TTC 10 plus months, Part 7

[lisacn]

A friendly, supportive thread for those of us who are taking a bloody long little longer time than average to conceive.

*way not was

*too early not to early

euro glad that you have got some reassurance about your smear.

carrie I'm so sorry that you have been in so much pain (bit late to say now but I did wonder whether a syringe of sperm might have been the way to go if you were in too much pain to SWI)
Goodness at your liver and kidneys. So nice of the A&E doctor to be so rude given that you were obviously so ill!! Will you let us know how you get on?

Joycep Sorry about your MIL and mother issues. I am shocked that your MIL thought it was okay to tell your mum like that. That could have caused big problems.
Also sorry that your mother was dismissive of investigations.
I agree with you that doctors don't seem to look at infertile women as a whole and adequately go through medical history. There is no joining the dots simply just ticking narrow boxes. DH hit the nail on the head the other night when he said how it is as if the doctors have given up trying to find out what is wrong with us now and are just gearing everything towards IVF.
10 days hooked up to antibiotics sounds hardcore. It is interesting though about your DH having an infection & you probably benefiting from treatment too. See....no joining up the dots again

artemis I am so amazed that you will have such a long wait for your HSG (another one who thankfully got a cancellation for mine). I can't believe that only one person can do them in the whole hospital and that no locum cover is provided when he is off. FFS you wouldn't run a company like that.

buzzy TMI so sorry ladies but I am intrigued by what you say about your period changing. It is the same for me with lighter and shorter periods than I used to have. Weirdly I find that while my first day (or two) is way heavier than it used to be, my AF peters a lot earlier than it used to and can be over by the end of day 2. Incidently I am getting massive clots like you described. My progesterone seemed fine last time it was tested so I am confused and am terrified that it is pre-menopausal.
My MIL was dismissive of our baby issues when we told her too and launched into a trip down memory lane of how she found out she was pregnant, bringing the babies home etc.. She hasn't mentioned it since!

frannie sorry about the milestone and that you are feeling down.

lemons What crappy timing about new job and lap dates. So typical. What are you going to do?

mrsd sorry at PILS inviting themselves. That is so bloody rude. I hate house guests especially since TTC. There just never seems to be a good time for guests. It is either SWI time or 2ww and period arrival that make me feel very antisocial and not keen on entertaining.

hocus glad that your lap went okay. When are your stitches supposed to dissolve by? Mine didn't dissolve and DH had to pull them out. One was infected (and itchy which is why I ask!).

Also wanted to say (though I am late to the party and we seem to have moved on!) to princess and purple please don't feel guilty or that you are being judged. I certainly don't have opinions on what us ladies do on here in regard to lifestyle. I do think though that feeling judged is an unfortunate symptom of infertility. I think that we see people around us getting updiffed so easily and are perhaps looking for reasons as to why it hasn't happened for us and it is easy to look to God/the Universe/fate and feel like we are being punished because it is a way to try and make sense of it. I also personally feel like there is a good dollop of feeling judged everytime we have a doctors appointment especially when you are grilled on every aspect of your lifestyle from diet, alcohol consumption, exercise, frequency of sex etc.. It is a very invasive thing and then throw IVF into the mix with it's forms & tick boxes. I personally feel like I have to almost prove I am worthy to have a child. Anyway, rant over!

Well I had my first cycle monitoring scan yesterday which was okay I suppose (although I seem to have picked up a diarroheah bug since being at the hospital and now can't eat anything!). Everything looked fine apparently, womb lining okay, saw my fibroid, 7 follicles on my right ovary and 12 on the left. Got home and felt even more despondent that why, if everything is so bloody normal, aren't I getting pregnant? Anyway I have to go back on Friday for the second scan. I so hope that my stomach is better by then!

Sorry for missing people but waves and send love!

Sorry my post was garbled at littered with mistakes! Feel poorly crappy attempt at an excuse!

I forgot to ask, but for anyone who has had cycle monitoring did you have to provide your own ovulation testing kit or did the hospital give you the sticks?

Oh I can never keep up! Such alarming news for you carrie but someone upthread may have been right about that causing the pain? And also princess I think mentioned about the role in hormones. So although it's worrying, at least it's something to potentially treat, without having to plead for treatment related to TTC.

Oh pout don't get me started on the Worthiness of parenthood. I was rather alarmed when reading my IVF thread that it needs to be checked out. Fortunately it's restricted to pretty bad things such as criminal records and social services having to be involved with existing children, not an adoption-style grilling, but at the fact that a chav with just enough money to buy the buckfast for their night out has all the credentials needed .

So the IVF leave - found it on our intranet. Counts as special leave, and is for up to 5 days for each of 3 cycles, which is actually pretty decent. Though I'm really not sure how much I want my boss to know. And actually it'll end up in the PA knowledge pool due to the paperwork, one of whom is a friend and I don't want anyone to know. Still, I can hope that the blatantly obviously period pains I am having are in fact due to my free, non-medicated pregnancy settling in. Ha!

