The Elderberry Pavlovas: Hanging up our fertility crystals, relaying the Yellow Brick Road and chasing that chopper. We want our BFPs and we want them now! (Thread 22)

[happylass]

The smallprint –
Berries have a strict entrance criteria (TTC #1, over 30, TTC for 12+ months, NO instadiffers, must have a special pot and definitely no mention of baby dust or baby dancing).
Those not abiding by the rules may be escorted from the premises.

Chloe that is terrible. Maybe they do things differently there but there is a UK leaflet on screening that can be downloaded from here: www.leicestermaternity.nhs.uk/screening/

Cor chloe that's a bit quick off the mark and brutal. Perhaps that's the way it's done in your country. I was over 35 & done IVF but the options were talked through very sensitively and we chose nuchal fold test, with the option later to do cvs/amino if needed. It just seems a bit knee jerk. I would ask on the copter thread as a few ladies have probably already had these tests so could help. Thanks for your lovely comments too.

Ooh jellie how lovely to be whisked away! Tell us all when you get back!! I think some baby making will be a taking place- bom chicka wom wom!!

You've summed it up well there nolly. I think the frustration and lack of control and uncertainty is hard. Also the fact that it's seemingly so easy for everyone else! I think re the bringing you closer together, I think if you're strong anyway it will but if there are cracks it'll just drive things further apart. A make or break & a when the going gets tough the tough get going sort of thing.

Hello hb. Ooh, fall sounds nasty, hope you're ok.

tiger I think you've had most things done. What about amh/ ovarian reserve testing- it's a private blood test but not expensive, I think about £50. Also I've heard about vitamin d testing, possibly you could ask about that as a deficiency can affect fertility.

rain so glad you had a lovely w/e with your friends. So funny how our issues with ttc can make us suspicious. A w/e like that just makes you feel refreshed and like yourself again. Sometimes I think it would be nicer to go back in time and be the me that was before ttc, I didn't really have any cares, always having a laugh etc. None of this crap!! Not long til Mauritius!!

Hope inset went ok today happy and winging it worked!! We're expecting an inspection too. Today was ok for me , apart from people's conversation openers of did you have a good holiday....!! I said ok to one colleague and she said 'only ok' so I told her and got a bit emotional, she was lovely and gave me a big hug. She's going to help divert attention when the baby talk gets too much.feels good to have someone to back me up. Also told my head who was lovely about it and I did say I was feeling a bit wobbly and he said he would do whatever he could to keep stress down and to help.

Hi berries! I wrote a massive post at the weekend, then because I had no signal and the wifi was shit it wouldn't post and I lost it! Arghh. Thanks for the anniversary wishes too, we had a lovely time away but extra depressed now! Anyway trying to catch up again now! Here goes..

Lumen your next IVF cycle sounds like it will take you nicely to Christmas, and hopefully it will be the cycle for you. Was laughing my head off at the thought of a weightlifiting baby for wild also your ice cream sounds lush!

Pip all of the luck in the world for you next cycle. Hopefully your dream was right but maybe with a later date!

Rain that's so annoying about the locum, I wouldn't have bothered either they usually just send you back to your usual GP. Re your thyroid test can you not get a phone number from the HCA website? That's a long wait to get a simple result. Especially when thyroid can fluctuate too. Am totally jel of Kate bush and Mauritius. My cousin saw Kate bush last week and said she was amazing.

Jellie happy 40th! Have an amazing birthday and surprise party! Hope the face is coming along well! Fx the bleeding is Cyril doing one. How exciting about being whisked away! Your dh is really pulling out all of the stops eh! Enjoy every minute.

Bushy yep I get that with other peoples kids and incidentally my dh did a similar speech last night. Hmm. Anyway fx for you that everything has gone by your next appointment and hope you've managed school ok today, it sounds like things have been getting on too of you . Not trying is definitely depressing, I think at least when we can try there's a glimmer of hope!

Wild those thyroid results sound like a potential problem, hopefully the consultant will suggest something helpful for you.

