What do you wish a bf supporter in hospital had told you/done?

[FourArms]

I'm coming towards the end of my bf peer supporter course, and soon I'll be volunteering on the postnatal wards at our local hospital.

So... if a bf supporter had been available in your hospital, what would you have liked them to have done/told you/showed you?

I was v.lucky with DS1 and DS2. Although there were slight issues with both (c/s with DS1 and a spell in NICU for DS2) they were both v.easy to bf and it came very naturally to us all from feed one. We did have problems once we were home, so I have a lot of experience with these, but not much for problems in the early days.

Any thoughts will be gratefully received!

I wish the BF supporter in hospital who I saw on tues had f**d off TBH.

To the questions, is this your first child - no my second, and do you plan to breastfeed this one - yes, any problems feeding - no she could probably have ascertained that a twenty minute flim flam chat about NOTHING two hours after I had given birth when I was trying to get some peace was not welcome.

Twenty minutes of peace I will NEVER get back humph!

I tried and failed to BF with ds 1, wish someone had told me it wasnt working because he'd had pethadine, so was sleepy, so never established and that with much much patience it could get back on track. I cried so much over that

DS was more of a breeze- bloody painful and feeding constantly but i was so happy to be doing it 'right'/ I had spent a lot of time on that american BF website watching viseos which helped!!

Most un-useful as others have said was the conflicting advice from different midwives when in hospital/home. Most annoying. Saw BF expert second time round who was fab

ExistentialistCat - I feel for you, my daughter did the same as yours didn't want to come near me, it was torture for me. I felt that giving her formula was horrendous, but in the end she thrived and is a perfectly normal little girl.

I eventually had counselling for how I felt about it all, which helped but I still feel sad about it, but it has got easier. And you are not a failure at all, you did your best xxx

Getdown - Thankfully three of the girls from my NCT didn't get on with BF either so I felt OK with that, but still felt envious at the one's who did manage it. Sorry you have had such a tough time of it and I hope your feeling better about it now xx

I think it's important to mention that giving a bottle of formula isn't the end of breast feeding.
I've come across lots of mums who were so traumatised after the birth that they asked for formula at hospital to get the midwives off their back and to get some rest, but since milk doesn't come in until day three no real harm is done and there's no reason why they couldn't continue to successfully breast feed without the pressure of a very hungry baby.

I haven't read the whole thread so apologies if I'm duplicating.

I would say - don't be tempted in the early weeks to give a bottle of formula to try and get your baby to sleep through the night. Breast milk seems to be produced in abundance during the night, and substituting with formula then really will result in reduced breast milk supply.

I've seen loads of people fall into that trap.

Also, don't let HVs measure your breast-fed baby's weight by the standard growth charts. They are designed for formula-fed babies.

That breastfeeding can last for two hours non-stop

(Yes, MRS HV - he WAS getting milk - I could see it in the corner of his mouth)

Time, time, time. I had flat nipples and nobody "spoke" about it apart from one midwife briefly mentioning that it could be the problem. Not one midwife took the time to show me what I could do to get my baby to latch. They would just come along when I called and shove my breast in baby's face. The only real help I got was getting my husband to bring the breast pump in to the hospital so I could express.

ExistentialistCat, I can really relate to what you said as despite all support, etc. etc. I nearly gave myself a nervous breakdown trying to feed/express etc. and it just didn't work properly - I am crap at expressing and bless him, my son was crap at feeding. I also developed an anxiety disorder about germs etc. especially with following impossible bottle-feeding guidelines.

He's 3 now and it turns out he's got some problems with hyposensitivity in his mouth, not serious but means bfing was never going to happen. I got some breast milk into him and now count that as a success.

I have more perspective on it now because dd is the opposite - again it was horrible at first but then she got the hang of it and now she is 23 months and still bfing through the night, wanting milk all day etc. I'm having an awful time trying to get her to cut down to a sensible level and I only wish I'd appreciated the good aspects of ffeeding with my son instead of agonising over what couldn't be helped.

So I wish I'd been told with ds to relax! find the solution that was best for the family as a whole and be grateful we have such good choices available to us instead of the perils that faced poor feeders in days gone by.

I had a brilliant HV with dd, because she wasn't dogmatic - she just put her "bag of tricks" and experience at my disposal and helped me find a way through the confusion.

OMG Irons, that's exactly what happened to me. I thought breastfeeding was going to be a piece of piss (after reading the preggo books I bought). The books never mentioned flat nipples and neither did my MW or the BF session I went to. In hospital DS was shoved onto my boob screaming and didn't even try to latch as there was nothing to latch onto. Poor blighter was starving and so I eventually, in floods of tears at my uselessness, gave into formula. Every now and then a MW would come and try to shove his little mouth onto my boob which just caused him to scream even more. It still upsets me to think about it now 2 years later. I never got to breastfeed.

