TTC for 10+ months, part 8

[eurochick]

A friendly, supportive thread for those taking a blooming long time to conceive!

It is kind of irritating how previously normal friends take to posting nothing but kid related stuff once they get pregnant. It's almost as if their lives as individual people has ended and they have become nothing but so-and-so's parents.

rabbit A bowtie? I think the thing with Clomid is that you don't know how it will affect you until you try it. I think of it as the marijuana of fertility treatment - a gateway drug before moving on to the 'hard stuff'! The fact that the cons does stringent monitoring sounds great, though. At least someone would be keeping a close eye on you. Would they give you a trigger shot too? That made all the difference for me (between not oving and oving) but then I haven't been oving on my own since coming off BCP. Anyway - I haven't found the Clomid to be too bad - maybe I am more moody, and I haven't had much EWCM - but it's hard to know how much of that is just me and how much is the drug. If you do take it, take it just before you go to bed so you're sleeping when it hits your bloodstream.

mrsd aargh about woman in bank. How bloody rude. People have no idea.

lemon that's fantastic that your scar is healing and that you're in jeans! What a champ.

artemis I know of two friends who claim to have caught crabs from hotel sheets. I second princess's advice to complain and get moved out of there!

joyce how infuriating about the couple and how completely ridiculous of them not to drink. Grrr. What I don't understand is how someone could agree to be a surrogate using their own eggs - carry a baby and give birth and then give it over to another couple - don't they usually make sure that the surrogate does not provide the egg? Obviously surrogates are amazing, but that does seem like an unusual situation.

princess love the nest comment. Like euro I am sure that you will have a chick soon!

teu sorry you're feeling low. Thinking of you.

euro yes yes on the 'boymen'. I was talking to my mum about this and she said that she thought the genie was out of the bottle in terms of men settling down - that a lot of men have never wanted to settle down, but in the past they had to because if you wanted to have sex, you had to get married as there was so much social stigma attached to having a baby out of wedlock - but now there is the pill, there's no reason to settle down earlier. My mum is quite conservative on this sort of thing (and I'm glad I didn't end up with my first tosspot boyfriend) but I did see her point. I remember reading on here once about fertility being a 'shared finite resource' and thinking that it'd be great if more men thought about that. Probably bringing my own issues in here (DH took a while to ask me to get married and agree to start trying) but eh.

Waves to purple, pout, carrie and everyone else.

mrsd my facebook is just the same. It's our time of life. Everyone is sprogging, just like there was a rush of weddings a while back.

Grr @ the woman at the bank. That was incredibly thoughtless.

I agree about IVF. Most people don't realise it has a 30-40% success rate and isn't some magical way to get an instant baby whim.

rabbit and Critter Mr euro was a bit of a boy man and took a while to be ready to ttc. I met Mr euro when I was 27 but to begin with netiher of us wanted to settle down. And then around 30/31 I started to get broody. We actually broke up briefly over it. He came back, saying he did want a family but not just then. I was about to dump him when I approached my 34th birthday, because I didn't think he would ever be ready. I was planning on doing it at the end of that month. On the eve of my birthday he popped the questions, we got married 8 months later and started trying a couple of months after that when the malaria drugs were out of our system from the honeymoon. To look at me, I probably fit the profile of someone who has put it off for career reasons (I'm pretty career focussed and work all hours when needed, etc) but actually, I didn't want marriage and babies in my 20s and then in my 30s had to wait for my partner to be ready. Grrrr. I do sometimes wonder what would have happened if we had started at 31, but try to put it out of my mind- that way madness lies!

MissM I know exactly what you mean. Picture of baby or child for profile photo on FB? Username on fora of mummytoxxxxx? What is all that about? Do these people have no identity of their own now you have sprogged?

I was so infuriated my grammar went to pot at the end there!

I can't even think about the " why we've started so late" as I'll start blaming myself. And my hobbles. But mostly Mr Nelly. And I don't feel that's a good idea. I'll just blame my glittering career .