Ah, mean't to comment on the IVF leave thing nelly - sorry! I would've been utterly pissed off with the tittering in the background and assumptions that it isn't relevant to you. Mind you I am having an overly sensitive phase at the moment. I wanted to lamp a woman in Sainsbos for simpering telling her friend how she's "been busy being a Mum & it takes up all my time". I felt like marching over and telling her how I've been busy breathing and how it takes up all my time.

Anyways, 5 IVF days of leave seems pretty good I suppose.

at your pregnancy settling in!

5 days of IVF leave is pretty good. I guess most people need at least 3 - the day of egg collection, the day after and the day of embryo transfer.

pout I found the IVF forms pretty offensive. I can see from a PR point of view it would be terrible for public money to be spent helping abusers have more children, but I really resented having to jump through hoops that the fertile do not.

Hi Pout sorry you are feeling meh. This whole shebang is rubbish without throwing in the medical bureaucracy, spanish inquisition, lack of explanations, rude doctors, invasive procedures, lack of support, lack of empathy, rubbish sex education at school (I was only the other day moaning about how we were told that discharge was normal unless green, lumpy or smelly and that discharge is there for the sole purpose of keeping the lady bits clean and that you may or may not need a panty liner - so where was the information about CM and fertility? I didn't know until anything about this until someone's older sister (40s) told me when I was 27. And then I thought she was lying. And I didn't have any at this time. Presumably because of my diet and drinking or because of stress) Anyway.Thank you for your kind words. I am feeling much better about the whole booze/fag/MC situation and feel like I had to get it all of my chest and out there to deal with. Your MIL sounds like a peach. Like telling someone who got jilted about how wonderful and perfect your wedding day was. WTF? . Still at least she hasn't got involved recently. Glad to hear monitoring scan went well today. But I feel your frustration that there is still no explanation for no baby. I don't know about NHS OPKs - presumably they don't offer them as they don't agree with them or maybe they get given to certain people who they think can cope with the mental anguish that pissing on a stick causes. Anyway. If you want a once used CBFM PM me. It has no use here. I like the cheap sticks I bought off Amazon (50 for £7) as I can use them for every wee and I get to see the line get stronger and stronger so I now have 2 cycles worth of proper knowledge. Incidentally, as the sticks were so cheap, I treated myself to some disposable plastic cups as OH was getting increasingly grossed out by the wee glass that I would have to wash up in the kitchen sink each time. Aqua Vita Benjamin, Aqua Vita!

Frannie Oh my. So sorry to have not congratulated you yet on the news. Really, really, really fab news. When do you move? You must be excited! Sorry that you have reached the 2 year mark. I think once past the 2 year mark, I started to get a different perspective to TTC. It's a bit like the 7 stages of grief. I think I must be somewhere between 4 and 5 at the moment (4. depression, reflection, loneliness and 5. the upward turn. I am nowhere near 7 yet - acceptance and hope). Well done for not crying over the announcements that's v.impressive. I wish I had your resolve.

princess I realise now that I knew nothing about making babies except for the basics of penis, fanjo, sperm. Literally that was it. Quite embarrassing really. Our sex education at school consisted entirely of watching a Vatican approved cartoon aged 16 about no sex before marriage. I kid you not. I actually feel really stupid that I had no idea at all that fertility declines so dramatically in your thirties and that there was a fertile window each cycle. I guess I just assumed that I would decide I wanted a baby, shag a few times and bingo. Deep hollow laugh

at your wee glass!!!! While I would see nothing wrong in peeing into a glass, washing it and using it to drink out of, if DH did the same I would have a fit!

Thank you for your offer of your CBFM, you are so lovely, but I fear that it would be wasted on me given that I take the more laissez faire/stick a finger in the wind approach to all this TTC bollocks lately! The sticks thing question was because apparently the hospital want me to do ovulation pee sticks as part of the monitoring this cycle to confirm ovulation and so, I quote, we can have "intercourse that night and the night after". I am overjoyed by the thought of this especially given the fact that my dicky tummy has set my flipping heamorrhoids (sp?????) off again. Sex is the last thing I want to do

My MIL is certainly a character & I was surprised by her reaction TBH. Though that said she is very no nonsense and so probably doesn't have much time for IVF and the like, my guess is she would be of the opinion that if you can't get preggers then you just suck it up.

