Vegetarians invited themselves for Christmas- got beef ordered!

[EdenFlower]

So, my vegetarian relatives and asked if they can join us for Christmas? I have it planned- joint of beef on order, I've perfected my roast potatoes and like them cooked in beef dripping, likewise the yorkshire pudding, my sprout recipe is cooked with pancetta, starter is parma ham and figs...and so on! Grrr! Now everything will need to adapted to be veggie because I'm not doing two versions of everything. It was already adapted to be gluten free for MIL but now two more special diet guests is a push.

Would it be rude to ask them to bring their own veggie options with them- nut roast and vegetarian gravy or whatever it is they eat?

@BIWI

Yes, that would be very rude!

You haven't actually bought or cooked anything yet, so plenty of time to change your plans.

But why should she have to change her plans? I'd say they're welcome but the food will be meat-based. You could provide some sort of bung-in-the-oven nutroast thing as well but I wouldn't cancel what you've planned to cook.

Make up Christmas type stuffing to a thick consistency mix with cooked mashed veg, parsnip onion turnip. form into balls and roast. Freeze

No not at all rude. Your side of it is to provide the venue, the company ,drinks etc. Eg I don’t drink so always bring own AF Drinks. I’m also surrounded by veggies and like their food so it’s fine to mix this way. Just talk it through with them so the menu works.

Say no or warn them you will be cooking a huge beef joint and they must bring their own food to avoid cross contamination

Roasties cooked in beef dripping- YUK. A chippy near here did this when they started and soon moved back to veg oil. Much better to use veg oil but then half way through the roasting add herbs/spices and vinegar. Wow.
You could do some brussels with sea salt and almonds flaked over them- nice
Grab a 'Beyond' meat burger from sainsburys and cook that maybe bake in sliced puff pastry with some marmalade to give an xmas taste. Cranberry homemade sauce.
Now that I would eat even as a meat eater. Plus quite easy to prepare and you won't make the veggies feel bad. Perfect host.

Most chip shops near me use beef dripping, taste better apparently

I’m surprised at the dislike for olive oil roasties. I’ve always done mine like that and they get rave reviews.

I wouldn't use an extra virgin olive oil, as someone upthread said, it has a much lower smoking point and can burn, or just leave the potatoes seeming sticky, not crispy.

A light, blended olive oil is generally okay though. Still no match for beef dripping or goose fat but nothing wrong with it. You'll have decent results with solid hydrogenated vegetable fat like Trex, but it's terribly bad for you.

A cold pressed rape seed oil or coconut oil works well with roasties. I have to say I've always thought it odd we celebrate the birth of Jesus by killing animals. Maybe thats just me.

I would have tell them right there that they are welcome to come but you would be cooking meat. They would probably offer to bring their vegetarian food.

I would expect that they will offer to bring something anyway. Just ask them to bring their own nut roast. Onion gravy is dead easy to make and freeze extra of next time you have toad in the hole. And do microwave sprouts.

If it were me I'd run out of oven space so it just wouldn't work, will you be ok for oven/hob space?

Also, people who invite themselves are also rude in my view 🤣

For myself, if you're going to invite people to your home for dinner, I think you cook something everyone can eat. Otherwise you make one group of people feel like an imposition. I have vegan friends and I think if they were coming to see me, I'd cook something everyone could eat. As a vegetarian, I hate it when there is one dish 'for you' and others for everyone else. I think it is rude. It feels rude, and it's more of an obligation to be there than an enjoyment. I'd never ask anyone to bring their own food with them!

Wow. Hoe entitled. I cook for friends very frequently and I would NEVER expect the entire group to eat vegetarian or vegan for the sake of one guest. I am very happy to cook a seperate main for them, I don't expect them to just pick around the side dishes and make the best of it, but NO WAY would I expect the whole group to go meat/dairy/egg free. I want people to really enjoy the food I make them and as inventive as I am, dedicated meat eaters almost always feel there is something missing in a vegetarian meal and especially a vegan meal. It's not so much the slab of meat itself, it's the way meat changes the flavour and texture profile. Even a really nice veggie dish can often end up feeling like a fancy side dish rather than the main event. It can taste a bit one-dimensional in comparison to a dish where meat or fish have been used - even sparingly. With vegan food that is magnified x 1000 in my opinion. And then there's the frankly bizarre and unpleasant things vegans use to subsitute and replicate cheese and meat and butter etc. Urrgh. Just no.

I eat quite a bit of vegetarian food out of choice but I love cheese, I love lentils and beans, I love mushrooms, I love squash and beetroot and almost all vegetables - not everybody does.

What I often do is something like curries, so I can make a meat, fish and a veggie one and anyone can have a bit of any of them. That way it doesn't draw attention to the fact that one person is being served something separate.

