraid of claims of Islamaphobia. The police, in this country, are so steeped in that claim to the detriment of the majority of public who just want to go about their daily business.

On the night it seems that stuck to finding safety faults on the cars and stopping dangerous driving. Just the things they knew would stick legally

So I don't hold any hope for harassment or actual dangerous driving charges being made. As far as the police are concerned they stopped the convoy achieving their goal and that is a win. Which in many ways it obviously is that. However it still doesn't sit well when we all know they were likely planning to do a repeat of last time.

If the police and government had done a decent job in with the first couple of marches there would be no need to ban protests. I agree with the right to protest but by allowing some of the stuff that has gone on like the chant or other hateful acts and antisocial behaviour some protesters have the impression they can do as they like. So in the end I can see you will probably be correct.

At work we know if we do not nip certain behaviour from students in the bud quickly when it first occurs and make them aware we won't tolerant it, it will quickly spread and get out of hand. That is why we don't have mob rule and students riots like we have seen about uniform or toilets else where in this country. We make sure we respect our students right but ultimately they know rules are for everyone and they won't get away with any mass disruption to the school day.

When you phrase your own work experience, as you do, you realise how simple it is to reinforce order.

I've been a visiting teacher in many FE colleges, where security is needed. I have seen, first hand, where targets and money come before quality. That then engenders an environment, where order/discipline becomes diluted in order to retain student numbers. Appease and apathy is employed. I don't envy you Truly because at this moment in time, I'm glad I took early retirement. I can't begin to imagine how this current situation is impacting teaching.

I am lucky our students despite everything have been really good about the conflict. We instill in them right from year 7 when they start with us that they should always be mindful of others feeling. Most really talk this on board. We have what I call the 5% in each year group that you can't get to think this way and are typically the trouble makers. They know not to step over the line to much.

My school is lucky we have a very good senior leadership team that are good at pastoral stuff and discipline too. We are a London State very multi cultural school. So on paper we should probably have more problems than we do. I think it helps that we have both a high percentage of Muslim students and a higher than normal percentage of Jewish students. Therefore most understand that the properganda or hate speeches about Jews or Muslims are just that.