Firstly, I think I forgot to welcome Freedom and Hopeful in last post - sorry you are in the same frustrating boat, but this is an ace place to moan about it!
Hopeful - Hope your first appointment went ok

Princess - Sounds like the brown diet is working wonders with you, and you are amazing for being so focussed with it all. Very glad you allowed yourself a small - sometimes these things must be done, brown diet or no brown diet!
Liked your 'proper' champagne tale, made me giggle! And absolutely love the idea of going to next consultant appointment with magic wand! Take a bag of baby dust glitter and randomly scatter around the room during the meeting! Hehe!
Hoping all is well with your bestie :)
Oh, and I thought your wishes were v sweet. One stupid thought I have, when having the more ridiculous TTC-related thoughts, is that the only 'wish' I have ever made, since I can remember (as a kid blowing out birthday candles etc etc, and now possibly just wishful thinking/wishbone pulling!) is to be happy. Just that. Not lottery wins, or horsesmostly, or marriage to Kiefer Sutherland. Kind of feel the universe is being very unkind to not let me have the one thing that would seal the complete deal for me in that respect when that's all I ask. Is that a bit mental? yes Not that I'm NOT happy in that I have lovely DH/family, good job etc etc, and I'm very quick to count my blessings when I look back to before DH, but that last piece of the happy jigsaw is most definately missing.

Critter - Can I please have some Arkansas water too?! If only it were that easy... your Gran would make millions!
Great that you had positive ovulation this month.. Where IS that giant finger..?

Nelly - Have you finalised honeymoon destination yet? I wanted to go to Hawaii, but in the end, we went skiing, as that is much more 'us' than a beachy type hol :)
Boo to spotting... But interesting about IVF policy at work.. wonder my work has one.. off to check intranet

Artemis - It was the actual consultant that mentioned the 15% extra chance. Think its to do with the dye kind of 'flushing' the tubes and removing any tiny blockages etc.

I was specifically told to either abstain or use barrier contraception before the Lap, due to the possibility of it causing an ectopic or MC. They still did a pregnancy test on the morning, even though it was CD12 and not a hope in hell I was updiffed! Arse covering I guess, but I too thought "I'm here because I clearly CAN'T get pregnant, not much hope of a miracle one appearing this month surely?!"

Carrie - Hope you find out more about liver/kidney stuff very soon and they take better care of you from now on! V worrying for you, hope you are ok.

Lemons - I didn't tell work what I was going in for, just that it was an 'operation' - could you tell new place of work that you have a pre-booked operation at hospital?

Pout - Interesting re: stitches. Think they said 10 - 14 days. They are still very much there though, at least externally! Took itching as a good sign as its supposed to mean healing, but will keep a close eye out, thanks for the heads up :)
I went for a scan before my lap and had thought how interesting it would be to see the screen and look at my insides, but in the end I didn't look as I didn't want to see the black hole of my very very empty womb. Not how I imagined my first ultrasound scan to be...

Interesting about the thoughts on worthiness of parenting. DH and I had to fill in a questionnaire prior to first consultant operation about criminal records/domestic violence/general 'are you evil?' type questions and we were a bit
I get why they do it, I think, but sure those that get pregnant all by themselves don't get that much intrusion. Maybe I'm wrong..

Anyway, ridiculously long post! Waves to those I've missed and tail feather fluffs to all :)

artemis i'm with you on this 'if you stop thinking about it it will happen' bullshit, my mother used to say 'if you haven't got anything sensible or polite to say don't say anything at all' crazy or not she had a point

critter yay for ovulation

nelly sorry about work, do you have an occupational health dept you can speak to, 5 days is decent but if you didn't feel well you could always take it as sick leave, it also depends on how thorough your positive reporting/time sheets are, ours is quite detailed and gives a range of sickness options but if yours is covered by special leave you might not need to state why

carrie sorry about the news, hopefully they will start to take better care of you now

poutI don't think you're pre menopausal, cycles do change annoyingly but its worrying and frustrating if you are not aware of what is going on and no one reassures you, up until about January I had 3-4 days of decent blood loss then 2 days light, now I spot from 3-5 days then 1 day heavy 1 day medium to light, 2 days spotting/only when I wipe, I did first think this was down to the steroids, my usual scape goat along with the weight gain, I mentioned it to mr shehata who said he was not concerned and that he was happy with my lining at the scans. He said if I would feel more reassured by a proper period then I should up my dose of progesterone, usually I have bullet a day but this cycle I did 2. Not much difference really. I think the clots might be due to the lateness of my period, but I was expecting more, they told me acupuncture that it would improve my circulation and that my periods would go back to normal, but it hasn't made any difference. Are you on a stimulating drug?? Did they say what size they were, fingers crossed for Friday, its also good that your lining is thick enough too, I worried about mine being too thin with the lack of period, my monitoring is private so have to supply my own, the NHS is too tight to supply things like that, you can but them cheaply on amazon though

princess love the nan story

ladyg welcome back and sorry that the family problems are carrying on

i'm feeling extremely meh right now, I came home yesterday and told Mr B that Mr Shehata is away so i'll go to Harley Street and see his colleague and that maybe we should leave iui for this month and that I had looked up some places we could go to etc etc, he then said he didn't think we should do iui and we should wait he thinks we shouldn't rush things, i'm 39!! and we should see if things happen naturally and that we should not rush into iui, I said that we had been trying naturally for sometime, that I am 39 and that I'm happy to wait this cycle out as I doubt we will even try this month and that he can redo his SA, we then had words about it and we have hardly spoken since, like I don't have enough stress in my life as it is, I just don't understand why he does these uturns

ladies, we are ploughing through the pages on this thread.