Tiger you are spot on about the road thing, that's exactly what it's like. Your bestie sounds lovely and considerate too. Sounds like you had a lovely day with her. Re your tests maybe thyroid? You've had a pretty comprehensive list so far so I'm not sure what else you could have. Good luck for your appointment and let us know how you get on.

Happy welcome back! And good luck for starting icsi! I hope getting back to school wasn't too awful for you as well.

HB hello! Hope you're ok and sorry to hear you had a fall.

Nolly you're def right about the lack if control. What an awful thing to happen to your friend too.

Chloe what an insensitive lady! Hope you're ok. Def head to the chopper as they can advise you much better.

Hope everyone else is ok for a Monday!

Sorry missed the last page! Bushy it sounds like you have a decent boss and lovely colleague there, hopefully that will make work a little easier for you at least.

Does the amh test tell you what fsh/Lh don't? Is it standard before IVF on the NHS does anyone know?

Rain that is a shocking wait for thyroid blood test results. Mine take only a few days. Get onto whoever took them and ask for the results asap or for a new test to be done pronto. Tests get mislabelled, forgotten, put in the wrong bottle..... Chase it up.

tiger your thyroid doesn't sound too bad, but it's worth asking. I warn you though that the NHS is pretty poor with thyroid treatment in general. If you need any more info let me know. With the thyroid antibodies (these are the things I've just found out are very high in my case) the NHS does not routinely test for these afaik. The NHS insists that the TSH test tells you everything you need to know. I don't agree with that though. chloe is right that a thyroid diagnosis and treatment can be life changing. It was for me and now I'm evangelical about it.

bushy sadly I think you are absolutely right that TTC hard times can also pull your relationship apart. each situation and each couple is unique.

jellie happy, happy birthday. Enjoy all the lovely treats.

Courage! to all the teacher berries.

Happy birthday jellie! Keep working on your face and enjoy being whisked away, my dh has never done that either, I live in hope.

beaky the amh tests are not std on the nhs and not all FC will do them without you paying. I had mine done as part of a research pjt that I took part in for my FC last time.

bushy really glad your colleague and head will be there to support you

Hi to everyone else, am struggling to get motivation today to get up! Am working from home otherwise would already be at my desk in London, currently still in bed

Can tell that AF is on her merry way as feeling really sad this evening. Feel like I am a failure, I am failing at the one thing all women should be able to do, I am failing to become a mother, failing to make my dh into the amazing father I know he would be, failing my parents, PIL and grandparents. I have never failed before in life and now maybe this is my lesson

Sorry to be all about me and so down but I try so hard to be positive most of the time and not let things like our failed IVF get to me but sometimes it is all too much and thankfully I have you ladies who might understand how I am feeling as none if my friends with their perfect (from my view) families would get it.

Ok 'woe is me' rant ended.

Aww Lumen you are definitely not failing. Sorry you are so down, hugs and for you tonight. This gets us all at times so feel free to rant away whenever you need to but try and be kind to yourself because you don't deserve any extra shit. Remember Feathers mantra, your time will come. Hugs in the meantime though.

Aw lumen I can totally empathise with you and the feelings of failure and sending you a massive hug. It isn't a failure on your part though, it is just deeply unfair. Your turn will come, I'm sure of it. In the meantime, it is also ok to get upset sometimes, so don't beat yourself up. I am also terribly prone to the pre-af sadness, it is how I know for sure I'm not pg each month, which just adds to general misery. It sounds as though you're a person who copes, and worries about other's happiness, but making your whole extended family happy by having a baby isn't your responsbility, it is the happy bi-product of you having your baby. beaky is right, be kind to yourself, and use Berry HQ as a place to let off steam as much as you need. x

Happy Birthday Jellie! Hope you've had a great day.

chloe hope you're feeling better. Sounds as though the clinic were being really insensitive and also inconsistent about the risks.

bushy sounds like you have good support at work and useful to have a colleague who has your back when the baby talk gets too much!