I suspect my FB friends get rather fed up. They are usually "cute hobble" or weather related. I don't do anything interesting usually. But I hereby promise not to commit any of the cardinal momeee sins if I ever get upduffed.

I have taken 2 hours out of my day for a non-work meeting so better go and catch up. General waves.

Rabbit I can only give you my account but before I do I would still say give it a try, if you don't like it then stop.
I haven't had any of the bad moods that I was warned about, I feel down at times but no more now than before. The hot flushes were bad, I thought it would be on the five days I took them but it was worse after ovulation. I have got used to the hot flushes and they are mainly at night. For me its the ovulation pain. I ended up in A n E last time. I had NO monitoring at all so you have that too. I took two months worth and I am waiting for it to come out of my system and hoping its soon as the sickness and runs are driving me insane. I also had really sore nipples!
It didn't work for me but I was already ovualting every month before then. I am back on Monday to tell him to take his meds far away.
As much as I hated it I would still say its up to you and anything is worth a go.

rabbit a bowtie, somehow I'm not surprised.
I never tried because I was never given a coherent reason to do so, at least he has tried that.

oh purple yes of course - think i must have blocked out the dermoid story after looking at a piccy!

euro - you're very brave watching the coloscopy on screen! So is that it now for your immune treatment or will you go back on to it or is that inadvisable after the lesion removal?
And thankfully I heard they were going to do a report on women over 40 having babies and promptly switched off. I get sick of hearing about it.

mrsd- it wsa definitely the first go of turkey basting. They have been very open about when it was all kicking off . All their friends knew the date. I asked whether the surrogate will be involved and they said she'll be a part of their lives but not a constant. I find it all very odd to be honest but this woman has had loads of kids of her own and has been surrogate about 4 times.
And what a cow that bank woman was. I honestly would complain. That is totally unprofessional and she should be told so. You cannot go round judging people like that. Gees what is wrong with people.
On another note - stay away from FB!!. Even reading those posts makes me feel sick and I don't know these people. I will never go back to FB even if the miracle happens. But I was guilty of the whole look at me on my honeymoon, at my wedding, here i am with my hubby etc etc. It wasn't conscious or to make people who weren't married feel bad but thinking about it, it was kind of like a proud and narcissitic thing I guess. I am too self aware now and how advertising my happiness could make other people feel.

lemon - it is so unfair isn't it. I am terrified of hospitals and anaesthetics, yet i will be going in and begging for a lap. It's a difficult one to get your head around. Sorry you are feeling so emotional about it. I'm enjoying your updates though. #

rabbit - a bow tie?? He sounds about 80. I guess he likes advertising himself as god in the hospital. I would be inclined to agree with you and see what the next few cycles bring up and go for it naturally before intense monitoring. Are you temping? It may be worth doing it just to see whether you are ovulating. I wasn't too bad on clomid. A bit grumpy {nothing new there} and a few hot flushes but i was pretty unaffected really.

missmedus - i do agree about how 'normal' friends change and all they can do is talk kids. One of my friends says she doesn't want it to define her but clearly it does by the way she talks!

critter - you can have gestational surrogates which are used by the likes of Nicole Kidman and SJP. That is where the woman and the surrogate undergo ivf. This woman used her own eggs and will utimately be her biological child. This will be used by gay men I guess and women who have no eggs or womb . Apparently this woman is very removed from the fact that these are her eggs and she will never see them as her children. It's difficult to getyour head around i agree.

Righty hooo, hope every one has a good evening.

artemis at the state of your hotel room

purple good luck for tomorrow :)

lemon and joycep It took Mr B a few days to recover from his GA, that night he was so groggy and fainted, the next day he slept most of it and then after that he kept having naps, he wasn't really himself for about 5 days. It can really take it out of you joycep you definitely want a bit of time off work lemon Mr B had lots of gas issues no difference really

joycep That totally creeped and freaked me out not the turkey baster nut the not drinking because we're pregnant < makes heaving noises> what did they say when you said they were ridiculous??, a turkey baster is cheaper than IUI