misshocus - thank you for posting all about your lap. You're incredibly brave and just the thought of having to walk in to an operating theatre makes me shudder. And as for being teary when you woke up , if it makes you feel any better, I was put on the scales when i first went in for my monitoring scan last month and that made me incredibly teary..not becuase of my weight but just from being in a hospital. I can imagine I would ball my eyes out after a lap.

buzzy - i am pleased you found your counselling session helpful but am sorry about your conversation with mrb. Men don't seem to get that feeling of time pressure and it's not helpful to do a uturn on your plan. Will the silent treatment help him backtrack? My dh referred to my conversation with Dr T in NY last week as 'that stupid conversation' and I just said 'forget it' and went silent on him. It finally sank in that he was being a twat and he apologised.

hello ladygee - it's good to know you are still about and well done with all these family dramas. I can't believe you are gearing up for another round of ivf already.

euro - oh yes i remember you saying about your mum. It's really the same issue with mine. She is normally fairly caring so I don't quite get her lack of interest on this especially when she is so desperate for grandchildren.

critter - i think if i get to the grand old age of 86 , i may be as nosey as your grandmother in law! Although it's not very nice for you. Goodness i would be mentalling so much if i was you - laying your first egg in 7 years , I'm just hop;ing so much for you.

artemis - your acupuncturist sounds like she had no idea...Fancy implying you didn't want it enough? And anyway I thought the fact we all wanted it so much was the reason behind why we couldn't conceive! There are some good clinics in London but I'm sure there are some up north that are superb as well. All i know is that all of them charge an arm and a leg, it is very depressing. I'm not entirely sure on the whole clomid thing. I guess they just give it as it is super cheap and may as well give it a whirl. But I read somewhere that it is irresponsible to give clomid to people who ovulate. I never understood why my gynae gave it to me. Again, it's not really looking in to a cause as to what is going on - it's so frustrating. Sorry you are feeling meh - it's so crap.

nelly - wthat's great about your new policy guidelines.

carrie - oh no, poor you. How have they found that out? Is there any indication what it is at the moment?

princess - i have always ignored the doctors when they start telling me which cycle day to come in on. My GP was insisting I was to come in 7 days before AF and I tried to explain to her that was only 4dpo. I much prefer to measure when I ovulate using sticks and temps then go in on at 7dpo.
critter / princess - i use to be in tv too - also a newsroom. I was no bigwig though and in fact i don't think kids were on my radar back then. I found it a very stressful environment though and also had complete arseholes shouting down the phone at me. Anyway I'm going to feel like a massive failure if I don't have kids because I really won't have much to show for myself, no impressive career and no kids. Ah well, at least I won't have had a nervous breakdown in a tv newsroom.

pout - MrP has hit the nail on the head. The tests they do on the nhs are wholly inadequate. Of course, it's great that they provide ivf in some areas but I wish they used their nouse a bit more. Surely if you are a gynae, you would be inquisitive as to what is causing all this infertility. Wouldn't you want to research adn try different things? . Perhaps their hands are tied and they can't look beyond the narrow hfea guidelines, I don't know but there does seem to be a lack of interest. When I asked my consultant how many people she saw actually got pregnant in the end, she looked at me as if I had asked her the way to the moon. Anyway, if they took more of an interest in to why your cycles have so dramatically changed perhaps it would flag something. Do you think you should do this Greece thing and send off a blood sample to see if you have a bacterial infection? I'm not trying to drag you down my slippery slope but your doctors should be interested in this symptom. Also, you wouldn't be perimenopausal with that number of follies - 12 on your left is a great number. That's a lot more than me.
Also why do you need a testing kit for monitoring scans? I haven't been told to use one.

My friend has told me she has had a very early miscarriage. She doesn't want a kid and She only dumped her fuckwit boyfriend a week ago and so she is relieved as it meant she didn't have to go and get an abortion. She is 37 and said it was her own fault for not being as careful as she could have been. Of course I'm at her ability to conceive so easily....I haven't been careful for years , it's bloody annoying!

Hello ladies, first off - and sorry for another request for advice - but any tips on keeping up with a busy thread would be extremely welcome....seriously I like to think I'm reasonably ok at multitasking but clearly not. Been off since last night and there's SOOO much chat in the meantime. Only joking about advice on keeping up - sure I'll get there eventually. Maybe I should talk to my boss about making some time at lunch every day for some downtime/MN time :-)

So just one thing of today's traffic which I spotted on my quick scan while (a) cooking dinner (b) catching up on women's hour (c) hanging up the wash and (d) planning a job app (nothing exciting - internal thing)..... Nelly!! seriously that work call is ridiculous! I wouldn't just be wondering what the new policy is, I'd be wondering in whose interpretation of employment law it's ok to make such comments about IVF (or any such like)?! Seriously, reckon that's really dodgy ground..... And all that aside, I find it really invasive when people at work think it's ok to get into territory about baby/family plans uninvited. It's such a private, precious thing and yes lots of us are happy to be open about things (because we really value the support apart from anything else) but when it's our choice fine....making unsolicited nosy comments is just another ball game. GRRRRR winds me up!!