Thanks for the suggestions. My FC appointment was ok. I forgot to ask half the questions I had planned, because they surprised me by saying that they will refer us for IVF. I had expected to wait another year + as our two year ttc anniversary isn't until December, and I had already told them this and been advised that it was a three years ttc before IVF. Now I wish I had asked about further diagnostic tests and other issues but I was too shell-shocked to talk (which NEVER happens). We were also offered IUI but the registrar couldn't really advise on whether to go for that first as he wasn't from the assisted conception unit, so he is making the referral for IVF and we'll go from there.

Not sure how I feel about it all. Mentally I was preparing for a much longer wait, and as everyone does, I thought this would happen naturally for us. Definitely feeling somewhat conflicted.

Aw lumen for you. You are not a failure for sure. It is very hard to not be in control of the outcome of this TTC business. If you've always succeeded before when you wanted to then it is tough to accept that this time you don't have much influence over what happens. The choice is taken away from you. Trying harder just won't do it. As beaky said it is just unfair and random. Not your fault though. You are bearing the strain the best you can and trying to be cheerful, what more can you do.

Glad the FC consultation went well tiger . Great news on the IVF being sooner than you thought. I know what you mean about feeling in two minds about getting treatment. It's not what anyone would choose for themselves but I'm sure you will soon accept that this is the way ahead now and maybe get a bit excited.

Aw wise words from the berries. Tiger just thinking, will the ACU maybe give you the option of extra tests? Also my FC redid all of my bloods and dh's sa when I first went in for my IVF referral as it was about 5 months since the most recent ones. Also because they had to be done at the start of my cycle I had to wait a further cycle for this! The time really mounts up quickly and I'd think by the time you get to actually do IVF/iui you will be well prepared for it. (I still have wobbles like!) hugs and to you and Lumen tonight.

Thx berries, what would I do without you lot?

tiger I remember being in shock at our appointment when we were referred for IVF. The only tests we had done were day 3/21 bloods and the sa and their conclusion was straight to IVF. We are still however in the unexplained category. It took a while to get my head around it but then decided it was my best shot at completing my family so I did lots of research and embraced it. Let us know if you have any questions as I'm sure there are a number of us on here who can help you.

The FC consultant phoned me about the high levels of thyroid antibodies from my recent tests. He said that this is what is killing off my thyroid gland and causing the hypothyroidism, which makes sense.

His suggestion is to carry on as before, go for IUI and only do for further tests for immune issues if (when) we go for IVF. The FC had already suggested IUI because DH was more able to get his head around that approach rather than going straight to IVF.

I personally feel convinced that immune issues are my problem. It's my gut instinct but it could be wrong. High thyroid antibodies are a 50 - 50 indicator for other immune issues, so there is that.

I sort of feel that IUI will be a waste of money and time if we have not ruled out the immune thing.

Not sure what to do. Plus AF is due this weekend. Hmmm, musing...

lumen you're not a failure. It's not that our lives are sad, just that there is a sad thing in them. And (in all likelhood) a temporary one which will ultimately make us better and nicer parents. Big hug xxx

am in the middle of weirdest week ever (in 3rd city today, 3/6 for this week) so will just sat hallo for now to everyone and will catch up on the weekend x

Very quiet in here tonight!

Wild are you private rather than NHS? Pardon my ignorance but how do the thyroid issues affect your fertility? Would he prescribe you steroids (I think you mentioned that before as a way of dealing with immune issues) while you keep trying to see if that helps? Or am I totally off here? Sorry I don't know much about this area.

lumen and Tiger how are you both tonight?

How's everyone else? Or should I say where?! Hope you teacher berries are managing in your first week back.

You ladies are so good at summing up the feelings and saying really poignant things - nolly's our lives aren't sad, they just have a sad thing and the advice about tiger's advice about not feeling responsible for having a baby to make other's happy and it should be a by product and so many others. lumen I can identify with what you're saying, esp the trying to stay positive part. I think it's only natural to feel a bit down about it, esp when an Ivf cycle hasn't worked. I've experienced the failure emotion part recently. Just had this feeling that I failed, I couldn't sustain this pg. when I was pg my dh would say to me I'm really proud of what you're doing in there. I haven't said this to him but I think he can't be proud now and clearly I wasn't doing such a great job. ( of course he would never think this, it's just my negativity colouring things).I loved that affirmation, it was like our little secret. I felt positive and like things were going forward. I feel the opposite now..stagnant. Perhaps that's rose tinted glasses of how that time was and exaggeration of how things are now. But you're not a failure lumen, neither am I, It's just a bit harder for us. I love what nolly said about it making us kinder, nicer parents.

