Entering into 8th cycle..

[Indianna2006]

Entering into 8th cycle…ttc number 2.

Feeling defeated and deflated even though I know odds are still on our side really..
I already have a DD who is 3 years 9 months so very much feel time is of the essence. Just desperate for it to happen now.

Feel like either people seem to fall super fast or seem like 12 months plus and don’t find many “in the middle” types.

Ive fallen pregnant 1st cycle before. And then DD took 7 cycles. So hence why this failed 7th cycle seems like a miserable milestone!

Anyone welcome to keep me company. Sucks 😫

@OK92 no I think it just meant a usual count of 100mil. 100mil soerm would never be good lol would need a huge count for that. I guess just 100mil sperm with other normal parameters. Just feel like that’s hard to come by these days.
It did say mens sperm over last 40 years has deteriorated by like 40%!
Just shows for easy conception what you ideally need.
But not to say it count without. But hundreds need to get to the egg! I honestly thought just one could do it. Shows what I know 😂😂
So encouraging millions of sperm into our cervix is the best bet.

Makes sense now why ivf works for ppl ie with the sperm issues. Takes that fertilisation issue right out of it.

I know I did chat with DH last night. Like how long ttc naturally is enough before moving to IVF is you have to self fund.

When 84% will be pregnant after 1 year. But 94% after 2 years. It’s so hard to know what to do.

@OK92 @FlyOnTheWall89

Although I did think right. If 15 out of 100 couple are not pregnant at 1 year. And only 40% of those is male factor. So like 6/100.

Be weird if we’re those 3/100 right? Like and is 3 just happened to meet and end up here. When we started we still had every chance of conceiving same as everyone else and be in the 85/100.

Not sure if that makes any sense. But what shitty odds is that!

@Indianna2006 But with IVF, the sperm is just released into a dish with the egg... it skips the journey so works for women with issues like endo etc, but does still have to penetrate the egg. The vagina basically attacks the sperm upon entry so only the fittest make it to the egg and then penetrate. IVF with ICSI is when a sperm is collected and inserted into the egg. If the issue is sperm, most of the time IVF with ICSI will be recommended.

I think it is also worth noting that you cant rely on just 1 sample. It is really recommended to do 2 at least and keep them 2-3 months apart. Different labs and the skills of the technicians can really vary and I've read sooooo many stories about wild differences between 2 samples... sometimes for the better and sometimes worse..! I think science really needs to catch up with sperm, particularly morphology - it is the area with the least research.

@Indianna2006 hahaha I don't know if the maths works quite like that but yes.... god think how exciting it will be when someone finally gets their BFP. I just bought the book BFN - will report back although my partner says it is a depressing book ...

@FlyOnTheWall89 yeh think they always ask for second semen analysis when you get to fertility clinic. Or certainly if the first was abnormal. Not sure if they do if the original is normal.

I’m hoping the wait will only be about 3 months for the fertility clinic but not sure if that’s wishful thinking?! Could be like 6 months 🤦🏻‍♀️

If DH semen is fine. Think I will get some tests private for me to check if it’s gonna be a long wait. It’s knowing where to spend the money when you’re not sure how much it’s going to cost you!

They said max 7 working days for DHs results and today is 6th day. So GPS should get them back any time. It’s just how long DH waits to speak to GP. But I will get him to ask if he can have a print out of results whilst he waits to speak to GP

@Indianna2006 I think if it comes back normal, you have so much chance of conceiving in the next few months. Fingers crossed. We were told 3 months plus, and she used the words, 'could be significantly longer due to covid backlog'...

I think our plan is to wait another 6 weeks and retest. I am in the process of booking to see Mr Ramsay around the end of march.

@FlyOnTheWall89 will you retest privately?

Tbh I almost expect DHs tests to not come back normal. He’s had a lot go on the past few years, high stress. But is healthy otherwise. Never smokes. Hardly drinks. Healthy weight etc etc.

I deff have hope we can conceive in the normal year time frame. But if it goes beyond that I don’t know at what point you move to more invasive. Think it’s hard if all seems okay and it’s unexplained.

