TTC 10 plus months, Part 7

[lisacn]

A friendly, supportive thread for those of us who are taking a bloody long little longer time than average to conceive.

Can I just get off my chest how sick I am of the fecking football? And the whole thing has barely even started. MrA is laid on the sofa with beer (on a MONDAY) like a slack-jawed glassy-eyed hologrammatic imitation of his normal self. I swear he cannot actually see or hear me for the duration of the game. I'm hiding in the spare room and BBC2 are showing a hugely romantic bird courtship, just to rub it in. I do not get it. Men are weird.

Right, now that's said, hello everyone

Critter that is terrific news about the mega follicle, good luck with the trigger shot... fingers crossed this is the golden egg.

Euro the shooting sounds great. I can think of a few people I'd like to point a loaded gun at though clearly that would get me arrested... well done on the injections. i think that would freak me out a bit but I guess you get used to it - not the most unpleasant aspect of the whole process.

Teu sorry to hear about weddings combined with preg announcements, that's rubbish. they don't get easier to deal with. Most of my friends are married already if they're going to be but the preg announcements still happen, and they still hurt.

Princess once again I am in awe of your extreme DIYing. There were celebrations here this evening (before the football) because we managed to change a light bulb. It was the tricky one in the bathroom with the weird horrible light cover and required careful balancing on the edge of the bath... that's extreme DIY round here What a relief your phone was covered. I have never even attempted to have a conversation with Siri, am I missing anything?

Buzzy I'll keep your doctor's advice in mind... really, always hope unless you have no uterus or you're dead? Glad Mr B has done his SA. Yes, is ERTD late or are you medicating?

Carrie I'm glad this has brought you and MrC closer. There are always positives I guess, even if you have to try hard to find them. I hope they get your endo sorted though. They can't possibly think vomiting every month is ok.

Gin congratulations on successful seduction. That's what it's like at our house too unless the bloody football is on in which case it's hopeless...

Right, I've got Mayan massage and reflexology to look up now... Since I'm on a break from the acu and am not convinced it did anything at all it's time I looked into some different woo . Halfway through the 2ww with the usual mixture of daring to hope but not expecting it to be any different to any other month.

Yay, Critter. Let's show those fertility clinics that we mean business! I want to get an NRA sticker for my car, just so people think twice before cutting me up.

I find the infection stuff interesting. Someone on the Pred thread with a similar history to me (save for the fact that she managed to get pregnant and then miscarry when she first ttc'd) - many cycles, NK cells but otherwise unexplained, superov, iui and then ivf - recently went to get a full immunes screen done (beyond the NK cells tests) and it showed three different infections, none of which would have been picked up on an STI screen. These are probably the thing that triggered her immune system to produce the NK cells.

My cycles have definitely changed since ttc, but bizarrely they have become more regular. Maybe it's due to all the supplements and acu?

Artemis my sympathies. Fortunately, Mr euro doesn't watch any sport on tv. I am the one in this house who watches football, although I restrict myself to the England matches. I've missed both our games so far - I was at work for the first one and on the Eurostar coming back from a work trip for the second!

Good work Gin ;)

gin at your if there is womb there is a way, i'm delaying it with progesterone twice a day, not sure for how long, will see how he recovers from this op, Well done on the seduction of Mr G

euro i'm the sports watcher in our household although I haven't watched all the footy, mainly because I prefer rugby.

artemis you could take the fuse out of the TV plug

So I went to collect Mr B who looked like death, they told me his blood pressure had dropped so we waited for them to check it again, well it was up and down, Mr B doesn't suffer from man fluand isn't much of a drama queen so I was concerned by his behaviour, anyway they decided he was fit to go home so he is now in bed. I've got the next 2 days off to sort him out

Hi ladies - can I just say I'm glad you've reverted to the female form . It's like an episode of True Blood in here, what with all the shape-shifting! Anyway sorry for being awol - no real reason other than work getting quite busy, being away from home for a couple of nights, and hobbling getting in the way.

euro well done on starting the IVF and getting the injections on the go. I had my tour of the clinic today which I'll write more on below, but was thinking about you as I was there, if that's not too weird. Loving the image of everyone stalking about with loaded shotguns (in a non-homicidal kind of way). Perhaps we can use them to get more help from our generally useless doctors?