Ok rant over. In response to a couple of comments on here - update on my gynae exam. Must say it was all quite underwhelming, so presume that's a good thing. GP told me what she was going to do ("have a feel around, check uterus and cervix all ok"), did it (all quite firm and tough, though not painful - sorry if TMI), and then took her hand out, looked up at me, smiled and said "that all looks fine, no problems there." So I"m guessing that's a good thing as if she'd found something obviously problematic hopefully she'd have told me there and then. But then again loads still to look into that could throw up problems so trying not to get too optimistic. She also took a swab for clamydia (sp?), which apparently is a standard part of the screening process for fertility issues. Chances like a gazillion to one I'm pleased to say (naive maybe!), but hey ho....it's got to be done.

So now it's just a question of waiting for my two blood tests during next cycle, and getting DH to sort his side of the testing bargain too ;-) Oh and keeping on with trying.....assuming I'm back to 28 cycle then ov is prob either yesterday or today - decided against testing this month but on the GP's advice definitely "not stopping trying" just because of all the tests. And there have been some definite positive ov signs so FX :-) Wouldn't it be ironic if this month was the month?!

Best go and finish dinner. Have lovely evenings all you lovely ladies. Will try and pop back later to catch up properly on today's goings on. xxx

Hi all thanks for the supportive messages. No its not what has caused the ovulation pain. Its been ongoing for 2 years with kidney infections and stones and the pain is in a very specific place for that. I have had constant blood in urine since March so not good. Scans haven't shown anything sinister but it means end of fertility clinc as they won't keep us open while open to another specialist and TTC is out while I ge tested and undergo any treatment. Don't know how to feel or what to do

carrie I'm so incredibly sorry. How stinkingly awful. I have heard from friends who've had kidney stones that it's pretty much the most painful thing ever, and I'm so sorry that you're dealing with this. Constant blood in urine sounds awful - that has happened to me once, a long time ago, and I remember being in tears from the pain. Thinking of you.

always that sounds positive with the doctor visit. It's good that you're being thoroughly checked out and that everything looked fine when she checked your cervix etc, that is reassuring. Do you know when you'll get the results of your blood tests? Are they checking hormone levels, or for infections? Fingers crossed that you get some action in over the next few days with Mralways, and I really hope you get an ironic BFP this month.

joyce aha, a fellow ex-newsroomer! Ooh, now I'm curious as to where and when... maybe one day I'll make it to a meet up in the UK and be able to ask. :) Oh and you definitely shouldn't feel like a failure on the no kids front. Your lovely, warm, kind-hearted personality just shines out of your posts, and even though I've never met you, I can tell that you are a truly good person, right to the core. That's an achievement in itself, given what you're going through at the moment.

buzzy sorry that you and MrB are having a rough time - that does sound frustrating. I hope you are able to resolve it. Could he be worried about the whole SA thing and that be putting him of the IUI?

hocus sending you healing thoughts and well done for getting through your lap. Arkansas water coming your way! I'll probably find out that 'Arkansas water' is a euphemism for something dodgy soon... it does sound slightly rude!

Right - just realised I'm late for yoga - going to get my zen on! Lovely, comforting chat earlier with my dad, who was telling me that he and my mum once thought they couldn't have children as it took them three years to conceive my sister (and two mcs and a stillbirth). Hope everyone is feeling ok and big waves to you all, especially the ones I've missed and those feeling especially blue.

Critter thanks for the 'having it all' article, I found it really interesting. I was quite career minded when I was younger but have become much less so in the past 5 years, which is unfortunate really because if i can't have kids I'm going to need something else to focus on and i don't just want it to be my career... I work in a profession that is 70% female until you get to senior level and then the gender balance is the opposite way around. i'm really glad you had a positive chat with your dad. Hurrah, parental support at last! We do seem to be lacking that on this thread.

Carrie that's bad news on your kidney/liver function - but maybe this is what's causing the problem for you? Sounds like it needs sorting out before you go any further with fertility treatment. The liver plays a vital role in regulating hormones so getting that problem sorted might be all you need to move forward. I really hope so.

Princess i cannot believe your biting the pillow comment to DH's nan!! You made me laugh yesterday, thank you - and for the support and the cat bum . What is it with consultants having to be right over things they can't possibly know - how the feck does the consultant know when you're going to ovulate? I think an invisible power struggle goes on in the consulting room and they have to stamp their authority even in small ways. Fingers crossed for your bestie, how was her scan?