Like I don’t have time to try naturally for 2 years just hoping it works when it clearly isn’t working! Lol

The waiting is horrible isn’t it. And suspect now for you almost feels pointless trying. But it isn’t. Stranger things happen.

Good idea to get things booked in tho. I keep hearing ppl mention about Dr Ramsey. He sounds like a sperm expert 😁😁

@FlyOnTheWall89 3 months plus ugh. It’s when it gets to 4/5 months. That’s so many goes for me.

I can’t wait that long to find an answer or solution so we will deff start paying and going private. But will wait and get a rough time frame first. Or if DH has normal results I’ll instantly panic and think we’ll it must be me!

@Indianna2006 I don't know, doesn't really matter I guess, it is a fairly inexpensive test. It would be nice not to wait 2 weeks again though, that is for sure.

A problem, as long as it isn't a huge one, will probably just mean it might take longer... but wont necessarily mean you'll need IVF. It is so tricky to decide when to start paying for it. One thing I have noticed is that all the success stories I've read about when people decide to go for IVF, is that no one mentions how bad the process is, or how much it costs... they are just incredibly grateful for their baby/pregnancy. I guess the pain, process and payments are forgotten when you get the result you've longed for. x

@Indianna2006 @FlyOnTheWall89 it's really hard to know what to do. I'm kind of banking on this app with Dr Ramsey giving us some answers. We will retest DH probably in 8 weeks time, or maybe Dr Ramsey will want us to retest with him which will only be 5 weeks on from the recent SA so might not be much difference. Or maybe he will diagnose variocele which would need an op. Prob all add up to the cost of IVF at that point!

I'm just trying to tell myself that I will somehow be pregnant by the end of 2022 🤞🏼 and that's kind of getting me through.

Hi @OK92 - haha I feel just the supplements are adding up to nearly IVF cost and you don't really know if they are making an impact for months. I completely agree, I think that by the end of this year, we will be pregnant so I too have that in my mind. x

@OK92 @FlyOnTheWall89 🤞🏼🤞🏼

On either of your semen analysis results did it determine what the volume was that was produced?

Worried that DH produced a low volume if u now compare what was in the pot which didn’t seem like much at all to what I capture in my fertility. And obv know the volume therefore determines how much total count you get.
Like 20 million sperm per ml is normal. But if you produce 4ml volume that’s 80mil sperm. But if volume is low is only 1ml. That’s only 20mil.

Did your volume make up a lot of the count?

@Indianna2006 yes the volume was stated and was way above average but obvs low count for us so really the volume probs doesn't matter... its is what is inside the volume that counts. Presumably if volume is low though, that will have an impact.

@FlyOnTheWall89 thanks that’s helpful. Yes I think DHs volume wasn’t great for sample. Although I’m certain it isn’t always an issue but if he’s in the lower side and frequent ejaculation lowers it. Then sex every day could hinder again. Even if count is good per ml.

It’s so bloody confusing isn’t it 😂 how many different parameters can affect it.
Feel like I’m just waiting to hear results. But I imagine the volume wasn’t great so unless he has amazing sperm per ml 😂 not sure what I can do with that.

@OK92 I was watching a seminar about male fertility and semen analysis from our local fertility clinic which is where we will go if we go for private treatment.

And interestingly the urologist giving the webinar said some men with high sperm concentration but lower motility may still have normal amounts of moving sperm.

That they mainly looked at total motile count which was most important factor. And if it’s over 20 million then they consider the male fertile.

So for example with your DH if his count is so high and his motility lower it might still equal out as over 20 million motile sperm.

the calculation was:
Total count x motility divided by 100.

Wasn’t sure if you had heard that anywhere or been told that. But it’s what my local fertility clinic will assess likelihood of pregnancy by. Especially if morphology is fine in your case.

figured might be relevant to you as your partner therefore might still have normal total motile count and therefore pregnancy still just as likely so thought I’d mention it ☺️

@Indianna2006 interesting! I'm still mind boggled that we have had no proper explanation to the results we had. Have you got the results yet? X

@FlyOnTheWall89 I know that’s what I thought. When he was explaining it… Made sense tho.

