Assisted conception (and the bits in between!) - part 3 - all welcome

[Caitni]

Right ladies, time for a new thread.

And a big welcome to everyone . Here's to many more success stories and healthy pregnancies!

GAME OVER

KC11 I'm sorry, it absolutely sucks! Hopes crushed and wondering if we should even try anymore. Hot showers and lots of crying seems to be the cure, perhaps with a bit of wine, chocolate or pizza.

HPT was negative again this morning for me, I called the nurse yesterday in tears because I had to leave work - I was in such a state. I guess yesterday hit the hardest. The nurse tried to cheer me up with false hope, but if I can't trip 20 hCG test a day before, it's not happening, kids. I promised her I'd complete out one last progesterone shot tonight, but the only point is so that I can have two days before AF arrives to have emo-sex with DH. I am looking forward to that! Worn out - battered and bruised, and I really don't know if we should even try FET or not... I asked the nurse to have info on hand for me when I see her tomorrow for the blood tests.

I hope today is better than yesterday and tomorrow will be even better.

xx

(((KC11))). Am so so sorry.

islegrin sorry you're so down too. but I understand implantation can be anything from 5dpo to 9dpo, and the hormones only start rising after implantation so really, hard though it is, try and hold off believing the worst till you see the evidence. FET you can think about later, if needed. No need to make any decisions just yet.

Argh, I just typed a long post, and it disappeared. can't face typing it all again but will write the most important things:

oh no KC11, this is terrible! I'm so gutted for you. sending you a big ((hug)). I hope you have someone there with you too look after you, it's so difficult to deal with the disappointment.

islegrin I'm glad you're giving it another day, the nurse may be right and your embie just implanted late. MamaChris is right you can always think about FET later, it's a great option to have anyway. good luck!

you're right lottie, I'm sure some of it is an insurance policy of my mind thinking if I don't expect anything at least I won't be dissapointed. Except it still is disappointing if it fails.

feeling like af is just round the corner

KC11. Hang in there Islegrin.

I think duplo should hang in there! We need one BFP! c'mon

Yep, sorry you hang in there too Duplo

Hi ladies. Good luck to those still in the two week wait. You deserve a BFP and i's sure one of you is getting a BFP this time.

Come on Duplo. Hope you're not too stressed with the waiting. good luck and fingers crossed for your preg test, whenever the due day is.

Islegrin sounds like you feel like I do. DH and I have discussed a total of 5 IVFs. I still will have the 3rd attempt paid for on the NHS which is why I guess it wouldn't be til March 2010 as they don't let you back on the waiting list until you've had three clear cycles since the failure and then you have to wait, so that's got to be about six months from now. DH says we will try naturally and that he has missed sex (as we've not had any for six weeks), poor thing. Personally it has become mechanical for me and I know i'll get upset the first time as it will feel so pointless. I know the hormones and meds kick the crap out of us and I have no sex drive at all at the moment. Sorry if TMI!

Hi everyone

Islegrin - I'm still holding out some hope for you. Whatever the news the ladies on this thread will be here to listen.

KC11 - So sorry. It sounds like you are making sensible plans for the future. Try not to think of sex as pointless. Do it because you love each other. Your DH does sound as if he has been supportive. And you never know you may have a natural miracle.

Mamachris - Glad you have your little blast on board. Hope it's getting comfy in there and doing all it should. When do you test?

Duplo - Fingers crossed for you. Hope you are doing OK.

We are definately due a BFP.

I'm busy buying new clothes for work this week and have been looking at what holiday we could have next year. I'm hoping if I do normal things we will get lucky! our information appointment is a week on monday. After that we will be waiting for AF before we start our cycle.

Hi to mummycat, londonlottie, sooty and hello to nanoo. I am yet to start my first IVF (possibly my only IVF if I don't respond well) so I'm afraid I'm a bit of a novice with all the terminology too. I think 'Stimming lining' refers to stimulating the lining of the womb. Read this thread enough and you get the general idea, but I'm sure once you are doing a cycle things make a lot more sense!