Artemis sorry about the football widow, I'm also lucky that Mr Nelly prefers taking part in sports generally. A few of your posts recently have made me think are you me? and your comment about being mid-2ww is exactly how I feel. You can't believe you are even daring to let hope show it's ugly face, but yet every cycle, there it is. I'm somewhere post OV but as my cycle was so odd last time I've lost count a little bit. Oh for an ironic "just relax" dif. I am drinking wine. On a Monday, with little care for where in my cycle I really am.

sar interesting on the antibiotics. My best friend is a doc, I wonder if she can be persuaded to write me a prescription for that ingrown hair that has been lingering nastily

joy - go you, at telling your colleague just how insensitive he was being. Twat.

Hooray and fingers crossed for the golden egg critter

OK all other posts I wanted to comment on were on the other page, so general waves to teu wine mrsd pout carrie princess gin lemon and everyone else including newbies.

So today we went to the IVF clinic. It's a fairly new facility, quite a cool building, and the sun was shining today after a crappy wet weekend, so that felt nice! Anyway met with a nurse who asked if we had any specific questions, so asked about natural/mild. They said that it wasn't recommended as there was no guarantee that the follicle would even have an egg. Hmm not surprised they didn't recommend but I'll with-hold judgement. Also asked about protocols, didn't get a specific answer but I think they said that it really depends on the consultant, but in theory they'll do anything. I guess I'm just keen to avoid excessive drugs where they can be avoided. Anyway it was a lovely hospital but I'm in a weird place where I feel like I'm going to be handing over 5k with no expectation for it to work. . Anyway Mr Nelly was won over by the free wifi and "relaxation area". Priorities, huh? All things considered, we'll probably book the consultation appointment soon and take it from there. I feel relatively ambivalent about the whole thing and still hoping for an ironic pre IVF diff

Anyway as always I've been ages drafting so will post now and try to catch up more tomorrow. Hope everyone is well and fingers crossed for some BFPs soon - the big finger has been rather lazy of late!

Morning all

Nelly you're right, that big finger has been hopelessly idle lately. Has it gone on strike? I reckon we should incorporate Critter's horned helmet and Ride of the Valkyries act into our fertility dance. Couple that with sleek tail feathers and sparkly knobs, what fertility god could resist? and if they do we'll just get Euro to shoot the feckers

I am at the London IVF crack house. Interested Nelly in your attempts to avoid excessive drugs. I think all the downregging and stimming is the part of the process I'm looking forward to least that and having a chuff like Piccadilly Circus as Euro might say. I am now seeing IVF as inevitable which is unfortunate when I've still got a good 3 months to go before I even get on the list . Thanks Sarlat for the reassurance, I guess much as I don't like the idea it will be normalised when I am in it.

Gin IMHO drinking is absolutely the best way of getting through weddings unscathed. Nelly my grrr at Mr A on the beer on a Monday was merely because I've been on the wagon for this cycle and I really really wanted some of his lovely posh Belgian beer (no Carling in our house). I have been inconsistent on the booze front. I've had months without then at other times have drank normally (can't drink to excess any more but I do like and the odd posh beer) and I can't say it's made the slightest bit of difference. Not got pregnant either way.

Buzzy at taking the fuse out of the TV plug. I am baffled at where the sporting interest has come from. When we first met Mr A didn't seem interested in sport, he isn't remotely blokey thank god. As time has gone on it's crept in more. He doesn't go to matches thankfully because the team he supports is crap but when major competitions are on he wants to watch them.

Sarlat I'm really interested in the antibiotic theories. I have a script for 2 different types of evil-sounding ones for when i have the HSG. I am wondering whether the anecdotes about people being more likely to get pg after an HSG have anything to do with massive amounts of pre-emptive antibiotics as much as the procedure itself. Not that I am hoping for a miracle cure or anything but there's something to be hopeful about... JoyceP how did your appointment with the consultant go? Hope you got somewhere. Did you ask her about antibiotics?

I am going to message northern ladies with dates for a meetup. I have the short term memory of a gnat and can't remember who was in and who was out, so if you want to join us and I haven't messaged you by lunchtime, give me a prod

I'm so behind! All this talk of antibiotics makes me think we should use my crap and aging "reproductive" system as a testing ground for the full range of antibiotics which I'm sure I can procure at will in middle eastern drug stores. Following my obviously successful pregnancy I will ofter services antibiotics-quack-differ. Yes, it's all coming together nicely.