My hospital wasn't very supportive when I mentioned I wanted to breastfeed DD. I had an emergency C-Section and after that DD spent the first 3 days in the neonatal unit. No midwife came to help me even though in the neonatal unit asked me to espress some colostrum to feed my DD. She was been fed through a tube as I didn't wanted them to give her a bottle as I thought it would make more difficult my chances to BF her.

Once I was moved to the transitional care room the nurse kept telling me that my DD needed a top up of Formula as she was demanding to be fed every 1 hour, which later on I found out it was completly normal and necessary to produce more milk. I felt I didn't have any support at all in hospital because the midwifes were too busy with other things. DD even lost more than 15% of birthweight and noone recorded this when we were discharged until a midwife came to see us at home the following day.

In general my experience of breastfeeding in hospital was very poor and negative. However I have to say that due to my wish to breastfeed DD I have managed to exclusive breastefeed her up until she was 6 months. She is 7.5 months now and still loves mummy's milk and any solids that I give her.

I would ask a lot of more support for breastfeeding mothers, at least in the hospital where I gave birth. Also at the antenatal lessons they should talk more about breastfeeding. It also helps if once you are breastfeeding someone could explain you how your breast will change as I have a massive panic when DD was 4 months and suddenly my breasts started to change from being completly full all the time to just produce milk when it was needed. I wasn't aware of this and the first thing it came to my mind was that I was running out of milk and I would not be able to carry on breastfeeding my DD.

Hope this helps you and very good luck

I would have appreciated the bf consultant not grabbing my boob with already very sore nipples and pulling it around until a decent latch was achieved...it did not teach me anything.

Later went to a drop in where I was told to aim my nipple to the roof of my baby's mouth...three weeks in, this was the turning point for me.

More advice about the extent of demand feeding to avoid the horror of baby feeding all night at 8mo (this is me now).

Horror upon horror saying that it is a good idea once bf established to give a bottle of expressed breast milk once a day...just in case there was ever an issue with mum doing the feeding, and/or to give mum a break.

Finally the use of strategic bottles of expressed milk can be instrumental in establishing breast feeding, gives very sore nipples a rest and mum the strength to carry on. Also it is OK to breastfeed in the day, express at night - whilst partner gives a bottle.

I think the best thing that one of the nurses gave me in hospital with dd was time. On the third night, when I was sitting up sobbing again because dd wasn't latching on and I was in so much pain, a wonderful wonderful nurse came on shift.

She gave me a hug and said that I was getting myself all worked up for every feed when I tried to feed and then had to call for help to get dd latched on. She said that for that night, I wasn't to start any feed myself, I was to call her and she'd help me latch dd on. So there was no failure, no getting upset and passing that on to dd, no frustration for dd.

We spent the whole night feeding every 2 hrs, and each time, I'd call this lovely woman, she'd help us get settled then leave. I was more relaxed, dd was relaxed, between us we finally figured out what we were supposed to be doing. By the 8am feed, I told the nurse I felt ok to do it myself, and I did, while she stood over me telling me what a great job I was doing.

Just one night shift for her but it made all the difference for me. Fantastic. (BF dd till she was one, currently feeding 10m dd)

Sorry haven't read the whole thread, but wanted to say

1. If your baby wants to feed every hour at times, rather than every 4 hours (where where WHERE did I get that idea from??), it doesn't mean that you 'haven't got enough milk'.

2. BF may hurt at first, but if you are in AGONY (to the point where you are having to sing loudly when you BF to avoid screaming) there is something wrong with the latch. Get it seen to ASAP.

3. GET HELP GET HELP GET HELP!!! go to BF support groups if necessary when baby is a few days old.

4. Midwives know f* all about BF if the baby doesn't just do it themselves (apologies to any really good MWs out there, but that was my experience). Don't listen when they tell you everything is okay if you feel it isn't. See someone who knows. Don't listen when they say you should start topping up with formula. Get help from someone who knows.

I was someone for whom BF didn't just happen. It was a struggle. Am not bitter about it now (honest), just wish I'd known more at the time. Succeeded in the end but it was painful. Wish I'd got help sooner.

Less formula in hospitals- so depressing when you're trying to start breastfeeding.

also no formula *p info in Bounty etc - puts pressure to stop at the first opp.

more advice to take as much help as poss from partners/ mums etc in first 6weks- like with eating and drinking - that surprised me alot that i couldnt do alot for myself i.e. let others care for you while your feeding.

Do they still grab hold of your boobs when you are asleep and slap the baby on? Thats what they did when I had DD 18 years ago.

