For those of you who wrote negative things to Ema76 about her CS will you please read this.....

[Shooflypie]

because I am really, really shocked by some of the things that were said to her. I am repeating some of what I wrote on the original post on the basis that I think this issue is important.

I recently had an el cs for exactly the same reasons as Ema76. My mother had a 48 hour labour, forceps delivery, severe tearing which led to incontinence in later life (and further operations), was sectioned with severe PND, which lasted for over a year.

She said it was the worst thing that ever happened to her.

My experience was that my consultant took my fear of VB VERY seriously and his view was that a VB would put me at risk of PND and not bonding with my baby. (And btw I am perfectly robust in all respects other than this particular issue.)

I did have counselling, which was great and sorry but their goal is NOT to persuade you out of a CS as some posters assume.

I had an elcs and it was a fantastic experience. And the recovery was fine. And DS did NOT having breathing difficulties and he DID BF while I was still in the theatre.

Please take note of the following in particular:
A significant additional part of my anxiety and distress prior to the cs being offered, was that I was afraid of other women being judgemental of me.

I was so afraid of this I considered lying about the reasons for having a cs, or even trying for a VB (in the hope it would end in an em cs).

Due to a clued up consultant, a hospital psychologist, and a wonderfully supportive DP, I had the birth that was right for me and it has got our life as a family off to a flying start.

I am now very upfront about why I did have an el cs in the hope that it will be helpful to women like Ema.

I really don't understand why having a VB matters SO MUCH to some people that they think it is OK to behave with such viciousness to a pg woman? Or anyone.

Please will you reflect on the experience that I've outlined here and maybe try to be a bit more empathetic when someone tells you she wants a CS.

And bear in mind that a consultant and a pychologist took the opposite view to you.

yep, that's what worries me about this poster, www. as mother-of-three fiofio pointed out when ema said on the other thread that she wouldn't be having any more kids, life isn't always like that.

ema76, after having a totally natural drug free birth, i had a 4th degree tear, there are serious very serious risks of having vaginal births.
i still have problems with it now.

you do what you feel is best for you and your baby.

good luck.

leave Ema alone.
so what if she's phobic about giving birth?
it's not her fault.
let her deal with her fears in the way that she chooses.
Please.

Well, DillyTanty, I'm happy for you if that's your view, but mine remains as expressed. I don't feel she was rude or abrasive, just determined, and disinterested in differing views. It was her family's experience that mattered to her, not those of people she can't even see typing on a screen, which I would regard as wholly reasonable. She never said their experiences weren't valid for them, just that they weren't for her - and again, that seems reasonable. And given some of the things said she was actually very polite - certainly more so than many of the other posters were to her. I also reiterate that I do not think dislike for someone's demeanour justifies attack on their character, their mother or their mothering.

Agree to differ it is.

just wondering....

is it just the birth you are scared of???

are you also scared of contractions???

you may (may, may not, but I did three times), go into prem labour at 28wks. I still had to suffer full on contractions, in my first pregnancy for over 2dys, while they battled to stop labour.

luckily, they did, but it was a long hard battle for a while!

if that happens to you, you will clearly not be ready for them to still give you CS as you will want them to do all things possible to keep your baby inside, so you may in fact still need to go thro labour, in part, IYGWIM.

are you ready for that (tiny admittedly, but you just do not know) possibility???

I only wonder, as you state that you will be having regular scans from 30wks....that will not help if you do as I did.

you do need to prepare I think for some contractions still.......you are planning an ElCS, I am glad that your consultant has agreed, you will relax better and enjoy your pregnancy, but you still do not know what will happen in the net few months.

i didn't see the polite declines, tbh jojosmaman, i really didn't. i thought, reading the thread, that the OP was pretty rude from the off. clearly people see different things, which is presumably why they have different answers to give. that's the rich tapestry, innit...

I had my elective section at 39 weeks + a day or so

I had no shows, no braxton hicks, no waters breaking, nada.

If it wasn't for the horrendous morning sickness for 9mths and the baby at the end, I'd have suspected the pregnancy was in my mind!

RAH/Paisley only does them at 39 weeks.

if you need one, and you are far away, they make you check into hospital at 37 weeks and cool your heels until the 39 weeks are up or you go into labour, whichever comes first.

38 weeks considered safe when factoring the 'risks' of trial of labour. Not to early, not too late.

36 weeks is usually pretty developed as far as lung maturity concerned.

Of course, ideally, you allow baby to develop until it's good and ready. But we dont live in an ideal world.

it's evidently 38 and a half weeks in the OP's case anyway.

not that she is the OP of this thread... must be thrilled at SHooflypie's intervention on her behalf.