Hi gingerwine. you don't know how you'll respond, so don't worry about that yet. Good luck with the journey though

blood test booked for Tuesday. but I have zero symptoms, except for a feeling that AF is trying to come (suppose progesterone is keeping that at bay) - with nothing in the freezer, am feeling very negative.

can anyone who's had a BFP after IVF tell me about early pregnancy symptoms? (clutching at straws here! if it's normal to have zero symptoms, then maybe there's still hope, right?) I had sore boobs the first few days taking the progesterone (even before transfer), but even they've gone now... feels like being not even in a normal cycle, like I'm back on the synarel

mamachris it's absolutely normal to not have any symptoms this early - except for the symptoms that the progesterone gives you. So there is still a lot of hope for you. My thoughts are with you these last difficult days of waiting. My advice - laugh as much as possible, I find that helps a lot!

KC I've really learned to appreciate your simplicity of notice (game over). I might have to use that one next time (oh god - if there is a next time!). Six weeks - wow, I've only been away from the sex for 3 and I'm going bonkers!!! I'm really looking forward to this weekend for all of that! I've been randy as a rabbit! (typical the week before AF for me.) Tonight is part of my "consolation prize". I guess we'll also start planning our Vegas trip.

Yesterday was pretty good for me, I've come to terms with it now. Wednesday was just the worst as I still held out some legitimate hope. I'm debating on whether or not to stop and get some flowers for my nurse on my blood test visit today. I really let her have it on our Wednesday phone call - tears and all. She's never heard me like that before - and usually I'm so chipper and relaxed. But Wednesday I just flat out hit bottom. In retrospect, I suppose two down days out of this whole process isn't all that bad though. Within hours I started bouncing back and Thursday was fine. I think today will be ok too - I even feel up to receiving her phone call with neg news. (I'm really not being dramatic or pessimistic here ladies, I know we all want to hold out hope - but I'm just being realistic. I haven't yet passed over the 20 hCG mark- even this morning, so it hasn't happened this time.) I'm torn because I really do want a child or two - but I don't know if I really have any chance because the fact is that we don't know what the problem is. Obviously now, it's more than just tubes.

I've heard that FET only has 20% chance of success - back to IUI rates. That's daunting. At least with IVF it was closer to 50%. I wish I really knew what MY chances were - that would help me make a decision. Is it worth the money and the rollercoaster? I guess that's the decision in front of us now. If I could jump right into the next cycle, I think I would - but if I have to wait a month and cycle down on BC pills again - I'm dreading that. Of course, for a full term baby it would all be worth it - but the trick is we never know.

LL did you do a FET? If so, what was the protocol?

awww - thank you!!!

Hi islegrin, londonlottie speaks a lot of sense here. I don't know you're history (how many cycles etc), but at my clinic they don't even talk about success rates from a single cycle - they give the combined fresh cycle + frozen rate (40%, I think). If this is your first IVF cycle, and if it hasn't worked, then, really, it means nothing with regard to your likely eventual success rate. And a friend of mine just got her BFP from a single frozen embryo transfer (the "less promising embryo" that was put in the freezer) after a BFN from the two fresh embryos transferred before. Doesn't mean you have to go ahead with a frozen cycle. But I don't see anything negative either. You could always ask your clinic: "what are the success rates for women who don't get a BFP on the first cycle"?

Re me, well, I'm fairly certain it's a negative. My body really does feel like it's ready for AF (minor cramps on and off last 3 days), just the progesterone holding it back. I'm going to hold off testing till the morning of the blood test, because I'll need to call for the result of the blood test from work, and I'd rather have the final confirmation in the privacy of my own bathroom.

MamaChris you and LL really do make a lot of sense to me. When presented with a fact based hope - I will buy it everyday! This morning (my time) when I read LondonLottie's post, I finally felt like that was based on reality rather than wishful thinking. I actually teared up - yeah, I know I'm a sap, but not often!

I went to get the official blood test this morning, sitting here at my desk now waiting for the official results... but it has made today so much more tolerable because I've already made my peace with what will (PROBABLY) be the result. I took another HPT this morning, well actually, as I do every morning. It's still disappointing, but not crushingly so anymore. MamaChris I completely understand wanting the results when you have the privacy to react how ever you will - not in the middle of work!