Woke up with my boob in an auxcillary's hand as she shoved DD on it whilst grunting at me.

Very odd alarming experience.

Advise them to get comfy on the sofa with a phone, the remote control, a long drink of water and some magazines, put your feed up and feed....and feed....and feed.........

The hours I spent on the flaming sofa - but don't regret any of it. BF for nearly 2.5 years.

I had been very keen to bf when I was pregnant with DS. I hoovered up as much info as I could handle pre-birth. Knew all about colostrum, baby not needing much in first few days, milk not coming in till day 3 etc. But what I didn't count on was ds developing mild jaundice less than 24 hours after being born, being told by the doctors to top up with formula and not really being supported with instruction.

They said I had three choices, bottle feed, tube feed or syringe feed. I had no idea what was involved in tube feeding or stringing and in my exhausted nervous guilt ridden state I opted for bottles as it sounded familiar and like something I could do. Despite my strong wishes to breastfeed at no point did any midwife or doctor advise me to tube or syringe feed if I wanted to return to ebf.

It took me 2 weeks of single-minded stubborness, the unerring support of my dh, mum and the wonderful advice and support of mn and various breastfeeding helplines to bring my milk in and wean ds off the bottle and back to boob.

If hospital paeds are going to insist on formula top ups then there needs to be adequate support for establishing bf alongside this. I made repeated requests for more help with bf on the post natal ward and occasionally a mw or carer would turn up an hour later and not say anything helpful.

Thankfully I managed to crack it and breastfed ds till 15mo, all the while surprised at how so many of my friends who had found it easier in the beginning gave up at 4 weeks, 3 months and 5 months.

I also second that women should be told about the effect of growth spurts on breastfeeding and how important that neverending sleepy suckling is for establishing supply in the early weeks (not just days). And to remember to enjoy the opportunity to put your feet up as there will be plenty of running around as baby gets more mobile.

Agree with the poster (sorry can't remember who!) who said about immobile mothers. I had a spinal then forceps birth and had to ASK midwife in recovery suite if she could pass me baby (who was in cot out of reach) so I could try bf (as I'd been told that babies are most awake for 1st 1-2hrs after birth so goo time to get going). I got baby, but she didn't ask if I needed any help.

Midwives on post-natal ward were useless.

Totally agree with all comments about "if it hurts its wrong". No one said that I should take a look at my nipples, and because one had a nobbly bit on the side (even before getting pg), it would be likely to crack, bleed and then when DD vomited pink/red vomit, I wouldn't have panicked.

Thank you to the community midwife who left some free samples of Lansinoh. I would have been too tight to buy it muself at £10 a tube and didn't know I could have got it on prescription. Found Kamilosan good for the incredibly itchy, flaky boob skin I got. Free samples are good!!

DD was a "headbanger". She'd latch on perfectly (according to midwives), feed for 2 mins, come off and headbang the boob. Was told later that baby animals often to this to stimulate milk. Was never told it was true in humans.

No one had ever explained to me what nipple shields were for. Only when male GP suggested trying "witches hats"(!?!) and suggested it to help with the headbanging.

Community bf support girl was very nice, but she was fresh off her course, quite young, obviously not had baby/bf experience herself and was quoting out of books. She was good at listening, but no good at practical help (was one of those who thought I had a good latch position).

To my shame, I'd been given the impression that people like LaLeche League were "breastfeeding nazis" who would treat you as a failure if it didn't work. I wish I could have summoned the courage to phone.

I'm rambling and it isn't all bad. Once I got through the 1st 6 weeks or so it got better, although used shields for quite a long time. Bf DD until she was one, when she decided she'd rather bite me. Glad I persevered.

I would've liked someone to show me how to breastfeed in more than one position (I was shown the rugby ball position due to ECS but could never do it any other way after that!)

I also would've liked someone to tell me that baby losing 4 ounces doesn't necessarily mean you have to stop BFing and immediately give formula

Would also like to have known that it was possible to give formula alongside BF instead of cutting out BF altogether.

As you can probably tell I am quite bitter about the lack of support I was given with BFing, I'm glad there are people like you OP to help new mothers with this daunting task.

1. I wish someone had told me that you become engorged on day 3 and it can make you feel as if you've taken 10 steps back. Instead I had a midwife refuse to sign us out to go home "because you're starving your baby" (he'd fed well the day before and had fed 8 times that morning already). Both my baby and the one in the next bed (formula fed) were really grumpy that morning and crying a lot. FF one was allowed to go home. Midwive looked shocked and quickly came over all kindly when she realised that her starving baby comment had been overheard by a bf volunteer standing behind her and suggested I express for a bit and syringe feed. Funny that when bf volunteer had suuggested it 5 mins before. I made a formal complaint about her in the end -bf is hard enough initially without that kind of emotive comment made.I was absolutely devastated and it has stayed with me- even now if we have a period of slow weight gain, I hear her comments. My extra stay triggered blood pressue monitoring which of course went through the roof and I ended up having to stay in hospital 2 extra days.