Still haven't made the doctors appointment I have been meaning to make due to some crazy theory that this cycle is the magic dif and that doctor is going to do some, never to be proven bad thing, which will un-diff me. That's the 2ww talking.

Anyway, wanted to stop in with my wishes for those braver than me. I'm here and waiting for that big finger....

Morning ladies...can't be arsed to work out how to change my name just yet so I'm still Dave for now [always imagine League of Gentlemen "Hello Dave"]

Sarlat the infection stuff is fascinating especially speaking as someone whose periods went wappy when we started TTC. I mentioned the wappiness to the first consultant whose response was something along the lines of "this is common when TTC". It amazes me that they are either not very clued up or simply aren't interested in new research.
Euro Wow at the three different infections triggering NK cells. It seems to make utter sense. I will mention this to my consultant next time and watch the tumbleweed.

Artemis Sympathies at your 2ww hell. Ditto at this end. I hate the constant struggle between head and heart that goes on.

I also have a DH with a relatively new interest in footie. He denies this but as I tell him there is no way our relationship would have got this far if he had been such a footie bore at the start

Buzzy Hope your DH is okay? What happened? Did I miss that?

Nelly Glad that the tour went okay and much relief that there is wifi

gin and euro I too have spent many happy times as a kid at Bisley. It is a small world

Carrie I second that vomiting during AF is not right. Poor you. I can't believe that any GP would think that was okay

Joycep Good for you for telling your dicky colleague what was what. Ingrate.

critter hope the trigger shot went okay and am loving the Flight of the Valkyeries soundtrack....next month I suggest The Planets. Personally I am opting for the music for Rubarb and Custard as the soundtrack for my next ovulation.

princess Oh dear at death of phone. Oh God at Birds and Bees themed wedding. Have you considered going in an NHS surgical gown, clutching a copy of Taking Charge of Your Fertility with a few OPK sticks strewn in your hair?

Sorry for not namechecking properly but big loves to everyone.

Artemis it's good to see my elegant turn of phrase catching on .

Sympathies to those finding wedding season difficult. I don't have any to go to this year - most of my friends are hitched now, a couple for the second time. However I do have a christening to go to, slap bang in the middle of the IVF 2ww. That's going to be fun....

Dave I love your outfit suggestion for Princess! And the idea that Critter should move onto The Planets next. I think I am in a Mars, Bringer of War mood today....

My colleague?s daughter has been born. I?m so delighted [fake smile]. Tempted to write in the card how sorry I was that it wasn?t a boy.

sarlat - so I was up in to the early hours reading the online version of Dr Troth?s book. It?s really interesting to see that unseen bacterial infections can cause infertility. It seems pretty basic and cheap to just give people antibiotics so why I wonder don?t they do this over here. I see that people with hydrosalpinx (sp) have done antibiotic treatment. Have you found any doctor in the UK who looks in to these bacterial infections and uses antibiotic therapy to assist? I decided to email Dr Toth to see what he says. My cycle completely changed after miscarriage but perhaps that is because we were starting to have unprotected sex for the very first time. Oh dear there are just too many avenues to explore and I don?t even know where to start. I was walking in to work this morning and seriously thinking about how on earth I could get some antibiotics. Anyone friends or lovers with a pharamicist? Any stamped , empty prescription notes hanging around?

artemis - total sympathy for the football mania going on. I did go and see the consultant this morning but I didn?t ask her about the antibiotics. I just don?t think she?ll have any views but I will ask when I don?t have my legs wide open.

euro - where did this person on the pred thread go to get screened for infections? Was it the place in Greece?

buzzy - have I missed something, what?s happened to your dh?

nelly - well done on going to the ivf clinic. That?s always a good first step although of course I hope you get that elusive bfp before you ever actually have to start there. Slightly concerned that follicles might not actually contain an egg? There?s something else to worry about.

pout - interesting your cycle went wappy when you started ttc.

I had 2 pregnancy announcements last night. One of which was MrJ?s ex ? a perfect madam and I?m not just saying that because she is his ex. He hadn?t heard from her in over a year and she wrote this lovey email about how wonderful it would be to catch up and then slipped in her delightful news at the end. I have no doubt she has heard through the grapevine (my MiL is friends with her mother) that the Joys have problems and she is just the type to enjoy rubbing it in his face. Sigh. Sorry I am going through a period of extreme frustration and at the moment with so many unanswered questions.