It is quiet in here! It has been a busy day, I'm shattered.

I'm good thanks beaky. Gotten over my shock of the IVF referral. Think I am going to get in touch with the ACU and ask them about doing a cycle of IUI prior to IVF. I've also decided that we'll probably try and time IVF around March/April time, which works well for various committments and work issues. How are you doing? How much more of the pill do you need to take before you get scanned again?

thanks lumen I'm sure I'll have questions galore! Hope you're feeling better today.

wild it seems to me to that if you have potential immune issues then the next step should be further tests, rather than IUI and then tests after that otherwise you could be wasting your time. Can you ask for further testing beforehand. That is what worries me about moving on to IVF, thinking about whether have I been checked for enough potential causes of infertility before embarking on full on fertility treatment.

nolly hope your weird week is going ok.

bushy a big hug for you today. I'm sure your DH is more proud of you then ever, because you are getting through this tough time together.

Only two more days to get through before holidays!

Bushy I'm sure your dh is even more proud of you now, you have coped amazingly well. How's school been?

Tiger that sounds like a good plan, at least you'll have as much info as possible for the IVF round. They may even be able to get you in for iui earlier as it's less involved. I finish my pill pack this weekend! It's only 21 days, who knew! I had the implant til about 4 yrs ago then haven't used contraception since (should have probably cottoned on when I didn't "accidentally" get pg back then!). Hopefully AF will arrive next week sometime then I can go in for a scan to see if it's all clear. Fx, I feel like I can't get this effing iui off the ground!

bushy the others are right. I'm sure your DH is proud of how courageous you are through all this.

tiger yes that is my thinking too; knowledge is power.

Any Berries who have had IUI previously, could you please tell us what the FC learned from it? Is it a a bit of a diagnostic tool as well which gives you some idea of what is going on in your body?

Whoop, whoop to those going on holiday! + I'm looking forward to some surprise holiday BFPs.

Wild it's shown me that I have follicular or luteal cysts every month (which indicates I'm not ovulating I think) and so they are trying to get rid of these so I can start injecting with gonal-f, which will then show me how I respond to the drugs and dosage etc. hope that helps a little!

I had a weird dream last night, I was out with a friend and did a pg test which was positive, it was a cb so it told me I was 6 weeks(!) and each time you pressed the button it gave you some different information in your pregnancy I obviously knew in my dream I couldn't be because of taking the pill so I woke up upset and totally devastated! oh well!

Hey ladies. Thanks for the hand holding and also for the link bunni, was useful reading.

Hope you're feeling better lumen, please don't be so hard on yourself! I very much felt the same as you though at times. I have the view that you can achieve most things that you want in life if you work hard enough at it, but ttc ain't one of them which can be a bitter pill to swallow. Just remember that the baby you have will be all the more precious for the long and hard road you took to get there.

tiger That's good news that you can go ahead sooner than expected. I can imagine it messes with your head a bit though when you'd accepted you had another year to wait. Zita West says that IVF chances are better in the spring / summer so maybe starting in March / April is a good thing!

wfm Can't help re the killer antibodies (hopefully they're not as scary as they sound!). I agree it would be a good idea to look into it first before going for IUI. I haven't had IUI, but discussed it when deciding whether to go for that or IVF. It should give you an indication of how you respond to the stims - they give you a much lower dose as they only want you to produce 1-2 eggs in IUI, but I guess it means they have a better idea of the dose needed for IVF. The first go can be a bit of guesswork so I guess IUI helps in that respect.

Hi to everyone else, seems quiet around here!

Thank you for those IUI thoughts beaky and chloe . It's interesting to hear what experiences you've had.