rabbit super big hugs, you are not barren, just reproductively challenged at the moment, so no more using the nasty 'B' word, I think critter is right about different reactions to drugs, I took Tamoxifen and found it ok, a little tearful

medusa fingers crossed for you, its time that lazy chubby finger did some work

euro how are you?? I missed the programme, just shows hoe ignorant/arrogant some people are, I will now officially be a 40 year old mum unless I get updiffed this cycle and the baby is 19 premature

mrsd I used to work near Harrods and they used to get such beautiful cats and they had Bengal kittens in, I think one of my physio's mum breeds them. i too love all things kitty wise, what a rude cow!!! at the matching posh undies oh and I'll be your FB friend, I have a few from places like this :)

critter are you on clomid again this cycle??

teu big hugs sorry you are feeling low

I'm glad there are some other anal re tentative people on here I also agree Bio Oil is good, I have patients who swear by it, I got Mr B some, he looked up on Google and it said not to put anything on the scar for 6 weeks not much to report really,one of my colleagues was feeling a bit low so it was nice to be able to offer her a shoulder to cry on instead of it usually being the other way round, I got her some flowers so hopefully that will at least cheer her up for a little

waves to everyone

Talking of fb posts I have woke to one complaing about lack of sleep due to pregnancy and asking how long it will last. She is 6 weeks!

rabbit I was thinking about you this morning and the 3 options given by the cons. Sorry you had to piss on a stick on doctors orders, and not get the desired outcome. That's tough.

Thanks for the words of support re Friday the 13th appointment, lemon joy princess and buzzy. It really does help. And yes princess private of course. One would hope that leads to getting treated like a princess but in my experience that cannot be relied upon. We'll see, full report to follow.

Morning to all..btw Joyce still in shock re the gay booze-free updiff situation.

Warning: much mentalling going on today (plus it's raining).

Bad news this morning, my temperature dropped again which has sent me spiralling down to that bad place. I thought everything was ok with me now after the operation since last month was a perfect month cycle wise but if I'm not ovulating regularly we have even bigger problems than I thought. What with DH's low motility and me having annovulatory cycles it's looking less and less likely that we can conceive naturally.

Now I know a one off temperature reading doesn't have to mean anything so I probably should postpone total break down until I have a few more days of low temperatures but what would the next step be? I'll probably make an appointment with the gyno for another set of blood tests. I've had 2 done so far but they were done on CD27 and CD7 which I don't think is ideal. Monday would be day 21 so should be a better time for tests regarding ovulation. The only thing I'm aware was out of line was elevated androstendione levels which the operation was supposed to take care of.

I know you ladies are a font of knowledge, if I post my various results, would anyone care to weigh in with an opinion?

I've made an appointment with my gyno for Monday. I needed to get more blood tests done to check the andros levels anyway. I have now given myself a stern talking to and will postpone further mentalling until Monday or at least until tomorrow (if I get another low temperature). No more mentalling today!

Friday 13th - woohoo. Good luck Purple!

Miss medusa- when did you think you had ovulated ? According to TCOYF some people can have a temp drop after ovulation and then it goes up again. What cycle day are you on?

Buzzy - did you find a baster in the kitchen draw? We don't have one!

Miss m - I get a temp drop in the luteal phase occasionally which has led me to frenzied implantation dip mentalling for no reason I read that sleeping with your mouth open can sometimes throw out a low temp too. I crave the day I can burn my thermometer the Mood Dictator.

purple good luck today, I hope he's a good un with no bow tie.

I have done a lot of thinking and crying too actually. I don't want to take clomid yet. My body has had too much bashing around and I want to sit it out a bit longer and see if my cycles revert to normal. I have little faith in it working for me as I am capable of ovulating myself and as yet sperm and egg have not made friends. I'm still spotting today. I could end up with 24 day cycle which isn't too far away and next month it could be better. I'm not ready to throw clomid into the mix. I will think about it later in the autumn and I don't want to take it for six months either. Since yesterday I've had horrible ibs and I swear it's worrying that brings it on, I can't see clomid helping that either. I get so worried to tell the cons I don't want to do it his way but mine. I don't know why. I'm scared maybe that if I don't comply they'll not refer me for ivf or something? He also pointed out that at my age they needed to act fast. Cheers!