Welcome back Pout and a gruff goodbye to Dave... you and joycep are absolutely right about the lack of proper medical history. When I had the first lot of bloods done my GP ran a full blood count which showed possible pernicious anaemia. The fertility nurse dismissed that information - 'well that's not relevant to your fertility it's your general health so you have to pursue that with your GP'. In what way is my general health 'not relevant' to fertility?? FFS. I feel they are gearing me to IVF too without any curiosity about what's wrong. I understand that age makes treatment more urgent but it still feels potentially like a sledgehammer to crack a nut and surely given the way IVF rates plummet post 35 it is not necessarily any more likely to produce a baby than actually finding out what is wrong with me. Pah and meh. Pout I hope you feel better soon, being scanned with a stomach bug must be grim. Pout and Buzzy my periods have changed too. I've said before I think it dates from my MC but mine have changed in exactly the way you describe - days of spotting before and after, heavier but shorter, and more clotting. Now I don't know if it's me or the drugs but I do wonder if it's due to age. i made myself thoroughly depressed yesterday looking at the age stats again .

On which topic Buzzy Mr B's reluctance to move things forward is frustrating. Mr A can be the same. he thinks I worry too much (he has NO IDEA how much worrying I actually do) and I genuinely don't think he understands how time critical this whole thing is, perhaps because time is only running out for me, not for him. It is hard to have the conversation because he feels I am blaming him - we could have started ttc 12 - 18 months sooner than we did if he hadn't put the brakes on. Have things improved for you? It is really difficult stuff to talk about.

Hocus I'm interested that it was your consultant who told you the increased chance of getting pg after having your tubes checked. Mine denied there was any therapeutic benefit to be had from flushing out the tubes and did not want me to have an hsg at all. Yet another example of inconsistent treatment on the NHS.

Hopeful advice on keeping up with a busy thread... umm, my tried and tested tactic is simply to ignore my work commitments and faff about on mn instead!

Nelly and Euro the worthiness questionnaire was pretty much the first thing we had to do at the first appointment we had. I think we spent longer filling in questionnaires than we did giving our case history to the nurse. I do understand why they have to do it but it felt very invasive and it seems a massive irony that it's only the people who would really cherish and appreciate a child that get grilled in this way. I saw a very obese woman the other day pushing a pram with an equally obese small child waddling along beside her and i wanted to scream.

Well I'm no nearer my hsg. I spoke to a very nice nurse yesterday who was friendly but firm and refused to let me book ahead based on predicted cycle dates. I have to ring on day 1 of my next period and just hope they're not booked up again. I explained that day 1 will be when i am on holiday somewhere in Greece (great, terrific holiday planning there ) with no guarantee of mobile reception and it may not be possible for them to get a message back to me but there is no alternative. I can understand that if my period is out by a day or two the appointment will be too, but I can't see it making a difference. It is massively frustrating. She said they can't do the test later than day 12 because of the thicker endometrium. i don't know if that's true or if she was just fobbing me off.

How is everyone today? Waves to all of you. I'm sorry for being on a downer at the moment, i hope my mehness isn't catching. I daresay I'll perk up again in the next few days, that's usually what happens after AF. Thanks for the support everyone, you are a terrific bunch of people and it really does help a lot

Can I join in the mehness that a few of you have been feeling this week? I know it's mostly pmt on my part and the fact that we too are reaching the 2 year ttc mark, but I've been googling all things sperms and managed to make myself miserable! Have found out what OATS is that mrgin has and it basically means really shit sperm that won't get me preggers naturally ever. I did know this but every month I secretly hope one sperm has made its way through to the golden egg. I really need to give up on this! It's not gonna happen. It's all very frustrating. I'm also feeling that ivf will never work for us after the last failed round - ha screw you think positive doctors and zita west!

Soz, moan over! Gosh lots to catch up on.

carrie so sorry to hear about your health problems. I'm sure being so poorly cannot help ttc.

joy I was so so by your mil and mum 's behaviour. Ffs, it's hardly a decision you are taking lightly. Hope mrjoy has told his mum off for gossiping. Sounds like your mum needs educating.. Is she someone who even if a man in a white coat explained it all to her, she still wouldn't change her mind??

princess you have been making me as usual with your posts about aqua vitae and rude nans. Wohoo for the ewcm!

critter so pleased to hear your ovulation happened. Fx for you this month.

buzzy I really really hope it wasn't a sack that you passed and that you can sort out the whole iui thang.

euro hope DR is still going ok and you're not feeling too menkul. I know I would be on it, which is why I went for mild ivf.

nelly wohoo for honeymoon planning. And I'm sure the pains are the baby settling in...

frannie hello! Do let us know if your exciting news comes off. Wish I'd reached the zen place with ttc.

pout That's a great no of follies! I had 16 on my scan.

always that's good that things are moving and all seems fine so far.

hocus hope you are still recovering well. I too thinking itching is a sign of healing.

artemis any news on the hsg?

