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MNers without children

This board is primarily for MNers without children - others are welcome to post but please be respectful

Original poster

Why do they take it personally?

214 replies

BadCider · 04/09/2023 08:18

I consider myself happily childfree.

I've never actively wanted a baby - I assumed I'd get the 'urge' but never did. I love my freedom, never felt anything missing.

Around 10 years ago I needed surgery and during this, another issue was discovered and more tests were carried out; long story short, if I wanted children then I would need IVF and even then the chance would be tiny. I cannot conceive naturally.

I remember thinking phew, that's lucky I don't see myself as a mother because that would be devastating! And carried on with my life.

I'm active and in a lot of groups/clubs and meet lots of new people regularly, and with work I travel a lot and smalltalk is needed. So inevitably I'm asked "do you have kids" quite a lot. By women.

When I answer "no" then 80% of them follow up with "oh did you not want them?"

I've found a huge difference in reaction when I give one of two answers- either I say "I can't have children" and I'm met with sympathy and 'oh I'm so sorry' the conversation changes and the interaction continues warmly.

But if I say "I didn't want children." Then I'm met with 'oh' and it's a noticeably less warm interaction.

My feeling is that it's taken as a personal affront, they're offended that I made a different choice, they think I hate kids (I don't).

But me not having kids doesn't mean I judge them for having them - that would be so ridiculous, everyone is different, we all enjoy different things, have different lives etc.

I just wanted to vent! This happened last night at a group, and I was getting on well with a woman until I said I didn't have kids, didn't want them, (she asked) and she actually just blanked me after that!

Incidentally, my husband is never asked. 🙄

OP posts:
PrincessOfTigger · 05/09/2023 09:42

Querypost · 05/09/2023 09:35

@PosterBoy

I'll start off by saying that I have two young children.

what "important values" would you not share with someone just because they didn't have children? Are people without children devoid of values?

People become "immediately uninteresting" to you because they decided not to have children? In my mind, people like myself who have children would be the least interesting as you have to prioritise them in the early years. I'll have 12 years with an under 8 year old! I'd say if I met someone my age who hadn't spent the last 12 years rearing young children, they'd have had a damn sight more interesting life than me and I'd be all ears! It's a shame that you might miss out on good relationships out of misplaced, unfounded opinions about people you don't even know. Sad.

Edited

I guess it depends. Usually it wouldn’t make a difference whether or not someone had kids. I don’t think the “why” is any of my business. I get judged enough for my own choices 😆 But some people in this thread have expressed that they find the lives of mums tragic, that we regret having our kids and we’re jealous of people that don’t have any, or that we talk about our children too much not because we like them and are proud of them but because we don’t have anything meaningful to talk about - so I probably would switch off from listening to those specific people, sure!

PosterBoy · 05/09/2023 09:57

Strawberryboost · 05/09/2023 09:37

@PosterBoy

my suspicion is… you are rather lonely and tend to socialise just with family

I wish!

I'm not a massive fan of socialising, that's true enough. I dream of just hanging out with good friends and family only.

You can have a go if you want, if it makes you feel good, I literally couldn't care less.

Someone asked why some women react the way they do. I gave my personal perspective. It's hardly just me reacting that way, is it? It's, as I said, much less dramatic than jealousy. It's pretty much boredom.

You must all have some kinds of people where you find out something about them and just instantly kind of turn off?

LaMarschallin · 05/09/2023 09:57

But some people in this thread have expressed that they find the lives of mums tragic, that we regret having our kids and we’re jealous of people that don’t have any, or that we talk about our children too much not because we like them and are proud of them but because we don’t have anything meaningful to talk about - so I probably would switch off from listening to those specific people, sure!

Obviously if someone expresses those views to you, that's unpleasant and most people don't want to engage with someone who's being unpleasant.
But that's different from switching off from people just because they don't have children.

or that we talk about our children too much not because we like them and are proud of them but because we don’t have anything meaningful to talk about

I do switch off from people who talk "too much' about their children, regardless of why they do it.

Strawberryboost · 05/09/2023 10:00

@PosterBoy

I strikes me as very rude if nothing else

KimberleyClark · 05/09/2023 10:01

But some people in this thread have expressed that they find the lives of mums tragic, that we regret having our kids and we’re jealous of people that don’t have any, or that we talk about our children too much not because we like them and are proud of them but because we don’t have anything meaningful to talk about - so I probably would switch off from listening to those specific people, sure!