Nurse says if I do FET - it will be DECEMBER, I told her that was worse news for me today than if the results are negative. Then she started looking at the calendar closer - she could possibly fit me in Mid-November, but she's going to be on vacation... um, so that's how it is now??? I think I'm going to push for November.

I'll soon have my post-IVF talk with the doc, and I have to think up all the questions to ask - so I'll put the one about success rates for ladies who failed their 1st IVF.

MamaChris I also meant to say that just because it feels like AF is around the corner, it's not necessarily - as I've come to find out there's a lot of adjusting going on in your body and the progesterone will stop AF from appearing. Even today, when I asked - it's still going to be 5-6 days before AF starts for me, but it has felt like it was going to start from the day after ET. That's not enough of a reason in itself. You'll have to show me at least 12dpo BFN results for me to believe you.

(my phone should RING anytime now, RING phone, RING!!!)

Hi everyone

Havent had time to read everything Ive missed yet, have a whole 6 weeks of posts to read. Wanted to sent all good wishes to those of you in the hell that is 2ww. islegrin hope you had a good phonecall.

Had a break after our failed ivf in Aug and its been good not to think about it for a while. However yesterday was our follow up appt and TBH its left me a bit confused, they did say I could email with any questions, but I would rather hear your thoughts I think. I asked them for advice but was just presented with options and facts. I really wanted to be told what to do!!

So firstly we were told we could still get pg naturally so we may want to stop here. Im 42 soon so its a 5% chance of natural pregnancy.

With another round of ivf we will have around a 10% chance of pregnancy. Our issues are my age/quality of eggs and dh's morphology. If we do go for another round they will address the lack of eggs in the follicles (last time lots of follies but only 3 eggs at EC) by upping the drug dose. Last time ET was a mess, took ages, so they would do a trial run before ET next time. (why didnt they do this the first time? wish Id asked).

If we decide to have a 2nd shot it has to be sooner rather than later, Im thinking January. She said we could carry on trying naturally or do a couple of iuis meantime (because the sperm is washed so the best motility/morphology are there).

dh is a betting man and thinks the odds of success are low, Im more of a lets give it our best shot mindset, however money is an issue for us. What to do?????

Official results: negative (less than 2 hCG so at least I know my HPT aren't flawed ) phone call was about 3 hours later than expected, but the nurse did apologize for not believing me on Wednesday.

bluebell good to see you back, and I'm very happy that you've had a mental break from the rollercoaster of thinking about all of this. Sounds like you are right back in the thick of it again, now.

I think you should also ask if there is anything that would significantly raise your chances of success. Have you asked or discussed donor eggs/adopted embryos? Or would you even consider that? Money is a concern for us as well, doable but tight. So anything you can do to raise your chances would help justify the money spent. The trick is that we'd all pay a lot IF it works, but how much are we willing to spend even if it doesn't. That's the question. Unfortunately nobody knows the future and whether or not it will really work.

There's no getting away from the fact that this is partly an emotional decision, all the FC can do is tell us what they think is the problem, and what are the best options for success - we have to do the hard part and make the call. Wishing you all the best ((((hugs))))

LL I hope your move is going well or is nearly complete. I can't believe you are doing this again while pg, you are my hero! I'll have to remember not to ever whine to you if I ever get pg.

Oh islegrin. I'm so sad for you. You deserve a BFP so much. I think this was you first IVF and since I failed my first IVF so many people have said to me that the first time is the test run. Why did they not say that to me before I fell from such a height? I guess they didn't want to dampen my spirit which for IVF cycle 1 were sky-high. On IVF cycle 2 whcih officially ended today, I was much more skeptical although still hopeful it it's possible to be both at the same time! Ha Ha. I had cramping from day 9 post ET and I was fairly sure that it was just the progesterone holding off AF. I started cleeding on day 12 and still manged to hope that the pink spotting wouldn't trun into anything more. but i was wrong. I actually have not cried since day 11 and somehow I just know it will hit me at some point. I hope you enjoy your consolation prize and i know you're right. DH and I love each other and that's why we have sex, not just for a baby. I have set myself a target to have the most ever IVF cycles, if I can afford them. I am setting myself the task of getting at least a positive by the 7th cycle. That give me something to aim for. I am notoriously unlucky. If there was one bad egg in a box of six, I'd pick the bad one. Hubby however, is luck and if there were five bad eggs in a bos of six he'd pick the one good egg. So we've got a chance at least!!!!! My coping strategy is that if I set my mind on acheiving birth of a baby after 7 IVFs, maybe I can achieve it before then!