And breathe! Hello to all I've missed and sorry for crap catchup. Must get into work! Hope you all have good days and that those of you in londres enjoy the balmy 22 degrees...

Morning ladies

Gin I'm sorry that you are so down, sometimes Google just isn't our friend Like you I am at that stage where I just want to stop wanting this but I just can't turn that baby switch off. Life would be so much easier if I could! I hope that you are feeling happier today.

artemis and buzzy Yet again I feel relieved to see that I'm not alone in my freaky periods. I reckon it must be an age thing because we are similar ages aren't we?

artemis I nearly choked on my tea at the comment from the fertility clinic that general health has no bearing on fertility. What complete tosh!!!!! I really do despair.
I agree with you about just being an age now with regard to the consultants. Pushing on with IVF does just seem to be the order of the day (though my doctor made noises at my scan that it wasn't definite for me?????? I'm trying not to dwell on this comment and am hoping that I might have just misconstrued what she mean't because in the next breath she said that the counting of follies was important to work out the level of medication for IVF. It's all such a headfuck!). Anyhooo like you I am not convinced that IVF is the answer and have zero faith in it for me. I am convinced that my body is rejecting fertilised eggs and will just reject an IVF egg too. [pessimistic smiley]
My DH says that I worry too much too and like you he has no idea of the true extent of my worrying. I understand the blame thing too and if I'm honest I do blame MrP a big bit for being in this mess & do feel a bit angry that he stalled trying for a baby for so long.

buzzy I am sorry that MrB is making u-turn noises. I can understand how hurtful and frustrating that must be. Do you think that maybe he has just got the fear? Hopefully he will think on a bit today and come around.
Thanks for the good luck for Friday. She didn't mention the size or anything...maybe I should've asked??? No I'm not being medicated it's just a routine, baseline investigation.

critter it is nice that your dad is being so sweet and supportive.

carrie Poor you, that must be miserable. Also I feel for you at the not being able to be under two clinics simultaneously. That is rubbish and I hope you get your kidneys sorted out soon so you can get back under the fertility clinic pronto.

joycep Lately I am finding myself tearing up at the hospital. I think for me it is just frustration now and feeling like it is all futile anyway. When I was there on Monday there was a newborn in the waiting room which I found difficult and then unbelievably a flippin' newborn in the phlebotomy dept too. Great!
I'm sorry that MrJ was a tad insensitive. Sometimes I feel like they must have deathwish
at the asking the way to the moon thing. It IS exactly like that when you ask a question so much so that I have simply given up now. They never answer you anyway.
I would like to do the Greece thing but misery guts MrP won't let me because he is worried that it is a ruse???????
The pee sticks thing is written in my little booklet that the hospital gave me about cycle monitoring. It looks like I will have to provide my own which might be a problem because I haven't ordered any from Amazon or ebay. Bugger.

hocus I read that an HSG increases chances of conception for 3 cycles too. Though there is some controversy over whether this is just the case for HSGs done using an oil based dye rather than water based.

always I'm glad that the fertility investigations ball is rolling for you.

Sorry for not name checking everyone and sorry for mammoth post!

Quick post because I'm on my phone. But guess what I have in my hand? A prescription for anti biotics, now who is going to offer me the most for it? It turns out I've got tonsillitis, I'm feeling pretty rotten. Does someone want me to cough in a hanky and post the germs a bit like joyceps period so that you too can get antibiotics?

Gin, I'll join you in the mehness. What is oats? I've realized that it's never going to happen naturally despite my hopes every month. Dh has low numbers and crap morphology. I also depressed myself by thinking that this will make ivf hard if the sperm are all rubbish ones. And we might never get a fertilised egg. But I'm pmtey like you, so I know I'll fell more positive after af.

Pout, sorry you are I'll. Scans and stomach upsets are not a good combination.

I've still got 3 weeks to go at least uni, we find out genetic results. I feel like we're in limbo land. I worked out today that I'll be at least 32 before I might give birth, fed up!

Sorry for all the typos. I hope you. Can still make sense of it.

Morning ladies.

I am also bloody miserable this morning. I have put on a few pounds so I have the happy combination of feeling fat, menopausal and depressed. Meh.

I am absolutely hating this and want to stop. The only thing making me keep going is that if I don't and I get to the menopause childless, I will be wondering "what if I hadn't flipped out halfway through that ivf cycle a few years back". So it's a very negative motivation. Fear of future regrets.

Sorry euro about your miserable feelings. Feeling fat to boot is the last straw

I have the same feelings about the thought of IVF too (and in my darker moments have mused about not going on the waiting list - which I know in my saner moments is ridiculous). On the one hand I am so bloody grateful that it is there as an option but on the other I really don't want to do it. Ideally I wish I was 10 years younger and could have longer time for other options and
more futile au naturel cycles. Actually I think I was happier with my preconceived idea that the IVF waiting list would be 18 months or something, the 6/8 months wait time feels too soon (but then the whole declining success rate after 37 rings in my head too).