I think I OV'd on CD16 which is usually the day I ovulate and today is CD18. It's definitely too early for implantation but I have read something about a fallback rise so there are many different possibilities. I really should know better from past experience not to take any one day temperature too seriously, I just had my heart set on being all perfectly fixed now after the operation. Dealing with DH's fertility problems is enough without throwing mine on top.

I feel better now after having posted (just getting it out seems to relieve the pressure a bit) and have just had coffee with a good friend. I'll see what the gyno says on Monday anyway.

rabbit I completely understand your resistance to wanting to taking clomid. You want your body to right itself and usually our bodies want to right themselves as well. I suppose if you have the time and the patience perhaps it's worth waiting and seeing a bit longer.

rabbit I understand that. I've plastered my own reaction to intervention over this thread! When I took Letrozole I was sceptical that it would do anything for the same reasons as you - I ovulate and my own so the presence of an egg was unlikely to be the problem. I needed to take baby steps towards the bigger guns though, so I gave it a go for 3 months (the cons recommended 6). I had some side effects on it (one cracker of a headache and some hot flushes) but it wasn't too bad really. But I was not in the right place mentally to start IVF and that was a disaster. It is all about being ready. In your situation, I think I would want to see what a few post-op cycles do too. Remember, the dr is only there to advise you - it's your body, your choice. (The one complication with this in the NHS is that the drs control the pursestrings and access to other treatment.)

MissM I'm glad you have an appointment. One random temp really doesn't mean anything.

Good luck for Friday the 13th, Purple.

I am still mentalling about what to do about my situation. The gynae wanted me to have the abnormal cells removed in 3 weeks but I have made an appointment for next week instead to talk about the options (I would have been happy with a phone call but apparently he doesn't do telephone cons). I have read loads of academic papers over the past couple of days and the weight of what I have read suggests you shouldn't treat mild abnormalities as they often regress on their own. So I want to know why he thinks I should be treated now against normal protocol. I also want to talk to him more about the risks of treatment and possible alternatives.

Sorry bout all the mentalling ladies. rabbit I think I would feel and do the same in your shoes. MissM good you have made an appointment, I agree that worrying about his and hers issues is too much to deal with. Hopefully you will get some answers. euro you are smart to follow this up in this manner.

I'd just returned from 'my' doctor who is not a knob. He listened to my tales. Did not offer any magic advice or suggest any tests. He sees me as a 'long term unexplained' who's options are remain doing your thing or give IVF a shot. No surprises there. He didn't push IVF and agreed the odds are not in my favour, he said it's just a choice I could make. He suggested that it's not uncommon for women with a long history of trying without intervention find it a difficult jump to make, that certainly applies to me.

He gave me a smear and a fannycam. My wobble is tilted, I asked him to confirm this (I was told so during a repeat smear when I was a teenager after the first sample didn't have enough cells, never been mentioned since). He said it means nothing 'being within the normal range'. I have a 2.5cm cyst on my left ovary which appears to be a simple cyst, he said he will check it again in 2 months. Right ovary could not be seen on the fannycam deal (!). This is a new one for me but he said it was not unusual and meant no cysts, on a further feel around he said it was there (!).

It seems crazy that doctors are so at ease with the 'explained' deal but no false promises either. Yes, I know my standards are low. I came out none the wiser but no teeth found.

Called lovely Mr Purple to see if I could pick him up a salad for lunch and dropped it to his office on the way home. "So have you just been out for walk?" he says, completely forgetting the appointment. He is a very understanding, caring person but fucked up so I burst into tears in his office and then came home. Was the last outcome I expected. Calm with stranger sticking this and that up my chuff, melt down over salad with man I've know for 15 years. Still could have been worse, I guess.

Congrats on not having another alien purple

I can completely understand keeping it together in front of strangers but letting go with the person you feel most comfortable with. That's the way it should be, we're allowed to let go of those who understand us best because we know that's only one facet of our personality. Good for you for being calm with the doctor.