Didn't see the original thread but as far as I'm concerned I don't give a flying f*ck how people give birth as long as it turns out well for them and it's a positive experience. What else can we/should we ask for as women/mothers? Surely we're all after the ultimate, end result: A healthy baby, good levels of support and care and a minimum of physical trauma and pain. In short, a positive birth experience.

Personally, I had an horrendous caesarean - enough to put me off having another baby, such is my fear that I'll have to go through that nightmare again. The terror, the agony, the lack of bonding, the PTSD/PND. Personally, I can't imagine ANYONE wanting to have a caesarean, but I'm well aware that I was just unlucky and there are plenty of people out there who are equally traumatised by nightmare vaginal births; it's just a different kind of trauma after all, and just a different kind of pain to endure and recover from. A 'good' caesarean can be much 'easier' than a 'bad' vaginal birth, and vice versa.

The sad fact is that there will always be competitive types and there will always be judgemental types. It has personally staggered me how often I've been accused of being "too posh to push" as a result of my emergency/crash caesarean (due to placenta praevia and a massive bleed). And then the legion of posts from people who dismiss caesareans as little more than a minor operation - implying that those of us who've had a rough time recovering from them are somehow "making a fuss" or "milking it".

Strive for the birth that you feel will work best for you and hope that you'll get it, or something close to it. Some of us will be lucky and some of us won't, but that's the lottery we all face. If that involves a scheduled caesarean or a homebirth or something and everything in between then all power to you. My experience is if that you're happy with your birth (however it takes place) then that's the best start to motherhood you can hope for.

K

they're never so precise up here. these people are all on Irish time, fgs! ds is measuring just outside the top line on the growth chart. 'ach, he's fine. he'll come when he's ready.'

yeah, but WHEN?!

when are you due expat?

I am hoping to have another in the not too distant future. How they arrive, I'm just going with the flow. Less hassle that way!

Hang on, I don't get this thread, let me get this right:

OP posted, lots of people replied, some negative, some positive, lots of opinion though as is our wont on mumsnet

OP didn't like it

New poster starts thread (this)saying "don't be mean to poor OP"

Wtf?

oh expat thats the question that no-one can answer

If only I could calculate such a thing...I'd be a millionaress ......

Down here its 38 weeks. (gives enough time to be admitted and then shelved if theatres get booked up be em/c/s )

For induction it is precisely 13 days after edd. again - gives a couple of days scope to shelve......

Wew have disappeared up our own bottoms!

28 October.

He's still way high. My uterus has stretched! Damn those pregnancy hormones!

Expat, my section is being done at 38 weeks, its elective at RAH.

Think its because my last baby was a failed induction for pre-ecl at 38 weeks, but I keep wondering if they have miscounted my weeks....

I've had 2 CS. One was done at 41+ weeks when I was in labour.
One was 39 weeks, elective.
I was surprised by the difference in the babies. The one at 41 weeks was big, fed easily, and just looked "ready"
The one that I had at 39 weeks was little, thin, and just looked premature. There werent any breathing difficulties, but seeing the difference between the 2 babies made me feel a bit uncomfortable about how things had turned out (not that I had any choice, but maternal guilt doesnt work like that does it).

Perhaps www, but I'm sure there is an op we can have to fix it

i suppose it could be 38 and a half plus a few days if there are emergencies coming in, expat.

kitstwins, sounds like you had a terrible time but the point surely is that you can but prepare yourself for the various eventualities and hope like hell that it works out. that's the issue at hand here, that the poster is ignoring what might otherwise happen.

apart from that, i don't think anyone much cares about how women have their children So Long As THey're Safe, do they? i've certainly NOT seen legions of posts on MN about how women who've had C/Ss had it easy, or had a minor op. in fact, that would be completely at odds with these two recent threads where broadly the OP's line of thinking has been questioned precisely because it is a serious operation.

its so varied here. I had a fairly straight forward section, DD was just breech and I only had PE. I got to go in the morning of the section, and had her at 39 + 1

A friend who had a section had slowly been losing her water (and baby breech), so they kept her in for a few weeks & then gave her a section when levels got too low, think she was before 38 weeks.

Same friend had another pg and had that liver thingy, she couldn't go past 37 weeks with that. Baby was also breech (not sure what it is about our office pregnancies and breechy babies!) but luckily turned so she ended up with induction rather than section.

ah, sherb, this would have been a first for me. IF DS hadn't turned. but he did .

yay!

cuz i really wouldn't have wanted to have to stay and stay waiting for it - but we're pretty far from there so it would be hang round and wait for me.

let's hope he STAYS head down.

how fab, an op to stop people disappearing up own bottoms!

i wish dd hadn't come at 38 weeks. i do think it gave us problems bfing, she was so tired and wee...