I can’t see that anyone has said mums’ lives are tragic on this thread. But it is a fact that some people do regret having children.

Original poster
BadCider · 05/09/2023 10:03

PosterBoy · 05/09/2023 09:24

I wouldn't be asking, personally, although it sounds like other people do - bit of a risky question to ask someone you don't know well.
So in my case it's information volunteered by the other person.

I just switch off, tbh, at that point. It's a lot less dramatic than jealousy or feeling slighted. More like boredom.

Show quote history

I'm really grateful you posted, it does show that I'm not 'seeing shadows' and there are people IRL who are genuinely unintereted in someone that doesn't have children; as a people-person who finds everyone unique and interesting no matter their background or circumstances this is is baffling to me, so thank you for sharing.

OP posts:
Strawberryboost · 05/09/2023 10:05

BadCider · 05/09/2023 10:03

I'm really grateful you posted, it does show that I'm not 'seeing shadows' and there are people IRL who are genuinely unintereted in someone that doesn't have children; as a people-person who finds everyone unique and interesting no matter their background or circumstances this is is baffling to me, so thank you for sharing.

Show quote history

But this person blanks anyone she doesn’t share commonality with.

Everyone else on the thread aghast at this!

She just sounds very very rude to many many people rather than you using it as proof

fitzwilliamdarcy · 05/09/2023 10:18

@Strawberryboost It's funny how you said "I'd be floored if anyone blanked you for not having kids", and now that someone has said that they do just that, you're all "yes but they'd blank anyone, it's not just about kids!".

I just find it really arrogant that you're so invested in convincing @BadCider that their perception of their experiences is wrong.

iamwhatiam23 · 05/09/2023 10:21

Im a mother of 4 dc but even i have noticed that women who choose not to have children are treated as though they are some kind of abnormal monster by other women! I really don't understand how people can get so offended by another woman's life choices that don't affect them in any way! Its absolutely bizarre!

Beangrove · 05/09/2023 10:34

When I've come across this it tends to be more from people with a provincial / small-town mindset. I lived in London for a long time, well into my 40s. Had a real mix of friends and colleagues probably 50/50 across all sorts of spectrums - single/coupled-up, married/non-married/divorced, gay/straight/bi, parents/non-parents. I'd occasionally get asked if I had kids but more in a passing, getting to know you type way, just part of a bigger picture / wider conversation. Not a big deal.

And then I moved back to my hometown and started a new job - I had several women in my new office just ask me 'how old are your kids' - not if I had them even, just how old they were. And I'd say, oh I don't have any. And they'd say, so you moved out of London to start a family then, and I'd say no, not planning to have children. And they would look confused, and kind of end the conversation, and that was that. I did get the odd 'oh you don't want them then?' and I'd just say 'No, I don't like children very much' . Which isn't actually true, but by the time this had happened a couple of times it was seriously pissing me off!

Funnily enough I never got that kind of thing from the men in the office.

KimberleyClark · 05/09/2023 10:38

I remember at a retirement do meeting a female colleague who had worked alongside me for about five years - long enough to know I didn’t have children. The first thing she asked me was how my children were.

Strawberryboost · 05/09/2023 10:40

KimberleyClark · 05/09/2023 10:38

I remember at a retirement do meeting a female colleague who had worked alongside me for about five years - long enough to know I didn’t have children. The first thing she asked me was how my children were.

Precisely
proves my point how thoroughly disinterested people generally are about the life’s of those not their family or friend

Tinklyheadtilt · 05/09/2023 10:45

I think it is a few things

Jealousy - some people probably hate being parents but cannot bring themselves to admit it, when they see someone childfree and loving life they don't like it

Lack of intelligence - been brainwashed to believe that the only point of life is to have kids and cannot comprehend anyone not having that mindset

Lack of life experience - similar to the above, the person has had no experience of all the rich things life can offer (travel for example) and cannot understand why someone would choose that

Tinklyheadtilt · 05/09/2023 10:47

Phos · 04/09/2023 09:58

I think it's that there are a number of childfree by choice people who can be quite vitriolic in giving their reasons why and get quite nasty - so unfortunately people might (unfairly) assume you may be one of that crew and back off.

What absolute nonsense.