Haha! The killer antibodies are not actually James Bond style assassins chloe , but your immune system can affect TTC if it interprets the embryo as a foreign body and attacks it. The FC consultant explained that your immune system has to sort of die down a bit around the time of conception so that your body accepts what is basically foreign matter. It's obvious really, but I'd never heard it before. Anyhow.

Spring time is best for IVF success! Who knew.

I'm wiped out tonight so off for a bath then bed.

It is quiet round here. Far too much work or holiday prep going on I think!

Well went to hospital today and they did a preg test and I'm now not pregnant. This is ironically a relief!! There was a little bit of blood in the urine ( yuck! I couldn't see it) and I have got small bits of browny purple blood but now down to panty liners- praise The Lord! She says this is probably just a bit of inflammation where placenta was attached and should go pretty quickly. We should still wait a week before dtd ( poor dh, over 5 weeks and no sex!!) but because I don't see the point in waiting she said to go for it and enjoy ourselves. Not to get hung up on ov testing etc but to just have an enjoyable sex life and you'll be relaxed and it might happen- there you go ladies, chuck those ov tests away and 'enjoy' yourselves. Maybe this advice is worth a pop? I am actually just going to have sex because I want to and because it's been a long time I think it will be nice. it's weird not having sex, turned into a bit of a nun!!

The nurse was lovely and asked how I was. I said about the emotions and she said best to let it out, don't bury it away as otherwise it comes out in the good times and you can't enjoy the good times. She said it's totally normal and understandable but it will get better but it's just very sad.

I was really cross earlier having to be back at the hospital, running the gauntlet of pg women, new born babies, prams- they're just everywhere! I came home and cried. It's like this deep upset that comes out. I'm wobbly anyway, what with being back at work and I seem to have anxiety- feel like I'm not good enough, bored and not interested in anything, not enthused by work and there's a lot of new things we have to plan for and people looking to me for answers- just feel like I haven't got any. I do quite regularly feel this way ( miscarriage aside) and just need to learn to deal with it. I wondered earlier whether I do need to see a counsellor but then again I'm so fretful I'm not sure I could explain myself that well. I think being able to have sex again and not bleed will make me feel normal. I was going to try and pour it all out in a little notebook I have but then thought I haven't got the energy. Do any of you ladies bother with a journal? I used to sometimes write in one if I was particularly upset but tonight I thought I'd prefer to spend the time talking to my berries! I suppose this is a sort of diary for us. Anyway enough navel gazing!

We get to see our fc consultant next weds, I'm looking forward to hearing what she has to say and what the plan might be.

Apart from a prickly feeling of stress on one day, school hasn't been too bad but tbh my heart isn't in it. Only natural I suppose, my yoga teacher who had a miscarriage said you'll hate your job, even if you liked it before because it wasn't in the plan to be there that long. Class are nice and my new TA, who I was really worried about working with, has been good and got on with everything passed her way. There is sooo much planning to do though, it's awful!

Springtime good for the birds and bees so maybe that's why??! Still ours was May and although it subsequently didn't work out, it was positive to start. Maybe the sunshine helps and people's health and mood are generally better.

Sorry I meant we'll wait another week but that I'm not waiting til a period or longer as I feel like I'd just like to be normal and the idea of not trying is just anathema to someone with fertility problems. I don't feel anxious about getting pg again, which is why some people might not be ready to try again or that they might still be grieving.

Good that you got the right result today at last bushy grr to pg women when you could just frankly do without them. I think it is perfectly normal and understandable that you feel weepy. You lost something precious and you are grieving. It is important to let it out in the way which feels best for you. And yes yes to having sex for enjoyment. Sounds like it might do you both good!!

I have kept a journal over the years, I don't write in it regularly but rather use it to work things through when I need to. I do find it helpful, it can be a good way of letting things out actually. It's true that this is a sort of diary too but with added berries.

Yes, we are private btw beaky - DH has grown up DCs so we don't get anything on the NHS.

We've just had posh Aberdeen Angus burgers for tea and they were fantastic. Next time anyone is feeling down I recommend posh burgers. I did fill the kitchen with smoke though, so much so that my eyes were stinging and I had tears running down my face

Hope all teacher berries had a good first week back.