Like you I am afraid of looking back, when it is too late to have kids, and not being able to tell myself that we had tried everything.

mrsd sorry about the tonsilitis, nasty.
at antibiotics for the highest bidder!!!

Euro hang in there, you're doing so well. How long until egg collection? Just think how close you could be to making a baby. I know ths whole process is crap and it's not the way any of us wanted to conceive but the way I see it is once were pregnant we won't care what we had to through to get there. But I totally understand, this is crap of the highest order. Big hugs.

Morning all, can I join in meh-ness too? I don't think it helps that the sky is grey and Massive Attack is on the radio and I've just had an email from my pregnant friend. Of course I'm happy that everything is fine now (all checked out at the doctors yesterday) but I have just had that horrid pang of jealousy that hits you in the chest and cheeks and sits in the throat... sorry but the little green face doesn't do it justice. This is much more complex than an face. It is not normal to be jealous of people throwing up - she puked over herself this morning and is now chewing ginger. I wish I had morning sickness. I wouldn't even mind vomming all over myself in public. Fertility god of meaness - GIVE ME A FUCKING BABY IN MY TUMMY - I'LL TAKE STRETCH MARKS, PUBLIC SPEWING, INCONTINENCE AND HEMORRHOIDS. I WON'T EVEN MOAN. PROMISE. ANYONE UP THERE? ANYONE, anyone, anyone, anyone Oh it's echoing around like it would do in my empty cavern of a womb. That's a no then. Meh meh meh meh meh meh meh meh meh meh meh meh meh meh meh. Foot stamping, hair pulling and face screwing. Doesn't help that my egg will be on it's way out in the next 12 hours based on my LH surge yesterday. Another one that will be missed. It's my peak happy time and I'm feeling today. Oh and she can't see me this week because she is going to our pregnant friends birthday gathering. It's happening already.

Euro sorry that this is so rubbish for you. Don't worry about a couple of pounds though - I only look different to others when I'm a stone heavier / lighter. Anything in between and no-one ever notices. I'm sure you are are the same. And if I'm 'fat' people say, "ooh you look well" or if I'm 'thin' people say "ooh have you lost weight. You're looking very thin in the face". Which makes me wonder if I actually suit the fatter version of myself. Or maybe somewhere in the middle at the point where no-one comments. My friend was asking what the big deal about IVF is the other day (I said I didn't want to go down that route). And she looked at me like I'm actually mad and said that at least it means you can have a baby. Thanks . I informed her about the daily drugs, injections, the temporary menopause, the intrusiveness off it all. And she went, "Oh, I had no idea." Quite. It is a big deal and you are doing so well and it will all be over soon and there is the real chance of a baby. Hang in there. I'm rooting for the Eurette's.

Gin sorry about the research stuff and the PMT and the sperm situation. Truly rubbish all of it. I don't really know what else to say to comfort you. But please know that I am thinking of you. Virtual hand stoke and hug. I'm positive that this will end well for you and Mr G.

MrsD also sorry about your PMT. We get the raw end of the deal with all of this. Like with Gin above please have a virtual hand stroke and hug. Sending you some positive vibes.

Artemis sorry that you couldn't get in for your appointment based on estimated cycle times. They can estimate so many other things. It really is a case of them picking and choosing. I hear you on the fat women with fat child thing. It's not fair.

Nelly I'm and at the reaction of your colleagues yesterday. Although the sniveling little shit bag of an office manager who works for our company (complained to my Dad about me last week - picking on the wrong princess I can tell you) always responds to, "Did you have a nice weekend?" with "Don't ever have kids. The girls are sick again. They kept me up and I haven't slept". Ungrateful useless excuse of a man. Still it's good that you get leave for IVF. You must be able to talk to someone in confidence about it? I didn't have a hope in hell of covering up what was going on with me at my old job last year as I started miscarrying at work and erupted into uncontrollable hysterics and had to be taken to a special room away from my colleagues by one of the ladies I was very close to. No-one said anything when I returned from my week of sick leave.

Pout if you want to do the Greek thing, can you do it behind Mr Ps back? That's what I'd do. Mr Princess just doesn't get a say in somethings.

Carrie glad to hear your Dad is being supportive. That's really sweet of him. Hope you had a lovely yoga sesh.

Oh and the Vacines with their song "No Hope" have just been on - how very fitting.

Waves to all. Sorry it's a meh day. xxxxx

Carrie sorry, that was meant for Critter. I get all muddled when the / fog clouds over.

I've just said to Mr P that I'm feeling upset by the email and I got this indignant don't-bother-me-now response, "why?" I replied "because she is very much pregnant" his response (stern voice) "well, that's good."

Ah, so now i have no support from my parents, no support from my husband and no support from my bestfriend. The full house of out here on my own. Yippee-yi-ay.