Waves to everyone else.

joycep she went to Dr Gorgy and had a full immunes screen. Since she got her results, at least one other person on the thread has directly approached the place in Greece to get the tests done direct.

What a bitchfacecow Mr J's ex is. Remember karma though - she will get her comeuppance somehow.

artemis at getting euro to shoot the fecker, liking the new moves for the fertility dance, the 2ww can be hell, i'm now worrying about delaying my period

dave you have a hidden talent for fancy dress ideas, although wasn't it you who said we should have our pee sticks in our pockets so we could identify each other :)

joyce ha that is exactly what I would want to right in the card!!! My ex has 3 kids now, the first was an entrapment baby, which clearly worked. Agree with euro about karma and her being a bitchfacecow Sorry you're feeling

critter hope the shot went well, I really don't like needles but need to man up soon, although colleagues at work have offered to help :)

euro how is the down regging going?? There seem to be a few people going to Dr Gorgy, a friend from another sight is seeing him soon.

purple how long till the finger finds you then??

Mr B went for a little hernia op, now they should always check 3 things before you go

1. blood pressure
2. that you have eaten something and kept it down
3. that you are not in retention and can pee.

when I went to pick him up last night he looked pale, they said he had low bp and they they would keep checking before letting him go, it kept yoyoing between 105/70 to 87/50. They let me bring him home, I felt we should have gone to St Helier for monitoring, but what the hell do I know as an NHS worker.

Managed to get him home, he nearly collapsed outside the building, got him into bed and fed him, as I was about to go to bed he asked if he could use the loo, I said the bowel or the loo, he said loo, anyway he fainted in the loo, so had to drag him out, I made him crawl on his hands and knees back to the bedroom threatening to call an ambulance. He has sat in the livingroom for a bit today but is now back in bed. I hardly slept last night, worrying and helping him, funnily enough I woke up thinking this is what it will be like to have a baby. I'm furious with Sutton Hospital for letting him come home and at myself for not saying something. I'm off tomorrow but might have to take another day off just to make sure he is ok.

buzzy oh my goodness. Your poor DH! Fainting in the loo, that is absolutely terrible, the poor thing. Thank goodness you were there to look after him. Hope he is feeling a little better now.

joyce about the horrible ex. All you can do is rise above it and be thankful that you're not her. It would be really awful to be trapped in that nasty personality, looking at the world through a spiteful lens. Really interesting about the infections - that does make sense. I wish doctors would be a bit more open-minded about what they might not know.

dave/pout add me to the admirers of your wedding outfit suggestion for princess. Genius, absolute genius!

purple I hope that magic finger is about to alight on you. Middle Eastern drugstores - wow, I'd love to have a poke around in there!

artemis hope your 2ww is going ok. Fingers crossed for you! I like the idea of the full-on fertility outfit. Love how extra random clothing items are being added on!

nelly that is progress about the IVF visit, although I know it's not where you want to be and I can totally understand the ambivalence. I am sure it feels very weird indeed - oh, and I am about the 'relaxation' area. What will they think of next?

gin love the 'where there's a womb there's a way'! Well done on seducing Mr Gin. It only takes one sperm - I really, really, really hope that one little guy makes it to the right place.

Waves to sarlat, wine, teu, mrsd, princess, lemons, beryl and carrie, and everyone else. Come on big finger!

I gave myself the trigger shot last night and I'm not sure I did it right - I don't think I got the needle very deep and there was a little lump and a couple of drops of the serum on my skin afterwards, so I may have just squirted less than the full dose just under the skin and I think it has to go in the fat. It wasn't difficult or particularly painful, just a bit weird - definitely a case of mind over matter.

I had an anxiety dream last night that Mr C was separated from me by an avalanche and we had to SWI, but couldn't because there was all this snow in the way. My subconscious is clearly not very original in its attempts to deal with the pressure of trying to catch the elusive golden egg. He's off to see a baseball game tonight so I'm going to leap on him, Planets a-blaring, when he gets home. We did the deed this morning too - the full belts n braces approach.

Critter - the trigger shot sounds fine. I think I got a lump too and always a small drop of liquid seemed to to be on the skin. I did ask my nurses if it's possible to do it wrong but they didn't think so. GOOD LUCK my lovely.

Joy - grrr to the weirdo ex gf. Gah - that is the worst kind of pregnancy announcement.