But depending on the occasion and what I wanted to cook, I wouldn't think twice about serving one separate dish to the veggie/vegan. My SIL is not a veggie but is a very fussy eater who hates garlic , wine, onions and any trace of spice. I always cook separately for her. There is NO WAY I am inflicting some bland, substandard nursery food on the whole table just because one person eats like a child. And it's the same with vegans or vegetarians.

If I got the vibe that you found that 'rude' I'd not be cooking for you again. Problem solved.

Make up Christmas type stuffing to a thick consistency mix with cooked mashed veg, parsnip onion turnip. form into balls and roast. Freeze
…and then throw it in the bin?

@youjustfolditin do you have room for me for Christmas Dinner and for every other dinner, your cooking sounds lovely

Well yes, there is now, because @EstherTW has ben bumped from the guest list for ungratefulness.

Only time I get vexed is when u get bloody pasta for xmas. Just give me the veg and I bring my own gravy and I'm happy. Not bothered as long as I get sprouts and mash. Cheap date eh!

can burn, or just leave the potatoes seeming sticky, not crispy.

I’ve not had this at all! They’re really crispy and olive oil has a nicer flavour than some other oils mentioned. They are a big hit, good roast potatoes are practically family tradition

I feel like I need to taste one of these beef ones to know the difference

Most chip shops near me use beef dripping, taste better apparently

Still? That does surprise me. It used to be standard to cook chips in tallow, which is a form of beef dripping. McDonalds did it up until 1990. McDonalds officianados insist they've never tasted as good since. I don't think they would have tasted obviously 'meaty' - the tallow would be too refined/processed for that, but the flavour profile would have been subtly different for sure.

Up until the 1980s in the UK everyone used dripping or lard for almost all frying. Then we started using those solid blocks of hydrogenated vegetable fat because everyone was told that animal fat would kill us. Hilarious, given what we now know about hydrogenated vegetable fats.

We didn't really start using olive oil or olive oil blends for anything until the mid eighties and early nineties. You could only buy it in pharmacies for putting in your ears to soften ear wax!

Rapeseed oil wasn't really a thing until much later than that - probably the noughties? Sunflower or vegetable oil was the default for doing a fried egg, or sweating onions/browning meat in a pan or something, but most people still had a chip pan full of solid lard unti the 1990s. Solid animal fats for cooking roast potatoes was the norm, and lard was used for making pastry. Lard (rendered pork fat) is still used an awful lot in parts of south and central America.

Even today in provincial France, if you have chips or sauteed potatoes in most bistros they will use animal fat to cook them. Usually goose fat. Vegetarianism is still considered a strange abomination by most French people outside of big cities. They've barely come to terms with that and there is rarely anything veggie on the menu for, so goodness knows how they cope with vegans. They probably take you out the back and shoot you for offending the chef.

I know it's frustrating to update a menu once you have plans, but you sound quite competent in kitchen and only need to adapt a little bit.

I'd personally just do a separate small side dish of roast potatoes and sprouts (roasted together with some garlic and veg oil), use veg oil just for their yorkshires, some soft goats cheese for the Figs in the starter, and a nice 'main' the extra of which might accompany the main food anyway (whole roast cauliflower with sauce, or slow roast swede with honey and mustard)

The key is to think complementary rather than complete rethink, I think.

Not much of an issue. The fact they’ve invited themselves might be but depends on the relationship you have with them. Blue cheese and a few walnuts with figs for starter. Before you put roasties in dripping set a few aside and add sunflower oil. Buy veggie main option and gravy from M&S (marigold do a good instant gravy version tho especially if you add water from veggies). Buy ready done sprouts in microwaveable bag. Exclude Yorkshire puds as there’s so much anyway. No stress job done 😜

Traditional Fish and Chip shops round here mostly use beef dripping by default.

Do they Eden? I wonder if mine do too then? I've never questioned it, to be honest. Just assumed they'd all moved to veg oils now. I do love fish and chip shop chips beyond all others, which generally i can take or leave. Maybe that's why? I'm going to ask next time!

There is a nice looking make ahead vegan gravy recipe in the new River Cottage book. Happy to post if it’s helpful.

dedicated meat eaters almost always feel there is something missing in a vegetarian meal and especially a vegan meal.

Clearly you don't know how to cook good vegetarian or vegan food.

@EdenFlower

Traditional Fish and Chip shops round here mostly use beef dripping by default.

You must be up north somewhere.

Clearly you don't know how to cook good vegetarian or vegan food.

I can see why it's tempting to say things like that, as a defensive reaction to people who say they don't particularly enjoy vegetarian food, but the fact is that if most people enjoyed it as much, or more than they enjoy non-vegetarian food, then many more millions of people would be vegetarian. It really is that simple.

People don't continue to ram meat down their throats in spite of enjoying a non-meat diet more, just because of some principle/belief that meat must be eaten. They do it because they prefer it.