I've just had hair cut and dried and am now getting ready to glam up for a party. I'm still going to stick to lemonade as i don't want anyone to suspect that my ivf failed. I'm putting off the news-telling to everyone except DH, my mum and dad, til Tuesday. Self-preservation. So for the me me me post.

I hope duplo is doing fine.

Lottie you do talk a lot of sense and I'm so glad you're still posting on here. You give me hope. Hope you're feeling well. Good luck with the move. Don't do too much if you can help it. Take care.

typo- should have typed "Sorry for the me me me post.

Oh no islegrin, I was still hoping that everything would be ok. I am glad that you are feeling a bit more composed about it - I guess in this respect early testing is quite useful because it prepares you for what may happen - but it is still a massive disappointment. I'm very, very sorry! Regarding your earlier post, I think MamaChris, Lottie and KYC have already said it all: just because it didn't work this time doesn't mean that anything is wrong with you. even if everything works out perfectly well in once cycle you still need quite a bit of luck too. You have quite a few frozen embies still, and even though FET seems second best to a lot of people, it often leads to success. In my clinic they are saying that due to improved freezing technology the success rate of FETs are getting close to the rate for fresh cycles.

I admire your attitude KC11 - picking yourself up and going to the party all glammed up after all the bad news! You are definitely stronger than me. I'm glad you're determined to keep going - you have responded so well in your cycles you have got excellent chances of it working eventually. I always told myself I'd try at least 4 cycles as that's what it took a good friend of mine to get pregnant. I she had stopped at 3 cycles she wouldn't have her gorgeous ds now. And who knows, maybe you even get a natural pg while waiting for your next attempt, it's always possible.

hi bluebell, those decisions are very difficult to make. I think it's a very personal decision so I can only tell you what I would do - I would try a second attempt. Your clinic already said they think they can improve your response by upping the drugs, and the first attempt is often seen as a trial run to see how you respond and less successful than subsequent ones where they can target the protocol better. But of course it depends on how much you can afford it and if you can face having another go. The other reason why I would try again is that if I didn't I would always ask myself what would have happened if I had - iyswim.
Are you happy with your clinic? You could always get a second opinion elswhere if you're unsure. Have you read inconceivable by julia inchicova? It's written by this woman who got pg naturally at 44 after all consultants told her there was no chance of this happening after improving her lifestyle. Obviously there are no guarantees, but the book helped me a lot when I felt really down.

Hi gingerwine nice to hear from you. Not long til your ivf then, are you excited? don't give up on your body before you have given it a chance!

Now as for myself, I tested this morning and somehow wish I hadn't. Tried a first response test, got a BFN and was just about to throw it in the bin when I thought I spotted a really, really light line, more like a shadow really. So I caved in and opened my special occasion clearblue digital test and it came up with "pregnant 1-2wks". So does that mean I am? I am 12 dpo today, could it still be the hcg in my system? I know I should be happy, I have been waiting for this for so long, but actually I'm terrified that it may be a false positive due to the hcg or result in a chemical as it's still so early.

DUPLO!!! That's great news, why you didn't lead with that bit is only a testament to your self restraint. I say (of course this is the mega-tester speaking) that you go buy a couple more tests. Don't test multiple times a day, but definitely test tomorrow morning and the next morning and see what it looks like - I THINK YOU ARE UP THE DUFF! But we still have to be somewhat cautious and wait a couple more days! I'm absolutely busting for you!!!! I knew with four of us going there had to be at least ONE that made it.

Your blood test is scheduled for Tuesday? oh oh oh, I can't wait!

hi islegrin. never one to resist a challenge, I tested today. does a 13dpo BFN count?

so sorry for both of us.

anyone here left in the 2ww?

duplo just read the end of your message - fantastic news yes - false postives are almost impossible