Joy - can you remember where you read about hydrosapinx and antibiotic therapy? I know that this does happen but haven't found a good article or meaty piece of information. I need to go to my next consultantion armed with a PHD in hydros. That's great that you have emailed the Doc - I would love to know what response you get. How would I find out what Dr's would be willing to treat me with antib's and hydro etc?? - not sure how to search.

The antibiotic thing is sooo interesting. Especially considering you noticed changes after the M/C. Did you order the book Joy? I might. I am desperate for some antibiotics too. My mum suggested natural antibiotics as an alternative e.g. garlic remedy/tablets. She's as mental as me for coming up with batty ideas. But she strongly feels it is rediculas too consider tube removal at this stage when there are other things out there to experiment with- this gives me comfort cos she 'gets it' and is really on my side. I know I'm lucky. I hope if I ever get to be a mum I remember all of this.

Dave - love your fancy dress outfit for 'birds and the bees'. We should dress like this for our northern meet up.

Buzzy - luv - what the hell??? your poor dh. Thinking of the buzy household. Get him some sugary snacks. x

Artemis - ooooo another very intersting theory you have there about HSG and antib's. I guess a large collection of people describing there experiences and looking for patterns is a type of research programme. The fertility clinics may be missing a trick here. I often think our Dr's really need to start listening to individuals about there gut feelings and see if this can be matched to proven medical research / data. Oh and thanks for sorting the meetup - can't wait. x

Nelly - glad the IVF clinic went well. Sounds more like a spa than a clinic - very jelous. My clinic is just like any hospital outpatient - grim. Def get your bezzie to prescribe you a sneaky aunty B - you can be our guinie pig.

Hello to everyone else - off to watch the football now. Sorry - I do love it.

sarlat I could kiss you. Thank you for being so reassuring. Enjoy the football! :)

Evening. Mr Nelly isn't home yet (well has just arrived) so as I am starving, I have baked scones and eaten 3 (yes, 3) straight from the oven. [pigdog emoticon]

Anyway....

artemis I am very suspicious of the DR as my sister suffered badly with it and has scared me a little. That said, she is the type of person who suffers badly with sickness- gets migraines that make her throw up for about 2 days straight, so perhaps she is just more susceptible? Thanks for the PM on the meet-up :)

purple we never fail to believe the in the magic-dif cycle do we? Liking the sound of your new business venture. I'll be a customer.

Love the fancy dress ideas from pout. I agree, isn't the wifi the most important part of any IVF treatment . Still, means I'll be able to keep you lot updated!

euro phew for no weddings; though I have to say, I hope none of my friends are dreading mine! Now all I have to hope is that none of the guests choose to use my wedding day as the day they announce their happy news . I will have to go through my guest list and figure out potential suspects.

joy I guess the follies thing is to do with anovulatory cycles, though it's probably unusual. I'm not sure I'd treat that as a reason NOT to do natural IVF though. Hooray (honestly) for your colleague's baby. And FFS for MrJoy's ex. She will get hers, agree with euro, Karma says it's so.

buzzy EEK at MrB, hope he feels better soon. Another splendid example of superior, joined-up treatment and aftercare from the NHS???

Well done on the trigger shot critter and good luck with getting MrC's attention away from baseball! Perhaps wear a cheerleader outfit for his return .

sar haha at IVF Day spa. Sounds nicer than the IVF crack house . But is it very wrong that I said on the tour "oh this is a nice room, looking forward to having a lie down in here in the middle of the working day..." . I really do feel my priorities are perhaps a bit skew-iff...

Right dinner now nearly ready, albeit I could happily have just had scones for tea (for avoidance of doubt, pronounced Skon!). Wonder where they fit in princess brown diet. Somewhere far off the bottom of the bad scale, I'm guessing? But they were homemade .

Poor MrB! I hope he's better now.

I have had a bit of a shocker this evening - came home to a letter saying my smear test was abnormal. This is my first ever abnormal result. Helpfully, the accompanying leaflet says to retest after 6 months and not to get pregnant until it is all resolved. I AM 36 AND IN THE MIDDLE OF AN IVF CYCLE YOU UTTER LADYPARTS. Ahem. Anyway, I have a GP appointment on Monday and will try to get a gynae referral so I can get some advice asap before I get to egg collection. But what godawful timing. If I were to get pg, I would just have to worry until I could retest post pregnancy, which even if this IVF worked would be in a year rather than 6 months. So it might be better to freeze embryos instead. Or maybe I am just being hopelessly optimistic at the thought that I might be pregnant by December. Fucksticks.

euro sorry to hear about your results , timing couldn't be bloody worse, its a bit like being in the twighlight zone, I had an abnormal result some time ago I was about 23, I think my GP gave me some antibiotics?? Certainly didn't mention not getting pregnant, but that was back home and a very long time ago, hopefully they can treat this quickly, did it say what they had found, how the hell do they think a woman can relax and get on with life when she has something like that hanging over her for 6 months, anyway big hugs x

Thanks bee. It showed mild abnormalities only, which perhaps should be comforting but isn't...