Argh! Now I'm spotting. WTF!

I guess I could be ovulating today but CD18 is very late for me, I guess it's still possible though or something else isn't right. So much for not mentalling

purple I complete get that reaction. I almost always hold it together when dealing with medical professionals (the IVF waiting room wobble being the exception, but that was drug-induced) and then lose it when I get home. Tuesday with the gynae was a prime example of that. I held it together fine in his office, with difficulty on the train ride home and within 30 seconds of the front door closing behind me was crying like I'd just been told my whole family had been wiped out.

Afternoon all,

MissM Sorry your body is playing silly buggery with you. It's not fair is it? I'm sorry to hear of temp dips and spotting. You will have your answers from your blood test soon, so try and stay focused and positive - despite that being the hardest thing to do. I hope you feel better later on. Big hugs. Make sure you do lots of nice 'treat' things this weekend to stay distracted.

Purple I think it's perfectly normal to break down in front of hubbie. Easy to hide all the shit from the pros. Great news on no new aliens. Really good news! I still haven't looked, I have a bit of a weak stomach. Finding a photographic series of ovulation on tinernet was bad enough. Do you know what you are going to do next? Are you considering IVF at all? Glad to hear your doctor is not a knob makes a change

Euro I always think it's important to hear the options. Sometimes I think the medical profession are a bit gung-ho. And at least if you've had both sides of the coin you can make a rational call yourself. Maybe once your immunity is back up and kicking those cells into touch you won't need the procedure and if you do at least you know that you definitely do. If that makes sense? Still crappy to have to deal with though.

JoyceP are your results back yet?

Carrie massive eye roll at your friend. FGS.

Rabbit I'm sorry to hear of tears. So much to deal with. I think you're right to want to let your body get back to normal. After my first MC, it took a good 3 - 4 months for everything to be regular and for periods to return to normal. After the 2nd MC my period appeared on cue the next month but then for the next 8 months my cycles were between 27 and 32 days, which is strange for me. And then there were the double periods at the beginning of this year, which have taken a good 3 - 4 months to settle down. I'm back on track with cycles being 28 - 30 days now, which feels much more manageable. I'm seeing a 3 - 4 month theme in here, so give your body time. And then if you feel Clomid is needed because things still haven't come back to normal, you can get going in Autumn. And what's a couple of months in this game anyway? I hope you feel better soon xxx

Well in my news. I'm going on holiday next month! Mum and Dad are taking us away as a treat to a well luxury hotel given the stress we've been under TTC and what with the flat sale falling through. As we don't have to move in a hurry they've decided to take us away with them :) This news was broken before the nutritionist appointment, which I went to in a very :) mood and came out feeling . Lots of praise and no telling off for eating strawberries, cream, a tiny piece of chocolate cake and drinking at the wedding on Saturday. In fact, some naughtiness and having fun is highly recommended to keep the old stress levels down. I admitted to struggling with the veg juice so she has suggested doing them Mon, Weds and Fri rather than every day. I am now officially allowed to drink booze in moderation if I fancy it (always). Fresh fruit juice (not concentrate or with added sugar) is allowed at breakfast time with food and I can have goats cheese to see how I get on with some dairy. The rest of the regime still stands (largely no dairy, no sugar, no processed foods etc etc) Plus she has told me to do away with the thermometre, piss sticks and FF and to spend the next couple of months enjoying our anniversary break and holiday, having lots of sex and focusing on intimacy and being loving and stress-free. If we don't get anywhere in a few months I can go back to her to look at the diet again and maybe doing another hair mineral analysis - otherwise that's me signed off! I am over the mooooooooon. I can't wait for a glass of at the cinema tonight. We're going to see an arty flick at the local Picturehouse Cinema where they sell loads of naughty treats and booze. Yes, yes and yeeeeeessssss (to booze, cake is still strictly prohibited or to be had as a rare treat). Oh and now I've got to think about holiday wardrobe too. I'm so glad there are lots of sales on at the moment! How am I supposed to work this afternoon?