1. That different midwives/aux have different styles and that as an exhausted new mum, you may have to be very, very assertive about your right to breast feed. I also had the boob stuffed into baby's face and lots of pressure to give formula when it wasn't going perfectly straight away. Then one night shift midwife was fabulous-came to help me in the middle of the night, stayed ages and worked with me on different positions. The two I had on my extra 2 days stay were also brilliant and really supported my bf experience.

1. That pethadine in labour can make for a drowsy happily feeding baby for 2 days and on day 3 when it wears off, it can be hell - and it's not the mother's fault.

Best of luck FourArms, it sound really rewarding and you'll be changing the bf experience of so many women

so many posts I can't read them all so sorry if this replicates ... my experience was -

• it can hurt even with a good latch and a good feeder. really seemed to be a matter of nipples toughening up a bit. fine for the first week, next 10 days the first 10 seconds of each feed were agony (I would clench my free fist and just focus on not passing out ... then we would relax into it and it would be fine) After that it was a breeze

• help for feeding positions with very new baby when you're knackered and want to sleep but are scared of rolling on baby - a mw came into my room in hospital in the early hours, set me up with pillows, raised the side of the bed etc and got us comfy so ds could feed and I could doze. she said she wasn't supposed to do this though.

• more info on mastitis. I got it 4/ 5 weeks in and it was horrific. Woke up, felt ok, went downstairs to get myself a drink, felt a bit odd, nearly passed out on kitchen floor. Alone in house, crawled to phone, rang friend to come round, crawled back to bedroom got into bed with baby, lay freezing cold, shaking, covered in layers. Dread to think what would have happened if I had fainted and hit my head. Of course you can't read everything and don't want to scare people in advance, but it's pretty common and I was lucky to get help from a bf supporter phone line. I worked really hard at getting rid of the infection (had abs too) with hot baths, and literally pushing the infection down the milk ducts and out. Managed not to get a reoccurance because I recognised the symptoms the next time and did the bath / clearing ducts thing asap.

• Support to feed for longer. I fed for 6-7 months and in hindsight wish I had gone longer. had it in my head that 6 months was the "right" cut off point. I didn't want to do extended bf beyong a year but wish I'd kept it up just for a few more months.

Simple facts like

1 The baby's lips should be curled back (this info would have saved me lots of pain)
2 Drink lots to avoid becoming constipated
3 How to hand express (still don't know how to do this!)
4 Use a disposable nappy soaked in hot water and squeezed out as a poultice for sore blocked ducts

i haven't read through all of the responses so apologies if i am repeating what has been said but i do feel quite strongly about this so here goes;

1. before i had ds1 i was under the impression that bf would be fairly easy and pain free. actually, in the early days i think it is incredibly hard. i found it extremely exhausting, incredibly hard work and at times very very painful (i had thrush and mastitis)

1. for me, gentle encouragement was the key. so being told i was doing a great job and to keep going, keep feeding really worked for me. helped me reach a point where it really was a wonderful experience.

1. so much so that i am still breastfeeding 17 month old ds2 and loving it except for the fact that

1. no one tells you that most breast fed babies are abysmal sleepers and the bottle fed babies seem to sleep a whole lot better (in my experience anyway)

good luck with it, an extremely worthwhile and hopefully fulfilling thing to do.

I don't know where to start! I had my first child by c-section eight weeks ago. I had a few blood transfusions as there were complications during the section. When I came round no one mentioned anything to do with feeding until about ten hours later when my husband and I asked about advice on bfeeding. Each midwife I spoke to pulled a face and told me it would be sometime before I could even attempt bfing. Why was this? Was this due to drugs in my system, the fact that I lost loads of blood? Because I was physically unable to move due to various drips and drains in my body?
No-one told me. No-one gave me any help, in fact I had my baby taken off me repeatedly in the first 24 hours whenever the midwives caught me cuddling her. They would take her off me, put in her cot and move the cot away from me so I couldn't reach her. Finally they started feeding her with formula and told me I would get some help with bfing on the post-natal ward (I was on a labour ward for the first day afterwards) I got a bit of help which resulted in her latching on for about a minute, but she wouldn't latch on for longer and it became distressing for both of us. I was never able to bf

I would have liked some help bfding straightaway as despite my milk coming in late, surely I would have had some colostrum available?

I would have liked further help with positioning and holds once my milk came in as I was given no practical help except given bottles of formula to feed her.