Oh Euro that's awful and not what you need. You could go get another one straight away if you explain. I've had that result before and was put on 6 monthly and then yearly. It never went more than that first result and I hope yours doesn't.

Oh bloody hell euro. You couldn't make it up. What a nightmare . I'm sure it will all turn out to be fine, but in the meantime, a whole load of worry and potential delays to TTC is not what you need. Huge hugs for you :(

euro i hope GP can shine a bit more light on the situation, it would still help to explain what is going on and what your options are instead of expecting you to sit around for 6 months with your legs crossed

Euro - sorry about your smear result, what utter crap timing. I agree with what others have said about pushing for a second smear asap. I think you can pay from them privatly too if absolutly necessary.

My freind had this letter - and in her case it was just thrush but the letter had that standard line on it.

In some ways, this could be a blessing in disguise??? Maybe whatever this is needed to be resolved before pregnancy to be succesful?? Hopefully it will be an easy thing to resolve. And your frozen embryo idea is a good back up plan. Whilst on that subject, frozen embryo tansfers can even be better for some women I have read.

God luck and push, push, push for a rapid re-test or discussion. x

Artemis thanks for getting me back here, god knows what I have done with the thread. I really wanted to get back here having read your post euro late last night. Fucksticks, indeed. Really hope you get some answers from your GP. Thinking of you.

Oh god Euro what awful news. Timing couldn't have been worse... fucksticks indeed. Can you get any more detailed info about what 'abnormal' means? Sometimes it's to do with inadequate assessment of the sample. That one word doesn't give you much to go on. Your IVF consultant should be able to advise? The prospect of a 12 month wait to find out what is going on is frightening but so too is the prospect of abandoning the long-awaited IVF cycle. To offer a bit of reassurance though, I think abnormal samples are quite common. I had 2 friends who were treated for that in their early 30s and both have gone on to have healthy children. Hugs and fingers crossed, I hope you get more info soon.

Purple hope you found the thread! Yes, the irrationality of the 2ww. I am feeling distinctly periody today. No doubt the ERTD will arrive just in time for the weekend, like the bitch she is

Hello Dave (said in a League of Gentlemen stylee ). Loving the Rhubarb & Custard ovulation theme tune. Mine might be the Smiths' "please please please let me get what I want" played on repeat while I berate the fecking lazy contrary fertility gods and dance about in my horned helmet, futilely waving sparkly knobs and pee sticks in their general direction. If only Morrissey had waved pee sticks instead of gladioli. Guaranteed to work

Joy at MrJ's ex, she sounds like a right bitch. Agree with the karma theory - it will catch up with her in the end.

Sarlat I agree the fertility specialists should pay more attention to the detail of what people are telling them and not be so fixated on their standard procedures. I feel I have been on a conveyor belt along with everyone else and they have dismissed many of my questions (eg about pre-AF spotting, short luteal phase, cycles gone wacky after MC) as irrelevant because they have a predetermined course of action that they are not going to change. It's great that your mum is supportive, it makes a real difference when the people close to you take your concerns seriously.

Critter well done on the trigger shot. I'm sure it will have been fine - I don't think they would send you away to administer these things yourself if the margin of error was wide. Well done on the belt and braces SWI and fingers crossed for you

Nelly Scones! ooh scones... Are you getting married soon? Wise to comb the guest list and earmark anyone who may arrive wielding preg news. Surely making that kind of announcement on someone else's big day is just plain rude.

So the northern meet... as predicted there isn't a date everyone can do but there are a few that suit 4 of the 5 of us... I shall message you all to see if there is any potential for movement. Alternatively we could go into September but I think a few people said they were away then so it might be no go. I am liking Dave's costume suggestions

Waves to everyone, hope it's a good day where you are.

Buzzy I forgot to ask about your DH - how is he? I can't believe they would send him home like that. Hope he is on the mend x