Medusa I would have done the same and made an appointment. Maybe you have just ovulated sometimes that causes spotting.
Rabbit im in a similar boat I want to just let my body rest and have more testing not pills without good reason.
Euro I would want to know about alternatives too. I had abnormal smears twice but they went back normal. I had them 6 monthly for a while then yearly and back to 3 yearly with no problems since.
Purple I know what you mean my OH is good but sometimes forgets things like appointments. He's just asked yesterday when our next one is for time off work and its Monday!
I normally hold together while at appointments but cried at my GP this week and have a feeling I will at the hospital. Sick of having my life looked at in cush personal detail, having no control and not knowing what I can and can't ask for and what will happen if I say no or request something. Feel like I have to jump through hoops

MissM sorry about the spotting, no words of wisdom from me I'm afraid. Have you had any spotting before during you LP?

Princess great news on the holiday news and booze news. Why is it that fruit juice was banned until now? Something to do with the sugars? I love fruit juice (apart from tomato) and can't deal with vegetable juice at all. Have you tried much with soups in place of the vegetable juice? I know the English summer is yet to show it's face but I really like alot of chilled soups which are basically seasoned vegetable juice, but for it's somehow much nicer.

Well I'm feeling a bit deflated after non-alien appointment and office crying. No alien is good but shit, really that's it? Yeh can't have a baby but haven't got any molars hanging out with my lady bits at the moment

Months ago I remember writing here that someone had said to me 'if you really want your own child then you would have IVF'. Several of you lovely ladies responded in sympathy and shock to that comment. The funny thing was that you picked up on the phrase 'own child' and when I thought about it I could see why you would (I guess I have a lot of experience of this so it doesn't affect me so much). Actually my own struggle with the comment was the idea that somehow if I choose not to do IVF I was basically saying I didn't want a child that much. I just thought of it again when I read your question Princess, I guess the answer is no I'm not but it's still hanging around in the background bothering me.

Stalking you too euro That cat is beautiful. Even I was thinking "could we?", "would Little Legs definitely try to eat it?". Maybe a cat is just what you need.

joycep Oh God at your friends and their pregnancy. You couldn't make that up! Not drinking is frankly ridiculous. I can't remember who said it but I wouldn't make MrP stop anything just because I was updiffed.
How are you feeling today?

rabbit The Clomid thing is interesting. Guess what I got today from my consultant? I have a prescription for two cycles and have to have the first cycle monitored. I understand your reservations and feel a bit unsure myself but ultimately I just thought fuck it. I am fed up of being prodded and investigated, & so the chance of actually having some treatment was too alluring. I have a fact sheet thingy so if you have any questions that might allay your concerns I may have the answers! What swung it for me was the fact that I might produce 2 eggs each cycle in effect doubling my chances.

Woo hoo for holiday princess. Lucky girl!

purple I'm glad that your appointment went well though I sorry that MrP forgot!
Don't worry about dildo cam not finding one ovary. When I had one of my scans the doctor said that they had a morning of not being able to find ovaries!

Like I mentioned up post I had my consultant appointment this morning. I have to say that I do really like my doctor there, she is smiley but no nonsense at the same time IFSWIM? Anyway the upshot is that I am on the IVF waiting list officially. My AMH blood test result wasn't back yet but all the others were good. I got 73 for my Progesterone which was a surprise and I am secretly a bit tickled by it My Antral Follicle Count is okaywhich is good for IVF apparently. All in all I feel a bit like I can take a bit of a breath now while I work my way up the waiting list.

Weirdly I also had to go back to the GP this morning too about The Pile (I really ought to trademark it since I mention it so much). The GP was one I've never met before and he was so sweet. Even though I wasn't there for fertility stuff he had obviously read my notes and mentioned how stressed I must be because if it and it will be acerbating my pile situation! He also sweetly said that he had looked at my test results and was convinced that I will get pregnant. He also said that piles will be the least of my worries when I get upduffed. It made such a nice change to have somebody being sympathetic and wanting to face the subject rather than avoiding it at all costs.

I have missed so many people out. Lots of love instead.