For example:
100 million count
25% motility so below normal parameter (technically therefore abnormal SA)
Equals 25 million motile sperm

50 million count
50 percent motility. Both parameters normal whereas above wasn’t.
But still equals 25 million motile sperm.

But yet one mens would be normal and one abnormal. Hence he said. Doesn’t always quite work like that. The top guy we would say is still perfectly fertile.

That’s how it was explained. He said total motile was most important. Not count or motility on its own. But it doesn’t give you that number on results. You’d need to do that calculation.

Nope!! No results yet. They said 7 days maximum and that’s tomorrow. So expecting to hear soon at least from Drs surgery to book in with GP. Meh. So annoying waiting for everything isn’t it.

Just trying arm myself with info so if we can get print out I understand what I’m looking at.

@Indianna2006 that's really interesting! I rechecked DH results and he had count 164mill, 17% progressive so supposedly over 27mill motile. Why aren't they reaching the egg though 😭

@OK92 ahh that’s good news!! I was thinking it might be the case for you. So if it’s above 20 million then a fertility specialist would most likely class him fertile. Like his high count makes up for the less motility. Cos technically he had more of then than other guys etc.

I actually think you go on total motile aswell. Not just forward progressive. So amount would be even higher.

It might just take some time hun. So all is not lost. I think likelihood you will be pregnant within a year is high.

So try not stress too much on the motility. Obv try vitamins etc to get it up. But I certainly think he’s able to get you pregnant with that Total Motile Count.

Which is good news!

@Indianna2006 fingers crossed. For all of us! Very ready for this TTC stage to come to an end. Had a dream last night I was pregnant 🤦🏻‍♀️

@OK92 @Indianna2006 so ready for it to be over 😂. Just want to be pregnant now, and I know we have a long wait.

Thanks for explaining hun - let us know when you get them x

I am so disappointed this morning and would love some advice.

I have been looking forward (sort of) to having an HSG on Day 10 of my cycle, in the hopes it would shed some light on what might be happening.

I've just called to book, to be told the nurse running the clinic that day is off for half term, so there will be no clinic. They only run the clinic one morning a week, so offered me the following week, when I will be CD17.

This of course means - a wasted cycle, as CD17 is after ovulation.

I am pushing 40 and do not have the time to waste a month of trying!

So these are my options:

1. Have HSG on CD17 and accept a missed month
2. Pay £550 to have private HSG on Day 10 (or 7, or 8, or 9...)
3. Roll the dice to see what day of my March cycle the clinic runs. It may fall pre-ovulation, it may not.

I am gutted, absolutey gutted. Would love some advice please.

@Decaffe oh so sorry. It’s so annoying when stuff doesn’t fall right. As each week and month seems a lifetime.
I think I’d go for the HSG on day 17 and miss a cycle rather than pay out. At least then you may get some answers. And I’m sure I’ve heard lots of people say after HSG they were told to avoid that cycle. Due to the dye etc.

My swabs for fertility referall had an issue so I’ve got to go again and wait 2 weeks to do that and then wait for results. So be another 3 weeks before Docter can do my referall now.

Aghhh so bloody annoying. I waited 4 weeks for them and for results. Ffs.

Thank you @Indianna2006 for your post all this waiting around really does suck

I called some local private clinics and either a) they had stopped offering HSG and only offer HyCoSy (which I don’t want), or b) the only appointment slots they could offer me were after ovulation anyway.

I think rolling the dice that the clinic days will align with my pre-ovulation days next month is too risky and so I have decided to go for the NHS HSG on Day 17 and simply accept that we will not be able to TTC this month. I intend to have all the alcohol, all the essential oils in my baths, and all my favourite strong coffee over the next four weeks!

@Indianna2006 how are you getting on? Did you get DH results back? Hope all went ok with them if so!

@FlyOnTheWall89 hope all is ok with you too!

I am still in TWW but not holding out much hope 🤷🏻‍♀️