PosterBoy · 05/09/2023 10:53

BadCider · 05/09/2023 10:03

I'm really grateful you posted, it does show that I'm not 'seeing shadows' and there are people IRL who are genuinely unintereted in someone that doesn't have children; as a people-person who finds everyone unique and interesting no matter their background or circumstances this is is baffling to me, so thank you for sharing.

Show quote history

I don't think you are imagining it at all! People (it's women, we all know that) will do it but not admit (perhaps even to themselves) that they are doing it.

I don't do it to 'anyone' I don't have communality with, but you would probably find my other examples insulting and I wouldn't set out to offend on an issue like choosing not to have kids. I wouldn't be directly comparing. Just there are some people I know I won't find common ground with and can't really be bothered with. I switch off.

It's a bit of a reach for some posters to cling to 'lack of intelligence' or 'lack of life experience ' although there might be something in the everywhere else vs London thing. Maybe in certain careers as well?

AlisonDonut · 05/09/2023 10:57

If asked about kids [which incidentally doesn't happen very often at all], I answer that the thought of having them would be like entering the seventh circle of hell so anyone who doesn't want to share this particular value is fine to blank me. You will be no loss to my life.

Tinklyheadtilt · 05/09/2023 10:59

It isn't a reach, I have seen it time and time again. Its really tedious.

HollyhocksAndFoxgloves · 05/09/2023 11:00

Maybe you should retort with ‘why DO you have children’ to those who ask. Bet not many can answer that easily

This^

If I've been asked if I have children (I don't because I don't want to be a parent.)
After my reply I say, politely:

So, turning the question on its' head. Why DO you have children ?

This is usually followed by silence. The person looks awkward and would rather not say and frankly wish I hadn't asked and anyway is it any of my damn business ?

So, as far as I'm concerned, the question isn't why didn't I have children as why DID YOU ?

(Crock of shit, isn't it, parenting ?)

KimberleyClark · 05/09/2023 11:09

PosterBoy · 05/09/2023 09:24

I wouldn't be asking, personally, although it sounds like other people do - bit of a risky question to ask someone you don't know well.
So in my case it's information volunteered by the other person.

I just switch off, tbh, at that point. It's a lot less dramatic than jealousy or feeling slighted. More like boredom.

Show quote history

May I ask about the context in which the other person announced they were childfree by choice? Because I find it hard to believe anyone would, unless the conversation was already about children or they had been directly asked.

Strawberryboost · 05/09/2023 11:10

fitzwilliamdarcy · 05/09/2023 10:18

@Strawberryboost It's funny how you said "I'd be floored if anyone blanked you for not having kids", and now that someone has said that they do just that, you're all "yes but they'd blank anyone, it's not just about kids!".

I just find it really arrogant that you're so invested in convincing @BadCider that their perception of their experiences is wrong.

Did you read the post from @PosterBoy ?

she makes clear her rudeness and boredom is to anyone who she doesn’t have commonality with

Strawberryboost · 05/09/2023 11:11

Maybe you should retort with ‘why DO you have children’ to those who ask

I would love to be asked this!

Uterusbegone · 05/09/2023 11:16

PosterBoy · 05/09/2023 07:07

For me, it's not jealousy or taking it personally.

It's just that you've short handedly announced a few qualities about yourself that cause me to stop having any further interest in you as a person beyond a really shallow level.

Some people are like that with people's political views, for a different example.

Bloody hell that's a take. I think it very much shows people qualities about you rather than the people you are talking to.

RhymesWithTangerine · 05/09/2023 11:28

Jealousy - some people probably hate being parents but cannot bring themselves to admit it, when they see someone childfree and loving life they don't like it

I don’t think this a thing. They might be jealous of a happy parent who enjoys having children but that’s the limit of any ‘jealousy’.

KimberleyClark · 05/09/2023 11:38

RhymesWithTangerine · 05/09/2023 11:28

Jealousy - some people probably hate being parents but cannot bring themselves to admit it, when they see someone childfree and loving life they don't like it

I don’t think this a thing. They might be jealous of a happy parent who enjoys having children but that’s the limit of any ‘jealousy’.

Try Googling “are parents jealous of the childfree”. You’ll find it is a thing. Perhaps not a huge thing, but definitely a thing.

Switcher · 05/09/2023 11:42

I avoid asking anyone why they don't have children, because I've no idea what I would do with the answer. I just take it at face value and carry on talking about whatever we had in common in the first place. Probably helped by the fact I'm ambivalent about what becoming a mother has meant for me. It's really nosy to ask if you're not friends.